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Old June 24th, 2008, 11:16 PM   #441
Indiana Jones
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Indianapolis could handle a few World Cup games. Who cares if there is a Three Tenors Concert? The people are there to watch football, eat, drink and stay somewhere reasonably nice. Indy does that.

FIFA dimensions, the almighty roof, we could lay some grass no problem.



Fly into our new airport.



Supporters with no tickets can watch the game like they do at Euro 08. Monument circle is perfect.



Stay at the 5 star Conrad.



We know international Crowds, hosting a round of the F1 World Championship from 2000-2008 (screw you Bernie and your sanction fee) and now MotoGP in 2009.




Sure Indy isn't NY or LA, but if people get bored they can go to the Orchestra, Theatre, Zoo, Museums or race track. Indy would do a great job hosting a few games if the US was awarded a WC. Just a shameless plug.
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Old June 24th, 2008, 11:44 PM   #442
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Originally Posted by GunnerJacket View Post

Yes, that scenic Dallas - LA bus trip will be a surefire hit with the tourists! Seriously, though, this is what I'm getting at. The US lacks the comparable rail infrastructure and some of the auto trips we're talking about would be too egregious. People don't want to spend the money to fly to the US only to spend 4 days in a Sportage driving up and down I-85. Conversely...
Well in the Northeast, of course there's the Acela, is it - linking Boston, NYC, Philly and DC?

California trying to get its own bullet train between San Diego, LA, San Jose, SF/Oakland and Sacramento. That might be up and running by 2022. Hopefully. Of course, by doing so or flying, they would be missing one of the most breathtaking shore drives in the world -- I'd say even more beautiful than the Amalfi Coast drive -- on PCH 101 up Santa Barbara, San Luis Obispo, Big Sur, Carmel.

So, it's really a matter of choice. ANd with the Aussies and the Euros, they have like 6 weeks vacation to start with, so they really ahve all this time in between Games to dilly-dally. I'm sure many of them would even fly to Mexico or Canada or Cuba in-between matches if they need to kill time. Besides their euros are so much stronger than our $$ right now, so I think the domestic travel expense is the least of their worries. Plus, with an Official Airline partner, WC fans who are staying to the end will probably be gettng some sort of great Freq Flyer bonsues/breaks or the like.

Last edited by rover3; June 24th, 2008 at 11:59 PM.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 01:47 AM   #443
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Yeah, I am not to worried about the Euros and Aussies--with their months of paid vacations.

I reckon that by 2022, the U.S. could have a pretty decent high speed rail network. Particularly on the heavy populated East Coast, West Coast, and even the Midwest. With the way gas prices are going and how much its going to affect the airline industry--I have no doubt that the U.S. will be soon experiencing a second Golden Age of cross country rail travel.

And in regards to Indianapolis, its not that far from Chicago. This is what you could have in the region transportation wise.

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Old June 25th, 2008, 06:27 AM   #444
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A true high speed rail system in this country is long overdue. It is simply a MUST to have now.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 07:46 AM   #445
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xxx

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A true high speed rail system in this country is long overdue. It is simply a MUST to have now.
It still isn't feasible. They can barely get one in California or Florida, and you expect to have a X-country one? Over the airlines' dead bodies. If you want to see the country by rail, you don't have to bullet-train it. Use the slower Amtrak lines. Think of the headaches securing the rails vs. saboteurs -- even more than securing the Alaska pipeline. Ain't gonna fly.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 09:47 AM   #446
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in 14 years, we could see a X country rail system in the USA if the Airlines compamys put there names on them. American Airlines opens American Rail Lines! .......wow, no laugh......at least im funnier then Carrot Top
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Old June 25th, 2008, 09:54 AM   #447
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in 14 years, we could see a X country rail system in the USA if the Airlines compamys put there names on them. American Airlines opens American Rail Lines! .......wow, no laugh......at least im funnier then Carrot Top
hey, dont mess with the Carrot Top



i just had to do it
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Old June 25th, 2008, 10:01 AM   #448
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why is he straining over 30 pounds? I do that easily...and ewwwwwwww

back to soccer....
she scares me.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 11:33 AM   #449
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in 14 years, we could see a X country rail system in the USA if the Airlines compamys put there names on them. American Airlines opens American Rail Lines! .......wow, no laugh......at least im funnier then Carrot Top
That's just not feasible...

It would be much cheaper and much faster to fly from LA to NYC than to take a bullet train. Bullet trains are best for intermediate distances along heavily used corridors (like California, the BosWash corridor, Florida).
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Old June 25th, 2008, 04:10 PM   #450
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Seriously doesn't the US have a half decent rail system? If I知 being honest i reckon this would be a major hindrance of a US WC bid because fans like to get around by rail less hassle then by going by plane. And when you consider how stringent airport security is in the US I think you would see why fans would want to go by rail.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 04:42 PM   #451
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Seriously doesn't the US have a half decent rail system? If I知 being honest i reckon this would be a major hindrance of a US WC bid because fans like to get around by rail less hassle then by going by plane. And when you consider how stringent airport security is in the US I think you would see why fans would want to go by rail.
I don't think they were be getting on by train in Brazil either -- except for the supposed new bullet train service between Rio and Sao Paolo. Well, our country is what it is. If it's good enough for us, then it ought to be good enough for the visitors. They should know that coming in.

They can always charter buses, etc. and see the countryside. If not, well, c'est la vie. But that's NOT going to be the main consideration. You are going to have this same problem in China or Russia.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 05:51 PM   #452
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This thread isn't really the place but isn't it the Teamsters Union the most powerful group against railroads in the USA?

Although people talk about the benefits of a 200mph railroad for passengers the true economic benefit must be in moving cargo around at high speed much more efficiently.

If we revisit this argument at $150/bbl and again at $200/bbl we might see some more movement but right now at $4/gallon it's still not enough to convince powerful people that we need trains.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 06:24 PM   #453
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Erm, I don't think moving cargo at high speed is that important at all. Otherwise, we would yet see hight-speed cargo trains on European Tracks, but we don't. (Except the TGV Postal in France). for most goods it simply doesn't make a difference when it arrives a few hours/days later.
High-speed trains ARE most important for (you would say) medium-distance passenger transports. Regarding the time you need from city centre to the Airport, wait for checking in, etc., it makes much more sense to enter the train at a central station and leave it directly at your destination, so at least in the more populated regions (BosWash, Chicago - Detroit, California), an American HSL is overdue.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 06:27 PM   #454
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Erm, I don't think moving cargo at high speed is that important at all. Otherwise, we would yet see hight-speed cargo trains on European Tracks, but we don't. (Except the TGV Postal in France). for most goods it simply doesn't make a difference when it arrives a few hours/days later.
High-speed trains ARE most important for (you would say) medium-distance passenger transports. Regarding the time you need from city centre to the Airport, wait for checking in, etc., it makes much more sense to enter the train at a central station and leave it directly at your destination, so at least in the more populated regions (BosWash, Chicago - Detroit, California), an American HSL is overdue.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 07:06 PM   #455
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I'm not debunking your thoughts on the Yorks, but I can't agree that LA is "desperate" for a team. They've gone long enough without that many fans are now accustomed. In fact, TV ratings in LA have often been higher since the region is more inclined to get the best match-up of the day as opposed to just the local team. It's really just the owners who want a team there because of the franchise rights that would come along with it. This is also why they'd prefer an expansion if possible, and why we'll likely have to wait several years till another city or three can join LA in the fold (so as to even the number of teams).

- - - - -

I've missed the last few pages. Has there been any consideration for a regionalized WC bid? One comment I hear from some opposing a US bid is the vast space involved that would increase travel costs and time on fans and teams. So perhaps something compartmentalized like:
Bos, NY, Phil, DC,
Pitt, Cleve, Chi, Stl
Miami, Orl, Atl, Nash
A regional bid does make sense, but looking back to 1994, I think the average attendance for matches was above 60,000 people which is damn good. One thing America can boast better than most countries is the diverse and large local populations living here from all over the world. So having everything spread out seemed to work fine back then, no reason that can't work 14 years from now.

Back in 94 they did a goo job and arranging the schedules so each team played 2 games at the same stadium which seemed to work well. One thing that could have been done better is some groups played 2 games in Chicago and then another down in Dallas. It would have made more sense to do 2 in Chicago and 1 in Detroit or vice versa.

Even with the spread out sites thousands of people will come from all over the globe to cheer for their teams. While I don't have numbers, I attended 8 games back in 1994 and there seemed to be large numbers of fans cheering on each team.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 08:29 PM   #456
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A regional bid does make sense, but looking back to 1994, I think the average attendance for matches was above 60,000 people which is damn good. One thing America can boast better than most countries is the diverse and large local populations living here from all over the world. So having everything spread out seemed to work fine back then, no reason that can't work 14 years from now.

Back in 94 they did a goo job and arranging the schedules so each team played 2 games at the same stadium which seemed to work well. One thing that could have been done better is some groups played 2 games in Chicago and then another down in Dallas. It would have made more sense to do 2 in Chicago and 1 in Detroit or vice versa.

Even with the spread out sites thousands of people will come from all over the globe to cheer for their teams. While I don't have numbers, I attended 8 games back in 1994 and there seemed to be large numbers of fans cheering on each team.
U r right. 1994 worked out fine for the most part. Maybe a little tweaking, but we will probably have like 8 brand new stadia for another run at 2018/22. A X-country bullet train ain't gonna happen. Hugely expensive and impractical. They hold their breath every time in France in fear of saboteurs to the rails, how can one secure what, say 5,000 mi of high-speed rail tracks. And with one terrorist or sabotage act, the whole system will grind to a halt or just became a regular train system -- so why even bother to invest what? $3.5 TRILLION to build one? It is just not feasible in a country the width, expanse and pace of the US.

Our cities are where they are. If FIFA doesn't like it, well too bad. You can't replicate the European experience every time. Anyway, the fans have 2 Disneylands to choose from in the US in-between games. They only have 1 Disneypark in Europe.
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Old June 25th, 2008, 09:48 PM   #457
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"If FIFA doesn't like it, well too bad."

And some people think you are arrogant?
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Old June 25th, 2008, 11:03 PM   #458
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Seriously doesn't the US have a half decent rail system? If I知 being honest i reckon this would be a major hindrance of a US WC bid because fans like to get around by rail less hassle then by going by plane. And when you consider how stringent airport security is in the US I think you would see why fans would want to go by rail.
We have AMtrak which is governemnt funded, but the freight lines own almost all the ROW. The AMtrak NE corridor from Boston to DC is the main line with a semi high speed Acela. But we've lost our rail culture in this country for the most part.
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Old June 26th, 2008, 12:26 AM   #459
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I知 not saying rail travel is a deal crasher but it definitely is a factor I just think that visiting fans would prefer to use rail transport because of the stringent security measures at US airports which makes it a stressful and lengthy process getting through the airport security whereseas rail transport is quick and simple at WC 2002 + WC 2006 the rail transport was top notch and Switzerland and Austria won euro 2008 based upon the quality of their rail transport so don稚 think its a non factor. And although Russia and China don稚 have these services at the moment I wouldn't bet against both of them building these services to gain the world cup you have to remember these are to massive economies that are willing to invest to gain. You also have to remember a WC isn't just about the best bid its also about what effect having a WC can have on the hosting nation it has to have some sort of catalyst effect on that nation whether it be in terms of the popularity of the sport or being the needed incentive to improve national infrastructure and stadium infrastructure like we are seeing in South Africa for 2010 and in Brazil for 2014.
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Old June 26th, 2008, 12:47 AM   #460
El Mariachi
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Originally Posted by berkshire royal View Post
Seriously doesn't the US have a half decent rail system? If I知 being honest i reckon this would be a major hindrance of a US WC bid because fans like to get around by rail less hassle then by going by plane. And when you consider how stringent airport security is in the US I think you would see why fans would want to go by rail.
lots of people complain about how slow Amtrak is. Its much easier and cheaper just jumping on an airplane.

But the airline industry is being hurt bad by rising fuel prices. The airline headquartered in my city is cutting jobs and wages in half. Same can be said for many other airlines across the nation.

Rail is the future. Its a no brainer in most regions in the country--especially dense ones like the East Coast, the Great Lakes, Florida, and some places out West.
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