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Old April 17th, 2010, 02:51 PM   #181
HK999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertWalpole View Post
The Community Board's recommendation is advisory and carries no weight. Vornado is very politically connected. This will be built.
i was just about to ask that. so the city council has the final call, hopefully everything goes by plan.
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Old April 17th, 2010, 04:12 PM   #182
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Can't they just maintain the hotel and build the tower above it ore build the tower and built as the foot a replica of the hotel. That has been done already in somewhere NY I believe and in that way both parties are happy.
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Old April 17th, 2010, 11:05 PM   #183
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This looks like a taller/better/stylized Pinnacle building in Nashville (and probably a lot of other buildings). Simple idea with a little extra flair.

image hosted on flickr
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Old April 17th, 2010, 11:36 PM   #184
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It does look like the building in Nashville. That's a beautiful building. Did Pelli design it?

Nashville has beautiful old buildings. I did not know that it has nice new ones too.
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Old April 19th, 2010, 11:53 PM   #185
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http://www.archpaper.com/e-board_rev.asp?News_ID=4441



04.16.2010
Checking Out
Pelli's proposed Vornado tower would topple McKim, Mead & White Hotel Pennsylvania

Pelli Clarke Pelli's new tower would become the second tallest in Midtown if built.
Courtesy VornadoOf the dozens of buildings designed by McKim, Mead & White in New York City, nearly every one has become a protected landmark. One of the few unprotected could soon be headed for the wrecking ball, replaced by an office tower designed by Pelli Clarke Pelli that would surpass every skyscraper in Midtown but the Empire State Building.


Completed on 7th Avenue in 1919, almost a decade after its namesake depot across the street, the Hotel Pennsylvania was the third piece in a McKim, Mead & White trifecta that included Pennsylvania Station and the Farley Post Office. With one of those crown jewels already gone, and another set to be revamped (on February 16, Senator Charles Schumer announced $83 million in stimulus money for Moynihan Station), the Hotel Pennsylvania would be the last original piece of McKim, Mead & White’s work in the area.

Speculation about the hotel’s demise began in the late 1990s, when the Vornado Realty Trust took a controlling stake in the building. The latest plans, for a 1,190-foot-tall office tower, began in earnest two years ago, when Vornado began negotiations with Merrill Lynch to move its headquarters to the tower. The company’s board was set to vote on the matter when the collapse of Lehman Brothers in 2008 effectively killed the deal.

Meanwhile, little was heard from the same preservation groups who decried the destruction of Pennsylvania Station. The Municipal Art Society actually backed the Vornado project, because at the time the developer was working on Moynihan Station. In a statement, MAS President Vin Cipolla acknowledged that the hotel may have “cultural significance” for many New Yorkers. He added, “The Municipal Art Society is taking a comprehensive look at the Far West Side and weighing how any new developments work in conjunction with that new station.”


Because Vornado is not sure how the building will be occupied in the future, it has proposed two layouts, one for an anchor tenant (left) and one for multiple tenants.


Courtesy Vornado
Ultimately, a group of computer hackers who hold their annual convention at the hotel fought hardest for the building. Among them was Gregory Jones, who lobbied numerous politicians and civic groups. “All of them have snubbed out efforts to preserve the hotel,” he said. The local community board did vote for landmark designation, but the Landmarks Preservation Commission declined to hold a public hearing, deeming the hotel a later work exemplary of neither the firm nor the period.

Vornado is now moving ahead with two plans: one tower for an as-yet unknown anchor tenant, and an alternate design to accommodate multiple tenants, both of which were certified by the City Planning Commission on February 8 and will go through the seven-month public review process. Both buildings house roughly two million square feet, or 42.5 percent in excess of current zoning. Boosters point to $100 million in transit improvements, including the reopening of a tunnel between Sixth and Seventh avenues.

A Vornado spokesperson declined to comment except to say that the developer has determined that “now is a good time to go forward with this project.” The community does not think so, however, as the board voted against the project 36-1 last night, despite "a parade of landlords and business" brought out by Vornado, according to the Observer, to sing the project's praises. The person with real clout over the project, City Council Speaker Christine Quinn, told AN she would consider the project and its merits only when it reached her desk in a few months.

Matt Chaban

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Old April 25th, 2010, 04:26 PM   #186
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Nice. I have small preference for the version without podium, but the other looks pretty good as well.
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Old April 25th, 2010, 06:03 PM   #187
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The developer of this tower and the architect alike are clearly mentally disturbed.

To even consider tearing down the historic gem that is Hotel Pennsylvania and replace it with a monolith glass tower is a vile offense, one that should deemed punishable by public stoning.

Some 2500 miles northwest of New York in Vancouver, Canada, developers and architects have worked together to preserve what little historic architecture the city possesses. Homage is given to the structures of yesteryear and modern structures are successfully integrated.

This can be seen with the following two projects currently under construction:


Jameson House


The Georgia





Every New Yorker has a duty to speak up and save the Hotel Pennsylvania from destruction. If you neglect to do so, this building will become nothing more than a distant memory, one which was sadly replaced by another monotonous glass tower of the 21st century.

There ARE successful ways to move forward whilst preserving the past.
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Old April 25th, 2010, 09:46 PM   #188
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no we don't. I don't if you know this or not but we live here, so we have no need for the hotel. I can't wait to it's gone, bye bye hotel penn you rundown piece of crap.
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Old April 25th, 2010, 10:05 PM   #189
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totally agreed, passed by the hotel last month and was shocked in how bad the outside conditions are, especially the lower brighter part of it on 33th street. Just the entrance looks somehow acceptable, about the rest we dont need to speak. The upper part of the hotel where the rooms are looks like a converted prison, the cladding is dirty. nothing appealing can be said about the penn, besides that it has got a relativley good location within Manhattan.
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Old April 26th, 2010, 12:51 AM   #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germantower View Post
totally agreed, passed by the hotel last month and was shocked in how bad the outside conditions are, especially the lower brighter part of it on 33th street. Just the entrance looks somehow acceptable, about the rest we dont need to speak. The upper part of the hotel where the rooms are looks like a converted prison, the cladding is dirty. nothing appealing can be said about the penn, besides that it has got a relativley good location within Manhattan.
The building is in disrepair because it is 90 years and has been neglected. The hotel needs hundreds of millions of dollars of renovations so that it can once again shine as a gem. The Hotel Georgia in Vancouver is a similar building that had been neglected and is now currently undergoing a full renovation and restoration to return it to its full former glory.

http://www.residencesatgeorgia.com/

In 20 years the Empire State Building and the Chrysler building will reach the same age as the Hotel Penn. Without restoration they too will be in a state of disrepair. According to your logic we should tear them down as well.
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Old April 26th, 2010, 12:58 AM   #191
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no because they are real icons, other than this one. I mean, what would be the point to spend millions of $ to restore it? Just for not tearing it down because its old? I mean not every old building has the iconic values like an ESB or Chrysler has, have you ever seen this building with your own eyes Hed?
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Old April 26th, 2010, 01:25 AM   #192
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The Hotel Pennsylvania is nice, but it is absolutely not worth preserving. It's an outdated structure that has been poorly maintained, and when demand for office space in New York returns, the proposed tower will offer just that, in addition to retail space.

That being said, I'm astonished that anyone could find the design of this tower to be monotonous. It's stunning.
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Old April 26th, 2010, 04:23 AM   #193
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Chrysler was the first building over a 1000 feet ESB was the first building with over 100 floor and the fastest skyscraper constructed
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Old April 26th, 2010, 04:24 AM   #194
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The proposed tower is magnificent. However, the hotel should be restored and preserved. It's currently shoddy, but it was once magnificent and could be restored to its grandeur.
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Old April 26th, 2010, 01:26 PM   #195
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forgive me my ignorance, but why they don't keep the hotel and build the tower just a block away?
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Old April 26th, 2010, 01:31 PM   #196
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Maybe because Vornado does'nt own plots/buildings next to the hotel? If i was the developer, i would keep the old structure and build the tower above it, like they did with the hearst just to shut Nimbys mouths, well ok their other argument would than be that the tower is too tall.
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Old April 27th, 2010, 03:24 PM   #197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germantower View Post
Maybe because Vornado does'nt own plots/buildings next to the hotel? If i was the developer, i would keep the old structure and build the tower above it, like they did with the hearst just to shut Nimbys mouths, well ok their other argument would than be that the tower is too tall.
You forgot their third argument: "too much shade on our eco-feel-good-veggie-garden"
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Old April 30th, 2010, 07:58 AM   #198
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And you forget the number one thing, nobody cares about it. Fixing it wont make the small rooms any better and it won't make it better then the better hotel down the street, lets get it out of here already.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 04:20 AM   #199
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yeah, people who want to keep the hotel should go there one more time before its torn down, and then shut up. replacing an old hotel is not a new business. its cool to add these supertalls to midtown...instead of renovating the dilapidated hotel
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Old May 13th, 2010, 02:16 AM   #200
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City Planning had its initial meeting regarding zoning issues for the 15 Penn Plaza plan. See below:


COMPREHENSIVE CITY PLANNING CALENDAR of The City of New York
CITY PLANNING COMMISSION
WEDNESDAY, MAY 12, 2010

PUBLIC HEARINGS OF THE FOLLOWING MATTERS TO BE SCHEDULED FOR WEDNESDAY, MAY 26, 2010

15 PENN PLAZA

BOROUGH OF MANHATTAN
Item Nos. 2, 3, 4, 5 & 6

[All the text HERE in pdf] (Pages 2 - 9)


No. 2: C 100047 ZMM

IN THE MATTER OF an application submitted by 401 Hotel REIT, LLC and 401 Commercial, L.P. pursuant to Sections 197-c and 201 of the New York City Charter for an amendment of the Zoning Map, Section No. 8d by changing from a C6-4.5 District to a C6- 6 District property bounded by West 33rd Street, a line 150 feet westerly of Avenue of the Americas, West 32nd Street, and a line 200 feet easterly of Seventh Avenue- Fashion Avenue, as shown on a diagram (for illustrative purposes only) dated February 8, 2010.

Resolution for adoption scheduling May 26, 2010 for a public hearing.


No. 3: N 100048 ZRM

IN THE MATTER OF an application submitted by 401 Hotel REIT, LLC and 401 Commercial, L.P. pursuant to Sections 197-c and 201 of the New York City Charter for an amendment of the Zoning Resolution of the City of New York, concerning Article VIII, Chapter 1 (Special Midtown District) relating to the applications for modification of height and setback and mandatory plan elements for the 15 Penn Plaza proposal.

81-066 Special permit modifications of Section 81-254, Section 81-40, and certain Sections of Article VII, Chapter 7

***

81-254 Special permit for height and setback modifications

***

81-50 SPECIAL REGULATIONS FOR THE PENN CENTER SUBDISTRICT

***

81-541 Rail mass transit facility improvement


No. 4: C 100049 ZSM

IN THE MATTER OF an application submitted by 401 Hotel REIT, LLC and 401 Commercial, L.P. pursuant to Sections 197-c and 201 of the New York City Charter for the grant of a special permit pursuant to Sections 81-066(b)* and 81-254* of the Zoning Resolution to modify:
1. the height and setback regulations of Section 81-27 (Alternative Height and Setback Regulations- Daylight Evaluation); and
2. the Mandatory District Plan Elements of Sections 81-42 (Retail Continuity along Designated Streets), 81-43 (Street Wall Continuity Along Designated Streets), 81- 45 (Pedestrian Circulation Space), 81-47 (Major Building Entrances), and the design standards for pedestrian circulation spaces of Section 37-53(f) (Sidewalk Widening);

No. 5: C 100050 ZSM

IN THE MATTER OF an application submitted by 401 Hotel REIT, LLC and 401 Commercial, L.P. pursuant to Sections 197-c and 201 of the New York City Charter for the grant of a special permit pursuant to Sections 81-541* and 74-634 of the Zoning Resolution to allow a floor area bonus not to exceed 20 percent of the basic maximum floor area ratio permitted by the underlying district regulations for subway station and/or rail mass transit facility improvements ...


No. 6: C 100237 PQM

IN THE MATTER OF an application submitted by the Department of Citywide Administrative Services, pursuant to Section 197-c of the New York City Charter for the acquisition of easements bounded by Sixth and Seventh avenues, West 32nd and West 33rd streets (Block 808, Lots 40, 1001 and 1002), Borough of Manhattan, Community District 5, to facilitate the construction of transit entrances, a below-ground pedestrian passageway, and other mass transit improvements.

***

NOTICE

On Wednesday, May 26, 2010, at 10:00 a.m., in Spector Hall, at the Department of City Planning, 22 Reade Street, in Lower Manhattan, a public hearing is being held by the City Planning Commission in conjunction with the above ULURP hearing to receive comments related to the 15 Penn Plaza Draft Environmental Impact Statement (DEIS) concerning Amendments to the Zoning Map and the text of the Zoning Resolution (ZR); easement acquisitions; various special permits modifying mandatory District Plan elements as well as height and setback regulations within the Special Midtown District, a floor area bonus in exchange for Subway Station and Rail Mass Transit Facility Improvements, and other related actions, to facilitate the construction of a new commercial office building (known as “15 Penn Plaza”) on the block bounded by Seventh Avenue on the west, Avenue of the Americas on the east, West 33rd Street on the north, and West 32nd and Street on the south (Block 808, Lots 1001 and 1002), located in Manhattan Community District 5.

This hearing is being held pursuant to the State Environmental Quality Review Act (SEQRA) and City Environmental Quality Review (CEQR), CEQR No. 09DCP019M.
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15 penn plaza, hotel pennsylvania, madison square garden, new york, new york project, penn station, vornado

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