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Old August 14th, 2014, 04:45 AM   #1181
Funkyskunk2
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I disagree, it should be insulted. The design is good looking but forgettable and shouldn't be spread all over the world like it is.
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Old August 14th, 2014, 07:23 AM   #1182
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I honestly think that the Hudson yards area needs a "good looking but forgettable" design
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Old August 14th, 2014, 07:56 AM   #1183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarshallKnight View Post
Of the Pelli clones around the world, this would easily rank last in attractiveness -- 2 IFC in HK, Salesforce Tower in SF, and Gran Torre in Chile are all superior. But even if this was an improvement, NY shouldn't settle for another re-hash of the only design Pelli seems capable of, especially in such a prominent location. Back to the drawing board, dude.
It's still far better than this crap, dude.
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Old August 14th, 2014, 08:54 AM   #1184
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..
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Old August 14th, 2014, 01:45 PM   #1185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarshallKnight View Post
Of the Pelli clones around the world, this would easily rank last in attractiveness -- 2 IFC in HK, Salesforce Tower in SF, and Gran Torre in Chile are all superior. But even if this was an improvement, NY shouldn't settle for another re-hash of the only design Pelli seems capable of, especially in such a prominent location. Back to the drawing board, dude.

..
I tend to agree. With 371 meter, this one will be very prominent in the skyline, so it needs a great design.
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Old August 14th, 2014, 03:42 PM   #1186
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This design is not final and will evolve according to this interview by Yimby with Pelli last year.

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(Dec 2013) Interview with the Architect: Rafael Pelli - New York Yimby http://newyorkyimby.com/2013/12/inte...ael-pelli.html

Re: 15 Penn

Well, it's not a complete design; there's a lot remaining to fully design that building. The final one that was approved was set close to Seventh Avenue, and it was a very developed concept from an urban standpoint, in terms of city planning. They wanted to know how the height and mass would interact with the city, what the set-backs would be like, and how it would affect the site. Really, how it affects the city from the outside- but as a worked-out building on the inside, there’s a lot to be determined, and that’s going to depend on the tenant. If this ends up being for a financial institution, it’ll be one kind of building; if it's for a big software company, it'll be another kind of building. And it's going to evolve; it will be refined further depending on tenancy.

I'm sure it'll evolve in ways I can't fully anticipate right now, but what we have today is just an elegant concept. I think it would be a beautiful skyline presence as a tapered form, but in a more contemporary way. But there's still a lot of work to do.
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Old August 14th, 2014, 07:40 PM   #1187
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Yeah, look, I'm not honestly holding my breath for something wildly better unless the architect gets changed (I'd expect something appropriately iconic in this spot from, say, SHoP, maybe Richard Rogers or Renzo Piano, a few others...) but I do hope that Pelli's refinements at least make it the best looking of the bunch. The best medicine might just be to make it taller, stretch out that fat stump of a design into something a little more slender.
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Old August 15th, 2014, 03:13 AM   #1188
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I would not miss the Hotel Pennsylvania

but I would miss the Empire State Building, which was looking especially good today.
Looking east from the Penn plaza area along the W 33rd street canyon, Hotel (Sh)Pennsylvania/whatever-it's-called-now on right, ESB in background to left:

8.14.2014, beautiful afternoon
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Old August 18th, 2014, 10:09 PM   #1189
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Leave the bold designs to China?

That's a rather defeatist attitude.
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Old August 18th, 2014, 10:42 PM   #1190
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Leave the bold designs to China?

That's a rather defeatist attitude.
Considering that this tower is basically the same as HK's tallest, that statement isn't completely true. Also, SF is going wild over a scaled down version if 15 Penn.
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Old August 20th, 2014, 05:34 AM   #1191
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The design of this tower is nothing special really - just another Pelli clone. It will surely block ESB and it is a shame to see Penn hotel gone. I think it and also Roosevelt hotel is part of history of NYC worth saving. Not every corner should be modern glass and towers. It is more than enough of glass buildings that look absolutely the same in this city.
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Old August 20th, 2014, 07:23 AM   #1192
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Quote:
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The design of this tower is nothing special really - just another Pelli clone. It will surely block ESB and it is a shame to see Penn hotel gone. I think it and also Roosevelt hotel is part of history of NYC worth saving. Not every corner should be modern glass and towers. It is more than enough of glass buildings that look absolutely the same in this city.
I'd emphasize saving the Roosevelt over the Hotel Pennsylvania but I don't want the Pelli design to be the ultimate choice because I have seen that it's a copycat and for a new century, a new millennium if you're going to challenge the ESB (which I have no problem in itself.. it's ludicrous to believe the ESB alone must stand above others in the area for perpetuity especially with so many towers coming to the West Side and to the Midtown/ Central Park area) It HAS to be a design worthy of being a modern New York City icon, an original instead a variation of a style that has several times been represented by Pelli. It's an insult if it doesn't celebrate a New York vision but instead is a knockoff... nice but nowhere near what this city deserves.
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Old August 20th, 2014, 09:41 AM   #1193
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Well put citybooster!!!
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Old August 20th, 2014, 09:25 PM   #1194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnFlint1985 View Post
The design of this tower is nothing special really - just another Pelli clone. It will surely block ESB and it is a shame to see Penn hotel gone. I think it and also Roosevelt hotel is part of history of NYC worth saving. Not every corner should be modern glass and towers. It is more than enough of glass buildings that look absolutely the same in this city.
The penn hotel is not in good shape, and not many parties would put up the requisite funds unless there is substantial long term future in terms of its revenue generation abilities.

If that doesn't happen, the hotel in its current condition is better demolished. As of its current condition, it is not fit to be part of a vibrant and developing area of midtown, at such a strategic location.
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Old August 20th, 2014, 11:03 PM   #1195
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Calling this a Pelli clone I don't think really acknowledges the history / diversity of skyscraper architecture. lots of buildings have had tapering crowns. I think this design is meant to be more of a reference to the ESB by beginning the curve of the crown right around the setbacks of the crown of ESB and by mirroring the ESB with that long line down the center. That being said I agree with most of the opinions on here. It's a pretty sub-par design.
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Old August 20th, 2014, 11:10 PM   #1196
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If it was a different architect, I probably wouldn't call it a "Pelli clone," because yes, he's hardly the first person to do a tapering skyscraper. But I mean the term in the Orphan Black sense -- as if Pelli were a scientist who'd made a batch of genetically identical beings, then dressed them up in different clothes in order to pass them off as individuals:


It's really just my way of saying the dude could stand to be more imaginative, especially when he's been gifted such an iconic spot.
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Old August 21st, 2014, 03:56 PM   #1197
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Quote:
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I hear Lehman Bros. is interested in leasing a section of the new tower, but because of their current situation, not to mention their plummeting share price, the chances of this happening grow smaller everyday.

Thanks: that made me chuckle.

Also made for a a good book & movie "Too big to fail".

Which brings us, ~6 years after the Chapter 11 bankruptcy of Lehman Bros (745 7th Ave opened in 2001, 16 blocks north of the Hotel Shpennsylvania), to our current construction boom in NYC.
Who is financing all these site acquisitions, renderings, architects, building loans??
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Old August 28th, 2014, 08:03 PM   #1198
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A couple of interesting things filed last week with Dept of Planning land use application system to note for 15 Penn.

1) Seeks FAR bonus for subway and transportation facility improvements

2) Renewal to modify height and setback requirements to construct a commercial building which was approved back in 2010.

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Old August 28th, 2014, 08:37 PM   #1199
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Great news, VG!
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Old August 28th, 2014, 09:20 PM   #1200
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moving ahead.
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