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Old May 11th, 2017, 03:28 PM   #1301
TheProdigySkylined
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It's too close to the Empire State Building.
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Old May 11th, 2017, 03:41 PM   #1302
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I always found that building grostesque and truly not in the right place.
Nothing of such a size should be built in the East / West line of the Empire State Bldg. It's really a shame to not save that NYC symbol alone on the first line of the midtown.

Build everything u want behind it but please not on the same line... It's gonna ruin the whole aspect that make it so New York.

Plus the fact that in a period where New York is getting the thinest skyscrapers on earth, please don't build such a massive one.. no no
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Old May 11th, 2017, 10:35 PM   #1303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parisian75 View Post
I always found that building grostesque and truly not in the right place.
Nothing of such a size should be built in the East / West line of the Empire State Bldg. It's really a shame to not save that NYC symbol alone on the first line of the midtown.

Build everything u want behind it but please not on the same line... It's gonna ruin the whole aspect that make it so New York.

Plus the fact that in a period where New York is getting the thinest skyscrapers on earth, please don't build such a massive one.. no no
New York isnt defined by one narrow little viewing angle. Besides, with the Hudson Yards well underway that view angle of the Empire State Building is already gone. There is really nothing wrong with the location of this proposal.
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Old May 11th, 2017, 11:50 PM   #1304
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New York isnt defined by one narrow little viewing angle. Besides, with the Hudson Yards well underway that view angle of the Empire State Building is already gone. There is really nothing wrong with the location of this proposal.

ESB is used for many establishing shots of NYC and this building will ruin that. Why can't it be half the height? Better still it would look better replacing one or two of Hudson Yard's dull towers.

This shouldn't be allowed. Praying it will never happen.

I hope one day they can find a way of raising both the Empire State and the Chrysler.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 01:52 AM   #1305
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ESB is used for many establishing shots of NYC and this building will ruin that. Why can't it be half the height? Better still it would look better replacing one or two of Hudson Yard's dull towers.

This shouldn't be allowed. Praying it will never happen.

I hope one day they can find a way of raising both the Empire State and the Chrysler.
If you don't want it to happen, you're free to purchase every single building surrounding the ESB in a 10 block radius.

City Council already approved this. In it's current form, this could start tomorrow.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 01:58 AM   #1306
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It is the nature of the city. Eventually everything that grows towards the sky gets eclipsed.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 06:17 AM   #1307
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Honestly it's how real estate in the city works it is dynamic not static.
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"The scale is Roman and will have to be sustained."
- Charles Follen McKim (In a letter to a friend concerning the design of Penn Station)
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Old May 12th, 2017, 06:23 AM   #1308
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It is the nature of the city. Eventually everything that grows towards the sky gets eclipsed.
Other cities have laws preserving sight lines that seem to coexist with growth. Those laws are probably less suitable for NYC (at least Manhattan) but I still think it's possible to grow and preserve certain aspects of the skyline.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 06:27 AM   #1309
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NEW YORK | 15 Penn Plaza | 371m | 1216ft | 68 fl | On Hold

Eventually, maybe but right now office space will be needed especially with the Brexit and the move of many financial operations to NY
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Old May 12th, 2017, 06:37 AM   #1310
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I'm not so sure. There's a ton of office space coming online in HY, Brooklyn, etc. Plus most of the bank operations leaving London will move to other EU cities since the whole point of leaving was over EU-market access.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 06:41 AM   #1311
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Quote:
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I'm not so sure. There's a ton of office space coming online in HY, Brooklyn, etc. Plus most of the bank operations leaving London will move to other EU cities since the whole point of leaving was over EU-market access.


Well banks will move their intra-Euro operations to either Frankfurt or Paris but the global operations will move to NY.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 07:28 AM   #1312
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I can't see another major office building being viable this cycle in Midtown. There's going to be a huge amount of space coming back (at least 3m square feet) from companies moving to Hudson Yards and Manhattan West and 1 Vanderbilt is largely not pre-leased. Any movement from London will be minimal; global ops will likely remain there with departments moving to EU locations as needed. Moving thousands of employees to another country or shifting operations is incredibly expensive and there simply isn't the latent employment in New York or any major city at this point in the economic cycle.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 07:31 AM   #1313
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It would only block one of the narrow sides of Empire State Building and those sides are not very iconic. The important angles are the ones where the wide sides are at least partly visible. The best view is from Top of the Rock.

I can still remember when Empire State Building was one of the tallest buildings in the world. At some point in the next ten to fifteen years or so it will drop out of the Top 100 and maybe out of the Top 10 in New York City alone. So it will simply not be tall enough to be visible from all angles.

Maybe it should get a taller brother: The same style, the same facade materials, but at least 500 metres tall.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 08:01 AM   #1314
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Quote:
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It would only block one of the narrow sides of Empire State Building and those sides are not very iconic. The important angles are the ones where the wide sides are at least partly visible. The best view is from Top of the Rock.
The bigger issue for me is not the views but the proximity. ESB has always kind of stuck out on its own a little removed from the midtown cluster, and 15 Penn is uncomfortably close. And while the view from Rockefeller is maybe the most iconic, it would still be a shame to lose the views from Hudson County.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 08:17 AM   #1315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodegavendetta View Post
The bigger issue for me is not the views but the proximity. ESB has always kind of stuck out on its own a little removed from the midtown cluster, and 15 Penn is uncomfortably close. And while the view from Rockefeller is maybe the most iconic, it would still be a shame to lose the views from Hudson County.
At least there will still be the views across the East River from Brooklyn and Queens.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 01:19 PM   #1316
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Manhattan has a lack of space for skyscrapers, Some are already so close that they block most of each others views like 4 Times Square and the Bank of America Tower for example. It would be a waste of space to block half a mile or even more around Emprire State Building just to preserve views towards the tower.

I can understand the desire to forbid skyscrapers around it though. The most beautiful skyscrapers I ever saw in person are the Petronas Towers. They used to be visible from almost anywhere in the city, but now more and more tall buildings are built close to them. Right next to them a 343 tower (Four Seasons) for example. A really boring looking building. Across the small park they are even planning a tower that will dwarf Petronas Towers and very much destroy their presence in the skyline. Still, a few viewing angles will be preserved forever.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 01:40 PM   #1317
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Well ESB will change from the Eiffel Tower of New York to a tower that's part of a cluster. It should do as great at the latter as it does at the former.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 03:12 PM   #1318
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Old May 12th, 2017, 03:22 PM   #1319
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheIllinoisan View Post
New York isnt defined by one narrow little viewing angle. Besides, with the Hudson Yards well underway that view angle of the Empire State Building is already gone. There is really nothing wrong with the location of this proposal.
Urban planning is NOT an narrow angle... it's just a question of global consistency and avoiding an urban mess as u see in Middle East and most of new cities in Asia..

I was kind of skeptical for Hudson Yards personnally. I now found it nice. But this "in my humble opinion" should be the only exception...

Building towers everywhere will not save what makes NYC specificity. Yes you can choose to build everywhere without any attention to save what makes a city recognizable... So yes you can hide the ESB with soulless and fade buildings...
As we say "focus on quality instead of quantity". 15 Penn Station is just a simple glassy s**t, close to an iconic 30s Art Deco building...

It's a European opinion yes... and I think here is the BIG difference btw europeans and americans in terms of townplanning and cities organization... What definetly don't impeach cities to develop and get more and more modern ones.

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Old May 12th, 2017, 03:42 PM   #1320
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yankeesfan1000 View Post
If you don't want it to happen, you're free to purchase every single building surrounding the ESB in a 10 block radius.

City Council already approved this. In it's current form, this could start tomorrow.

I know that but hopefully it will be scaled down. Though saying that there are a couple of very tall buildings proposed for the east side of the Empire State Building.
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