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View Poll Results: What city has the best Transportation System?
New York City Metro Area, USA 87 8.90%
Chicago, USA 16 1.64%
Washington D.C, USA 10 1.02%
Los Angeles, USA 8 0.82%
Seattle, USA 2 0.20%
Atlanta, USA 6 0.61%
Dallas Fort Worth Metro, USA 10 1.02%
Toronto, Canada 17 1.74%
Berlin, Germany 45 4.60%
Frankfurt, Germany 14 1.43%
Amsterdam, Netherlands 18 1.84%
Vienna, Austria 40 4.09%
London, UK 106 10.84%
Edinburgh, Scotland 1 0.10%
Moscow, Russia 25 2.56%
Dublin, Ireland 2 0.20%
Paris, France 78 7.98%
Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia 12 1.23%
Tokyo/Osaka, Japan 148 15.13%
Hong Kong/Shenzhen, China 52 5.32%
Bejing, China 1 0.10%
Shanghai, China 21 2.15%
Singapore, Singapore 24 2.45%
Barcelona, Spain 6 0.61%
Madrid, Spain 101 10.33%
Mumbai/New Delhi, India 10 1.02%
Melbourne, Australia 7 0.72%
Sydney, Austrailia 4 0.41%
Seol, South Korea 10 1.02%
Others 97 9.92%
Voters: 978. You may not vote on this poll

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Old April 1st, 2010, 01:37 PM   #301
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I might be a bit biased but I voted for London, mainly considering the nitty gritty details. Was contemplating Tokyo - although the network coverage and operational quality of their trains are second to none the overcrowding put me off completely, and they don't have a decent bus network. Paris also has very good rail systems but most bus routes stop at 2000hrs. Beijing and Shanghai will have very extensive state-of-the-art rail systems before long but there are a lot to catch up on. To date bus systems are erratic; stop locations and general management leave a lot to be desired. Admittedly If I inspected the list more carefully I might have voted for HK but the absence of unlimited-travel tickets is a let down (and merging it with Shenzhen isn't really a good idea IMO). My emphasis on buses might be a bit old-fashioned, but whether it's 'the last km' or 'the lowest common denominator' they are important.
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Old April 1st, 2010, 02:13 PM   #302
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Tokyo is ranked the 5th in the world, London's the best.


ABBA_Master posted the statistics somewhere (though not sure a credible source or not).



Too Chaotic and Massive, since everyone plans only for themselves.


Just a matter of the feel, whether it's a tiny or huge, important or unimportant transportation system.
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Old April 1st, 2010, 05:00 PM   #303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
I might be a bit biased but I voted for London, mainly considering the nitty gritty details. Was contemplating Tokyo - although the network coverage and operational quality of their trains are second to none the overcrowding put me off completely, and they don't have a decent bus network. Paris also has very good rail systems but most bus routes stop at 2000hrs. Beijing and Shanghai will have very extensive state-of-the-art rail systems before long but there are a lot to catch up on. To date bus systems are erratic; stop locations and general management leave a lot to be desired. Admittedly If I inspected the list more carefully I might have voted for HK but the absence of unlimited-travel tickets is a let down (and merging it with Shenzhen isn't really a good idea IMO). My emphasis on buses might be a bit old-fashioned, but whether it's 'the last km' or 'the lowest common denominator' they are important.
Have you been to Tokyo? I've never heard of the bus system not being adequate. Overcrowding is only during rush hour and even then trains come almost everysingle minute unless if you're thinking of the 1992 videos everyone loves to post (of the guys in white gloves pushing people into the train [and btw Yokohama and other cities are just as good as Tokyo with less people]). These "city vs city" threads are not allowed for a reason, everyone just votes for their own city.
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Old April 1st, 2010, 07:12 PM   #304
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Tokyo buses are good but only for the last km - there are no trunk bus services to supplement the rail lines.
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Old April 1st, 2010, 09:53 PM   #305
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Why would there be? There might be a need for such in London, where the rail network has good coverage, but trains run at lower frequencies and have lower capacities, so buses can and do provide a critical supplementary role.

But the rail network in Tōkyō has extremely good coverage (like London) AND is very frequent and high-capacity. Plus, given the poor conditions of local streets in Japan (extremely narrow, congested, slow), buses don't stand much of a chance, even on relatively short trips... A feeder bus structure, where buses serve primarily traffic going to and from rail stations where passengers then switch to / from trains, is much more efficient in Tōkyō's case.
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Old April 1st, 2010, 11:34 PM   #306
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I suppose it's a matter of opinion. However there's no doubt Tokyo's trains are still overcrowded/oversaturated (even though not at 90s levels), and certain sections of the society (children, the elderly and mobilty impaired) would surely benefit from a surface system that offers medium-distance door-to-door services where you are much more likely to get a seat? Also Tokyo's streets are no narrower or less passable than London's.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 01:17 AM   #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
I might be a bit biased but I voted for London, mainly considering the nitty gritty details. Was contemplating Tokyo - although the network coverage and operational quality of their trains are second to none the overcrowding put me off completely, and they don't have a decent bus network. Paris also has very good rail systems but most bus routes stop at 2000hrs. Beijing and Shanghai will have very extensive state-of-the-art rail systems before long but there are a lot to catch up on. To date bus systems are erratic; stop locations and general management leave a lot to be desired. Admittedly If I inspected the list more carefully I might have voted for HK but the absence of unlimited-travel tickets is a let down (and merging it with Shenzhen isn't really a good idea IMO). My emphasis on buses might be a bit old-fashioned, but whether it's 'the last km' or 'the lowest common denominator' they are important.
Have you been to Singapore?
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 02:57 AM   #308
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Everyone has their own personal opinion . But I really think Tokyo (and Japan) are severely under estimated on this (urban) website. I have never heard of another city as large as Tokyo with such a superb subway, above ground rail, high speed rail etc that is so clean, efficient, safe, coverage and quiet. But then again the majority of people here just voted for their own city..

In my opinion the best systems are Tokyo (along with Yokohama and Osaka metro), Hong Kong and Singapore.
Best in Europe: London
Best in USA: Washington Metro with NYC a very close second (I put washington DC metro above NYC because it's newer, cleaner and more advanced though it's nowhere near as extensive whatsoever as NYC).
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 03:32 AM   #309
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I am not going into an argument of which is the best since it is very much subjective.
I will post a link to show that the Tokyo Bus system within the 23 special wards(23 ku) is very much capable and extensive as some may not have a grasp of it.

http://ssrs.at.infoseek.co.jp/tyomebus.htm
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 03:58 AM   #310
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 04:33 AM   #311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
certain sections of the society (children, the elderly and mobilty impaired) would surely benefit from a surface system that offers medium-distance door-to-door services where you are much more likely to get a seat?
You seem to be under the impression that there is no bus service in Tōkyō, but the bus network is extensive on its own. Most people just don't know it because nobody says anything and the rail network is that much more critical. And yes, there is parallel bus / subway service on corridors within central Tōkyō. The "last kilometer" phenomenon you talk about is for trips out to the burbs, where there really is no need to be taking buses, as the train lines radiating out do that job much more efficiently. And even then, there will be buses that go far out into the burbs, operated by a combination of private railway and bus companies and the Tōkyō government.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 12:26 PM   #312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuraiBlue View Post
I am not going into an argument of which is the best since it is very much subjective.
I will post a link to show that the Tokyo Bus system within the 23 special wards(23 ku) is very much capable and extensive as some may not have a grasp of it.

http://ssrs.at.infoseek.co.jp/tyomebus.htm
Thanks for the link. Within the centre network coverage and route lengths are indeed better than I envisaged. What are the frequencies like? I take it this map only shows routes operated by certain companies? It looks as though there are whole neighbourhoods without immediate access to bus routes, but there must be other operators providing local services? Thanks.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 01:32 PM   #313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
Thanks for the link. Within the centre network coverage and route lengths are indeed better than I envisaged. What are the frequencies like? I take it this map only shows routes operated by certain companies? It looks as though there are whole neighbourhoods without immediate access to bus routes, but there must be other operators providing local services? Thanks.
To my knowledge within the JR Yamanote line, Toei is the only bus operator.
Going outwards from the Yamanote, there are numerous operators(basically all the private train operators own a bus division).
Frequency depends route by route but probably around 5 min. peak time and 15~30 min off peak.

I believe you will notice a hole next to the Otemachi district, that is the Palace so no buses (nor metro for that matter) runs through it.
There are also alot of parks like Yoyogi Koen, Shinjuku gyoen, Akasaka Gosho and so on that does not have roads.

Last edited by SamuraiBlue; April 2nd, 2010 at 01:37 PM.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 03:33 PM   #314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuraiBlue View Post
To my knowledge within the JR Yamanote line, Toei is the only bus operator.
Going outwards from the Yamanote, there are numerous operators(basically all the private train operators own a bus division).
Frequency depends route by route but probably around 5 min. peak time and 15~30 min off peak.

I believe you will notice a hole next to the Otemachi district, that is the Palace so no buses (nor metro for that matter) runs through it.
There are also alot of parks like Yoyogi Koen, Shinjuku gyoen, Akasaka Gosho and so on that does not have roads.
I was looking at large areas of districts like Edogawa (mainly the eastern side), Nakano and Setagaya, which are clearly densely populated districts but have a very sparse surface transport network. It seems as though a lot of houses would be as much as 1 km from the nearest station without any bus connection, which I find pretty hard to believe.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 03:53 PM   #315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
I was looking at large areas of districts like Edogawa (mainly the eastern side), Nakano and Setagaya, which are clearly densely populated districts but have a very sparse surface transport network. It seems as though a lot of houses would be as much as 1 km from the nearest station without any bus connection, which I find pretty hard to believe.
All the districts you had mentioned are outside of the Yamanote line.
As you had pointed out, this map only represents the routes for the Toei bus system and it would be a daunting task(if not impossible) to map out all the routes for all the bus operators within Tokyo.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 04:15 PM   #316
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Quote:
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All the districts you had mentioned are outside of the Yamanote line.
As you had pointed out, this map only represents the routes for the Toei bus system and it would be a daunting task(if not impossible) to map out all the routes for all the bus operators within Tokyo.
Thanks I see. Is there a central body coordinating public transport within Greater Tokyo and how well are things such as ticketing and information integrated? With regards to mapping, official universal maps such as this (more can be found here) would really help residents and visitors IMHO. Sorry about this long stream of questions, but the answers you've provided so far are really appreciated.
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Old April 2nd, 2010, 04:32 PM   #317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
Thanks I see. Is there a central body coordinating public transport within Greater Tokyo and how well are things such as ticketing and information integrated? With regards to mapping, official universal maps such as this (more can be found here) would really help residents and visitors IMHO. Sorry about this long stream of questions, but the answers you've provided so far are really appreciated.
For your first question, No not that I am aware of.
Second ticketing I think it is regulated by law and market.
Pasmo and Suica can be used at all transit system within the Kanto area including buses.
As for route maps and or related information, you'll need to check each private bus operators for that information since I do not think any single entity compiles it into a single source.
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Old April 19th, 2010, 02:59 AM   #318
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London & Paris biased.


Singapore, Hong Kong and Shanghai are also my fav.
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Old April 19th, 2010, 03:50 PM   #319
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- spacious, not overcrowded and generally pleasant experience when riding to any destination in the town.

Also, Singapore's got a great bus service and, not least, a truly fantastic (both in terms of service quality AND value) taxi service which will get you in no time to any part of the city via the vast motorway network or even regular city streets which are never congested anyway.
Well, I regret to say its not exactly so. Singapore MRT trains nowadays are full and frequently overcrowded. Especially early morning hours, when I go to school, are painful since they are running at off-peak frequencies and crowds are already massive. Speed is also far from adequate on longer distances as there are no skip-stop lines (like NYC) or commuter rail (like RER) though the city itself is quite big. Roads are also congested in the morning and evening and bus rides are mostly painfully slow.

Generally, Singapore's public transport, IMHO, isn't anywhere close to the world's best which is quite accurately reflected in this survey... I myself refrained from voting simply because I haven't been to enough of the listed cities, but currently, by far the best public transit I ever took was in Hong Kong.
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Old April 20th, 2010, 11:19 AM   #320
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Many cities would kill to have what Singapore has though, Simon91. I can understand entirely what you're saying but a modern, reliable, safe and comprehensive system is what many cities would kill for!
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