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Old September 11th, 2013, 05:28 AM   #2861
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Any news on line 11 extension additional rolling stock?
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Old September 11th, 2013, 09:28 PM   #2862
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Old September 11th, 2013, 10:01 PM   #2863
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Night City Dream_ View Post
I can count Tokyo rail lines right because headways there are comparable to metro headways (no more than 10 minutes).
No more than ten minutes for inner city parts of the line, trains having enough doors for small dwelling time, quick boarding and leaving with simultanous height of platform and train and of cause electric power supply. Dedicated tracks or at least a timetable with strict intervals.
That makes a real urban-rail transit and is the difference between commuter-service.
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Old September 11th, 2013, 10:09 PM   #2864
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erase
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Old September 13th, 2013, 09:02 AM   #2865
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Line 11 Xujiahui Station (opened Aug 31)



--shmetro
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Old September 19th, 2013, 09:55 AM   #2866
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September 18
Shanghai metro creates new daily ridership high of 8.672 million

Top 5 lines (in millions):

Line 2: 1.62
Line 1: 1.335
Line 4: 0.882
Line 8: 0.879
Line 9: 0.811

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Last edited by big-dog; September 19th, 2013 at 11:20 AM.
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Old September 19th, 2013, 12:11 PM   #2867
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Will soon beat up Moscow!
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Old September 19th, 2013, 03:57 PM   #2868
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it's boosted by the holiday (Mid-Autumn Festival on Sep-19). Can I know Moscow's number?
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Old September 19th, 2013, 10:27 PM   #2869
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Quote:
Originally Posted by big-dog View Post
it's boosted by the holiday (Mid-Autumn Festival on Sep-19). Can I know Moscow's number?
6.73 million per day as of 2012

Source

Shanghai's metro apparently hovering at around 7 million per day in 2013, but is expected to reach 7.5 million per day by the end of 2013
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Old September 20th, 2013, 02:34 AM   #2870
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Quote:
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6.73 million per day as of 2012

Source
That's pretty efficient for its metro length and city population. Shanghai metro has potentials and plenty of room to improve.
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Old September 20th, 2013, 02:56 AM   #2871
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Quote:
Originally Posted by big-dog View Post
That's pretty efficient for its metro length and city population. Shanghai metro has potentials and plenty of room to improve.
ya something that nags me is how "low" ridership on the Shanghai Metro is. I mean for their length, Guangzhou and Beijing are going through the roof.
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Old September 20th, 2013, 03:17 AM   #2872
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Shanghai started a new bus running map this week. Almost all bus routes are adjusted. Many are cancelled to encourage people taking metros. Hope this can help ease ground traffic and improve metro ridership.
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Old September 20th, 2013, 04:17 AM   #2873
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That makes sense. Buses should be used to fill the gaps the metro doesn't cover. They should avoid overlap.
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Old September 20th, 2013, 04:21 AM   #2874
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Quote:
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That makes sense. Buses should be used to fill the gaps the metro doesn't cover. They should avoid overlap.
Unless its Line 6 or 8 in that case overlap has much as possible
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Old September 20th, 2013, 06:02 AM   #2875
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Quote:
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That's pretty efficient for its metro length and city population. Shanghai metro has potentials and plenty of room to improve.
That is what I said many times. Shanghai has got large intervals while Moscow can boast 85-90 seconds between trains during rush hour. Then, dwelling time in Shanghai is way too long. Especially a lot of time is wasted before opening the doors and after closing. This seriously decreases average speed.
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Old September 21st, 2013, 11:45 PM   #2876
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Cutting buses won't do anything to increase Metro patronage.

Shanghai's Metro has 3 shortcomings
A) lack of rolling stock - this is due to consistent high demand from new lines and from systems in other parts of China - not much you can do now but the situation should ease eventually
B) signalling headway - current signalling systems can apparently only achieve a minimum headway of 2.5 minutes (Lines 3/4) or 3 minutes (most other lines). I'd loved to be proved wrong on this, but current frequencies on the busiest lines are a far cry from the 30-33tph achieved on many European systems.
C) first and last trains - surely, I mean surely, they can keep running trains until 0130 (~0030 last departure from central areas)

Until those 3 major capacity constraints are resolved it is extremely irresponsible to reduce bus services which are also full and standing during peaks.
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Old September 22nd, 2013, 07:32 AM   #2877
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
Cutting buses won't do anything to increase Metro patronage.

Shanghai's Metro has 3 shortcomings
A) lack of rolling stock - this is due to consistent high demand from new lines and from systems in other parts of China - not much you can do now but the situation should ease eventually
B) signalling headway - current signalling systems can apparently only achieve a minimum headway of 2.5 minutes (Lines 3/4) or 3 minutes (most other lines). I'd loved to be proved wrong on this, but current frequencies on the busiest lines are a far cry from the 30-33tph achieved on many European systems.
C) first and last trains - surely, I mean surely, they can keep running trains until 0130 (~0030 last departure from central areas)

Until those 3 major capacity constraints are resolved it is extremely irresponsible to reduce bus services which are also full and standing during peaks.
Why no ban private cars you can force people to use the metro? Normal people that work in offices or shops and that don't need a car due to work shouldn't be allowed to buy a car or licence plate. I see so many cars that only have one person inside and then drive across Shanghai to park their car in some central parkin house. They acn use the metro instead!
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Old September 22nd, 2013, 12:44 PM   #2878
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There are two separate things here.

First thing - the Metro has no spare capacity during peaks - this problem needs resolving through more rolling stock and improved signalling headway and dwell times.

Second thing - road capacity needs to be better utilised - this can be achieved by diverting demand into the Metro, but only when Metro capacity is increased. In addition yes the use of the private car should certainly be discouraged, a central Shanghai 0600-2000 congestion charge is long overdue.
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Old September 22nd, 2013, 01:16 PM   #2879
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Improving headways would help only the vicinity of metro stations. Some origins would be inconveniently far from a station to walk there, so that the passengers originating there would still be tempted to own a car.

Building more metro lines, to serve spots between existing lines and stations, would decrease demand for cars and also decrease the loads on existing, currently full metro lines.
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Old September 22nd, 2013, 07:02 PM   #2880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCT View Post
B) signalling headway - current signalling systems can apparently only achieve a minimum headway of 2.5 minutes (Lines 3/4) or 3 minutes (most other lines). I'd loved to be proved wrong on this, but current frequencies on the busiest lines are a far cry from the 30-33tph achieved on many European systems.
Lines 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 13 and soon 12, 16 are equipped with CBTC systems that can support headways of as low as 90 seconds.

Lines 6, 7, 8, 9, 11 use THALES SelTrac and lines 10, 12, 13, 16 use ALSTOM Urbalis.
THALES SelTrac Source
ALSTOM Urbalis Source
More Sauce

The big issue is in lines 1-5, built in an era where moving block systems were expensive and China has no experience with them. The fixed block systems on these lines can only reduce to 2.5 min of headway. The worst off is Lines 3/4 where the non-interlined sections can only reach 5 min of headway.

So really apart from pigheadedness of issue C; the only real issue is A, the lack of rolling stock. Regardless if lines 1-5 have old signaling systems the actual level of service on these lines (apart from line 3/4) is far from the max the system can handle. Of course, its pretty obvious for lines 6-11 that they are far from running at 90 sec headways (40 tph).

Last edited by saiho; September 22nd, 2013 at 07:29 PM. Reason: sources
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