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Old January 29th, 2013, 09:50 PM   #541
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Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
The problem is the size of the streets.
There are only small streets in the area, no main and wide street linking Place de la Garde to Clamart station (Transilien N, Grand Paris Express red line).
Not even any big enough for one of the tracks? As in, having the northbound tracks on one street and the southbound ones on the next street over...

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Me too and I am french.
At least I have the handy excuse of never having studied French
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Old January 29th, 2013, 09:50 PM   #542
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Are we looking at a full-blown tram line or a Translohr line here? Seeing as it interchanges with the Translohr T6 then interoperability would make some sense. Then again the use of a totally incompatible system for T5 and T6 is a complete mystery to me.
I don't know but normally, it should be a normal tram.
The tram T6 and Antony - Clamart tram will be segregated.
At Hopital Béclère the two lines will be at two different level.

Orange: T6
Purple: Antony - Clamart tram
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Old January 30th, 2013, 10:05 AM   #543
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Then again the use of a totally incompatible system for T5 and T6 is a complete mystery to me.
Don't you mean T5 and T1 (which will almost intersect)?
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Old January 30th, 2013, 12:58 PM   #544
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Kind of - what I mean is it seems illogical to me to use the Translohr system for T5 and T6 when Paris already has a growing network of tram lines. It precludes any future running between those two lines and the rest of the network. Who knows how much the tram system might grow over coming decades? Building two lines to be totally incompatible seems very peculiar. I don't dislike Translohr as a system; it's a nice cheap alternative for small towns and cities like Clermont-Ferrand and Venice. But installing it in a city that already has trams is an unusual decision. It'd be like adding a Translohr line in Strasbourg or Lyon... it adds to the network, but it doesn't add to the system. It limits potential for future re-configuring of the system and services.

Translohr does have obvious drawbacks in the one-manufacturer nature of the stock. If all manufacturers standardised on the Translohr rail design then we'd have some guarantee of the long-term viability of the system. Currently we have the situation where if this one line of vehicles is discontinued, or the company goes under, there's nothing new that can ever operate on these lines. Seeing as the Bombardier GLT system has failed spectacularly, it'd make sense for the Translohr version to be adopted as the global standard for rubber tyred tram systems across all manufacturers. I still prefer proper tram systems, but the Translohr instillations in Paris and other cities will always be there, will want extending and at some point will want new vehicles.
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Old January 30th, 2013, 09:29 PM   #545
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Paris tram lines are not built to make a network like many other cities.
Tram are built to replace busy bus lines or serve areas with few mass transit.
Even with 11 lines in 2020, there will be only 8 stations where transfer between two tram lines will be possible.

T1a - T1b: Bobigny Pablo Picasso
T1 - T2: Parc Pierre Lagraviere
T1 - T5: Marché de Saint Denis
T1 - T8: Gare de Saint-Denis
T2 - T3a: Porte de Versailles
T3a - T3b: Porte de Vincennes
T3a - T9: Porte de Choisy
T6 - T10: Hopital Béclère

With the further extension, the T1 will be split in two lines like the T3.
I imagined that the Porte de Choiy - Orly tram will be T8 and Antony - Clamart tram will be T10.


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Old January 30th, 2013, 11:25 PM   #546
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Do you mean Porte de Choisy would be T9?

Even if these lines aren't meant to form a network, surely it'd be logical to allow for that in the future? We don't know what the travel habits of Parisians will be in 20 years. There may be demand for through services for some reason. It just seems an obvious case of futureproofing to design all the tram lines to be inter-compatible.
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 02:54 AM   #547
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I don't think that the RATP is in favor of an intercompatibility between lines.
Don't forget that he line T3 has been splite in two lines and it will be also the case of the T1 with the further extension.

______________________________________________________

My bus line (line 128) has lost its Renault Agora of 1999.




The Irisbus Citelis with RATP Stif livery have replaced them.


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Old February 2nd, 2013, 09:25 AM   #548
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
I don't think that the RATP is in favor of an intercompatibility between lines.
Don't forget that he line T3 has been splite in two lines and it will be also the case of the T1 with the further extension.
Yeah I know... That's a very bizarre, 1960s-style attitude for them to take. I can't think of any other city globally that's actually gone out of its way to avoid lines being interoperable.

Cool pictures btw as always
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 11:12 AM   #549
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My bus line (line 128) has lost its Renault Agora of 1999.
Is that a good thing?
Reason why I'm asking is that the only place I've seen Renault buses is in France, so I guess them are not as good as intended. Not due to them being french, obviously, but the fact that no one else seems to be buying them.
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 03:06 PM   #550
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I understand from one of my business classes when I was in the university here in the US, that Renault tried to market its vehicles (passenger vehicles, not transit) in the US during the 70s/80s but they did not do too well and pulled out of that market.
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 03:43 PM   #551
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Originally Posted by Northridge View Post
Is that a good thing?
Reason why I'm asking is that the only place I've seen Renault buses is in France, so I guess them are not as good as intended. Not due to them being french, obviously, but the fact that no one else seems to be buying them.
It is because Renault Agora was primary made for the french market.
It is really with Irisbus that they have targeted a more international market.
Irisbus Citelis is the successor of renault Agora and so far it has quite well spread around Europe.
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 06:59 PM   #552
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MK Tom View Post
Yeah I know... That's a very bizarre, 1960s-style attitude for them to take. I can't think of any other city globally that's actually gone out of its way to avoid lines being interoperable.
That seems extremely weird to me as well. I also saw the Translohr system in Mestre live and real and my superficial impression was that you combine the disadvantages of trams with those of heavy rubber based transportation.

I wonder what was such a big incentive to make systems not interoperable? Because interoperability is not an incentive by itself. Its not just potential changes in the future but also the larger the variety in the used system the less you can use benefits of economy of scale.
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Old February 3rd, 2013, 08:45 AM   #553
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any new photos of city bus, LRT, and tram car in Paris
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Old February 3rd, 2013, 10:29 PM   #554
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Quote:
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Is that a good thing?
Reason why I'm asking is that the only place I've seen Renault buses is in France, so I guess them are not as good as intended. Not due to them being french, obviously, but the fact that no one else seems to be buying them.
You have not been to Australia then? Both Perth and the capital Canberra have large numbers of Renualt buses. Both ordered large numbers of PR100.2's and PR180.2's in the late 80's and early 90's, the Canberra units carried the Renault logo but were branded Mack as Mack trucks were the sales agent in the country. Then in the mid 90's Renault produced a bus called the PR100.3 which was only sold in Australia, this was a cross between a PR100.2 and an R312. Perth got 1 trial unit and Canberra 40+ production units.

Of course Renault was then merged into Iris and again Iris was reasonably popular in Australia, with the Agora. Canberra has 20 (they were ordered by a company called Kings that went bust and the Canberra local government purchased them).

Plenty of pics can be found here:

http://www.actbus.net/gallery/index....-Buses-Current
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Old February 8th, 2013, 05:48 PM   #555
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Renault Agora and MAN Lion's City at Pont de Levallois (western end of metro line 3).

Renault Agora is the bus #2867 in service since June 1999
MAN Lion's City is the bus #9602 in service since January 2011.



There are Agora with a larger advertising space at the back. This Agora is the bus #7587 in service since May 2001.

There are also Agora with smaller advertising space at the back. This Agora is the bus #7921 in service since February 2002.
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Old February 20th, 2013, 01:56 AM   #556
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Tram-train Massy Evry
Between Massy and Epinay, the tram train line use the former track of the RER C and between Epinay sur Orges and Evry the line wil use new tram track.



Map of the line.

-20 km
-17 stations
-38 minutes ride.
-40,000 daily passengers
Opening by the end 2018

Video in french
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Old February 20th, 2013, 05:29 PM   #557
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Does this line have a T number?
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Old February 20th, 2013, 11:14 PM   #558
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No number yet, we only know the number to the T8.
I don't even know if the Tram-train Massy Evry will be a T# line.
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Old February 21st, 2013, 10:26 AM   #559
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I've heard that this line, as well as Tangentielles Ouest and Nord, could be named "Tram Express" with a letter. Which gives: TeO, TeN, TeS.

To be confirmed...
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Old February 21st, 2013, 02:22 PM   #560
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Quote:
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Tram-train Massy Evry
Between Massy and Epinay, the tram train line use the former track of the RER C and between Epinay sur Orges and Evry the line wil use new tram track.
When did RER C use the tracks and why doesn't it use it anymore?
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