New York vs. Hong Kong

[aab7772003]

Way back then, the "nick names" given to Africans were not considered as racial slurs.

[acc521]

I think the fact that the vast majority of people in HK are of chinese background is irrelevant. Whilst the city is not as diverse as many others such as NYC in the true sense of the word, the key is how you feel as a non-Chinese individual walking around. As a white Australian of Greek/Macedonian heritage, I felt extremely comfortable in HK. The city really does have an "international" vibe about it and, although I'm sure certain comments were made behind my back at times in Cantonese (just as occurs everwhere in the world), overall the city is a very welcoming place and people don't seem to care where you are from or if they do it's due to intrigue - they want to know where you are from and what things are like there and what you think of certain aspects of HK culture etc.

In Perth, the mixture of people is much more culturally diverse. There are large groups from all over the world in this city yet walk around town during the day and it is as if subconciously everyone is judging everyone based on their race. This is in large part due to the fact that Perth is isolated and not an international city.

All in all, it's not the cultural mix that's important but the attitudes of the locals and how you feel when walking down the street as a minority.

[_00_deathscar]

Well said.

[aab7772003]

You also feel very comfortable walk down the street as a foreigner in Munich and Amsterdam too. Many of you are probably under the assumption that these two cities are just not as global as Hong Kong is and the rest of the world actually buys such wishful thinking. It will not surprise me that all of you conveinently factor into the fact that Hong Kong has similar population numbers as New York and London have within their city limits, and conclude that Hong Kong is too good for the smaller (by population numbers) and hence "lesser" cities (in your eyes) such as Munich and Amsterdam.

There is no doubt that Hong Kong is much more open and cosmpolitan than Beijing, Shanghai and Guangzhou are. However, the assumption that Hong Kong is really up there with New York, London, Tokyo or even Paris is just unrealistic when the city is actually in the same league as Sydney, Madrid, San Francisco, Miami, Munich, Amsterdam, etc.

The comments are exchanged behind the backs of the foreigners in Hong Kong because the city still depends on a great deal of foreign capitals and talents. Why would you make foreigners (especially those from certain western developed nations) feel unwelcomed if you actually need them for many reasons?

[HSBC]

Originally Posted by acc521

I think the fact that the vast majority of people in HK are of chinese background is irrelevant. Whilst the city is not as diverse as many others such as NYC in the true sense of the word, the key is how you feel as a non-Chinese individual walking around. As a white Australian of Greek/Macedonian heritage, I felt extremely comfortable in HK. The city really does have an "international" vibe about it and, although I'm sure certain comments were made behind my back at times in Cantonese (just as occurs everwhere in the world), overall the city is a very welcoming place and people don't seem to care where you are from or if they do it's due to intrigue - they want to know where you are from and what things are like there and what you think of certain aspects of HK culture etc.

In Perth, the mixture of people is much more culturally diverse. There are large groups from all over the world in this city yet walk around town during the day and it is as if subconciously everyone is judging everyone based on their race. This is in large part due to the fact that Perth is isolated and not an international city.

All in all, it's not the cultural mix that's important but the attitudes of the locals and how you feel when walking down the street as a minority.

I agree with u, man!

Being a HK chinese living in Adelaide, I feel a bit strange whenever I walk along the street somewhere outside the city area. I just have this feeling of like being looked as an outsider who is not supposed to be here.

On the other hand, when I see a foreigner in HK, I'd be very curious to know where he or she comes from. If he/she looks lost, I would not think twice even before approaching and offering some guidance.I guess lots of HK locals would share the same attitude as mine.

[abcgoodest]

You don't want to compare Hong Kong with New York City now! The Big Apple will never be the same again after this financial nightmare. Moreover, apart from the Wall Street, 5th Avenue and Times Square areas, New York City is pretty much a gigantic ghetto. Life there is frightening. Hong Kong is much more pleasant.

[acc521]

Please don't respond to the trolling comments above. This has been a good thread so far and we don't need to waste pages on the utter crap posted above.

[HSBC]

Originally Posted by aab7772003

You also feel very comfortable walk down the street as a foreigner in Munich and Amsterdam too. Many of you are probably under the assumption that these two cities are just not as global as Hong Kong is and the rest of the world actually buys such wishful thinking. It will not surprise me that all of you conveinently factor into the fact that Hong Kong has similar population numbers as New York and London have within their city limits, and conclude that Hong Kong is too good for the smaller (by population numbers) and hence "lesser" cities (in your eyes) such as Munich and Amsterdam.

There is no doubt that Hong Kong is much more open and cosmpolitan than Beijing, Shanghai and Guangzhou are. However, the assumption that Hong Kong is really up there with New York, London, Tokyo or even Paris is just unrealistic when the city is actually in the same league as Sydney, Madrid, San Francisco, Miami, Munich, Amsterdam, etc.

The comments are exchanged behind the backs of the foreigners in Hong Kong because the city still depends on a great deal of foreign capitals and talents. Why would you make foreigners (especially those from certain western developed nations) feel unwelcomed if you actually need them for many reasons?

I just thought New York has a very great deal of foreign talents.

[aab7772003]

HSBC, you know what I am talking about exactly. Even SCMP and and Hong Kong Standard have articles periodically mentioning the critical necessity of filling a great deal of high level jobs in Hong Kong with foreign nationals. Do you read articles mentioning New York and London are competing with other cities in the rest of the world for the best of the best out there? How likely will the "foreign" talents (such as supermodels, top chefs, bankers, artists, etc.) based in NYC pack and leave NYC for good because of the supposedly worst financial crisis happening now since the crash of 1929?

[superchan7]

Lots of foreigners are in all of these "world cities."

[niroohawaii]

Originally Posted by acc521

I think the fact that the vast majority of people in HK are of chinese background is irrelevant. Whilst the city is not as diverse as many others such as NYC in the true sense of the word, the key is how you feel as a non-Chinese individual walking around. As a white Australian of Greek/Macedonian heritage, I felt extremely comfortable in HK. The city really does have an "international" vibe about it and, although I'm sure certain comments were made behind my back at times in Cantonese (just as occurs everwhere in the world), overall the city is a very welcoming place and people don't seem to care where you are from or if they do it's due to intrigue - they want to know where you are from and what things are like there and what you think of certain aspects of HK culture etc.

In Perth, the mixture of people is much more culturally diverse. There are large groups from all over the world in this city yet walk around town during the day and it is as if subconciously everyone is judging everyone based on their race. This is in large part due to the fact that Perth is isolated and not an international city.

All in all, it's not the cultural mix that's important but the attitudes of the locals and how you feel when walking down the street as a minority.

Good points. It'd be interesting to read what people of other backgrounds experienced in Hong Kong.

[niroohawaii]

Originally Posted by aab7772003

HSBC, you know what I am talking about exactly. Even SCMP and and Hong Kong Standard have articles periodically mentioning the critical necessity of filling a great deal of high level jobs in Hong Kong with foreign nationals. Do you read articles mentioning New York and London are competing with other cities in the rest of the world for the best of the best out there? How likely will the "foreign" talents (such as supermodels, top chefs, bankers, artists, etc.) based in NYC pack and leave NYC for good because of the supposedly worst financial crisis happening now since the crash of 1929?

While it looks like a weakness for HK to rely on foreigners to a great extent, the same can be said for NY, London etc. It evens out in the final analysis.

"Supermodels, Top chefs" are creation of media, as long as strong media outlets and distribution centres are located in, owned by persons of and operated by such persons in Newyork or London, they'll continue to attract such "supermodels, top chefs".

Media is a strong and important tool in disseminating information, misinformation and propaganda in this day and age. Without strong hold over media, cities, entities, countries, politicial blocks etc are weaker.

[EricIsHim]

Went to see this exhibition "Vertical Cities: Hong Kong | New York" at the Skyscraper Museum in New York City today.
It provides a head to head comparisons between the two cities (more like Hong Kong as a whole vs. Manhattan alone) in terms of skyscrapers/density and sustainable developments. Besides, it introduces some extreme that we have in developements, world narrowest building - Highcliff, mixed-use development clusters, transit-oriented developements, longest outdoor escalator, vertical shopping mall - Langham Place, footbridge connection, large scale reclamation etc. Indeed, it is a small exhibition, but it does provide a good introduction to visitors that are not familiar with HK. Met two NY families during my visit, and both had visited HK and the comments from them were HK is "absolutely amazing and unbelievable."

One thing interesting that got pointed out in the exhibition is numbers of the early 20th century NY's artists/architects visions has become reality in Hong Kong, but not in NY, such as the footbridge networks that we have.

Even I don't have much pictures from the exhibition, but you can find most of the displays and information on the organizer's website.
http://www.skyscraper.org/WHAT%27S_U...T/exhibits.htm



Not the greatest indoor pictures ever since I couldn't flash, but a two good satellite images for comparison. It states that HK has only one-third of the territory is developed, where NY has only one-third of the territory is green.




But the most annoying exhibition is this:

This MTR song just keeps playing again, again and again in the small and quite exhibition hall. It was a brain wash.

Gonna try to go to the symposiums next week as part of the "New York Celebrates Hong Kong 2008 Festival" sponsored by the HK Government. Hopefully they will be good.
Detail: http://www.hketony.gov.hk/ny/activit...Festival08.htm

[HSBC]

Originally Posted by aab7772003

HSBC, you know what I am talking about exactly. Even SCMP and and Hong Kong Standard have articles periodically mentioning the critical necessity of filling a great deal of high level jobs in Hong Kong with foreign nationals. Do you read articles mentioning New York and London are competing with other cities in the rest of the world for the best of the best out there? How likely will the "foreign" talents (such as supermodels, top chefs, bankers, artists, etc.) based in NYC pack and leave NYC for good because of the supposedly worst financial crisis happening now since the crash of 1929?

To be honest, I really don't know what you are talking about exactly.

Yes..as you said, best of the best, HK is competing with the rest of the world for the best of the best.
New York would not be New York nowadays if they only have local talents. In fact, they have lots of chinese talents working there, it doesn't matter whether you are talking about Chinese American or FOB chinese.

As superchan pointed out, there are foreign talents filling up top posts in most major "world cities". That's why it is called "world cities".

[EricIsHim]

Don't forget NY has a much bigger labour force base than HK, or even London does, too.
Both have the available labour force base of not just the city alone, but the whole country.
Those talented Americans and British move and work in the nation biggest and most international city without counting themselves as "foreign." They are free to move in and out of the cities.

On the other hand, small international city-states (e.g. HK and Singapore) only have a very small population and labour force base with limited amount talented people to fulfill the large number of top posts we have. I would imagine HK or Singapore may have the similar amount of top class local talents percentage-wise as compares to NY or London, but not the actual number to supply the top posts demand both cities have. That's why we disparate for foreign talented people.

[aab7772003]

Aspiration is good, but do not let that confuse you with the current status quo.

UK (London) and the US (New York) are at the top of their game in mass media because these countries really believe in freedom of expression. If propaganda were the real core of the American media, you would not witness tens of millions of Americans ridiculing Sarah Palin and artists such as Madonna expressing her views on politics and society as she sees fit.

"NYC in 2016"
http://nymag.com/realestate/features/2016/17144/

In fact, futuristic architecture was originated from Europe rather than from New York:
http://surj.stanford.edu/2004/pdfs/riffel.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futurism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archite...ure_and_beyond
Have you seen the cinematic masterpiece "Metropolis?"

[HSBC]

Originally Posted by aab7772003

Aspiration is good, but do not let that confuse you with the current status quo.

UK (London) and the US (New York) are at the top of their game in mass media because these countries really believe in freedom of expression. If propaganda were the real core of the American media, you would not witness tens of millions of Americans ridiculing Sarah Palin and artists such as Madonna expressing her views on politics and society as she sees fit.

"NYC in 2016"
http://nymag.com/realestate/features/2016/17144/

In fact, futuristic architecture was originated from Europe rather than from New York:
http://surj.stanford.edu/2004/pdfs/riffel.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futurism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archite...ure_and_beyond
Have you seen the cinematic masterpiece "Metropolis?"

So are u saying HK does not believe in freedom of expression???

Look at the world ranking of mass media freedom. HK and Unitied states are just next to each other in the ranking.

[HSBC]

Here is the link to the ranking I mentioned.

http://www.rsf.org/rubrique.php3?id_rubrique=639

[aab7772003]

HSBC, I did mention another ranking in my first response to this thread and personally I think these ranking/indexes often do not tell the whole picture. News can be reported without censorships in Hong Kong, something that is not possible in mainland China. The freedom of expression is more than just the absence of censorship. Again, you confuse aspiration with status quo.

[♣628.finst]

Originally Posted by HSBC

So are u saying HK does not believe in freedom of expression???

I prefer self-censorship and a more restricted freedom of expression.