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Old December 25th, 2013, 04:07 AM   #361
alserrod
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Picture is taken more or less here
https://maps.google.es/?ll=41.686566...04128&t=h&z=19

(google maps is not updated and street view is updated when they were on works)

Just after terminus direction second stop.


These days have enforced frequencies whilst Christmas. On saturday and Sunday they will drive every 8 and 10 minutes instead of 12 or 15 (or 10/12 at some hours).

Furthermore, yesterday, Christmas eve last tramway service was at 22:00 (21:00 for all bus lines).

On New year's eve they will be operating until 2:00.
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Old December 25th, 2013, 05:43 AM   #362
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Has the tram made access to Zaragoza Delicias easier for AVE travelers to/from Zaragoza? How is the transfer between the tram line and the Cercanias-1 line working?
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Old December 25th, 2013, 05:12 PM   #363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Has the tram made access to Zaragoza Delicias easier for AVE travelers to/from Zaragoza?
The tram itself doesn´t serve Zaragoza-Delicias station (the one for the AVE and long distance trains).
It does serve the much more central Zaragoza-Goya station though, which is used by Cercanías (commuter trains) and regional trains.

However, there is a second line being planned, which would serve the Delicias quarter (although maybe not the station).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
How is the transfer between the tram line and the Cercanias-1 line working?
As far as I know, it works well, the problem is that Zaragoza is a lone big city, without an urban area (well, in fact there is one urban area, but way too small for a city of its size).
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Old December 26th, 2013, 12:06 AM   #364
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Has the tram made access to Zaragoza Delicias easier for AVE travelers to/from Zaragoza? How is the transfer between the tram line and the Cercanias-1 line working?


First of all... I found this picture, it could be the best to post the current situation



Focus ONLY in red line (tramway) and dark green line (commuter Cercanias 1). Forget light green and purple, they are just proposals of the person who made that picture.


Delicias station is the dark green spot located more in the left of the map.

Goya station is the point where Commuter and Tramway joins (tramway stop is called "Fernando el catolico" but it has the commuter logo in all maps).


Arriving by train and commuting to tramway is as easy as you can find in this picture

https://maps.google.es/?ll=41.643903...50.87,,0,10.43

You'll see Fernando el catolico tramway stop. Turn image 180º with no movement and will see Goya station.

Anyway, there aren't many people who commute.

Today a person who moves from any point of Zaragoza municipality (can include little villages 20 km away from city centre, not the main traffic obviously but they can be...) or Utebo municipality within their territory in bus and tramway will pay 0,74 euro with a touchless card and is entitled to make a free transfer between lines.
This is the real problem. The commuter line goes paralel to a bus line with good frequencies, a lot of stops (will approach to your destination), cheaper and will let you make a transfer. You can start in Casetas, pay 0,74 euro, arrive Zaragoza and take a bus, tramway or both to destination free!!!.

If you take commuter train, you will pay 0,94 euro on a card of 10 tickets (quite important... will expire in a month!) and will be able to stop only in four points in Zaragoza. If your destination is near them, nice!. If they aren't... you will need to pay 0,74 euro for a bus or tramway (free if have arrived by bus).

So... should you need to make a single journey, you will think on train and bus but frequent travellers will notice price difference too much.


There are good news. "small" news but good news.

They are going to accept a new card, a card designed for metropolitan bus. Paying with that card, price will be the same that if you buy a single ticket (not a 10 tickets card) but you will have a free transfer in Zaragoza to tramway or bus.

Looking to numbers, there is no saving money. This is... a tramway ticket payed by touchless card and a commuter ticket payed by a 10 ticket bonus will be the total ammount.


There are two improvements anyway:

- First of all, not frequent travellers who are used to pay the price of a single ticket (not worth to buy a 10 tickets because they expire in a month), will use that card and have nice transfer

- Nothing to save nowadays but... they will change computering system in commuter stations to accept more cards. So more options in the future would be possible.
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Old December 26th, 2013, 12:20 AM   #365
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Regarding Zaragoza Delicias station... I've glanced on google about maps and... WHAT THE ****!!!!!!!, 95% of proposals over a map where on SSC pages!!!!


I chose this one.

Line north-south is today on service (line one) incluiding those ones branches in yellow in this map.

The other ones are next proposals. Municipality has offered their proposal about line two (east-west) and it is supossed to start the western line (half of line 2) in 2015

Delicias station will be 600 m away from that line. Service will keep by bus but I really understand it.

When in local threads someone says that this or that corridor would be fine for tramway, I state that... are they able to fill a tramway every 5 minutes in peak hours?

Will they?. Ok, let's build a tramway there. Won't they?. So, better keep the bus and not waste money.

And for station and its location, nowadays it is better to keep bus (or users can take commuter and, let's hope they will be fine to transfer to tramway without any cost)



Furthermore... there is one thing I forgot. If you come from a commuter station you have payed a full commuter ticket and no possibility to have a free transfer.

If you come by train to Zaragoza, train tickets include commuter ticket free (not only in Zaragoza). You can go to Goya or Portillo and take a bus or tramway if you want. You will pay the same but you can save time.
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Old December 26th, 2013, 09:08 PM   #366
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How busy is C1 line? And do they want to plan some fare that allows use of C1 line in conjunction of trams?
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Old December 27th, 2013, 12:32 AM   #367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
How busy is C1 line?
Not a lot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
And do they want to plan some fare that allows use of C1 line in conjunction of trams?
There´s something about it.
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Old December 27th, 2013, 01:37 AM   #368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
How busy is C1 line?

Let's say better... empty.
It is not easy to know how many passengers it has because all regional trains running there can be used in the same conditions than C1 line. This is, all trains Castejon-Zaragoza accept commuter tickets from Casetas to Zaragoza. There trains, between Delicias and Goya, are more than half of the trains and it is not easy to know how many passengers take those regional trains and how many take the Civia train (for a passenger it doesn't matter which train they take but for statistics it could be interesting)



As an example, last year I had to take from time to time a train to Utebo at 16h and back at 18h more or less.
They are not peak hours indeed (18h could be peak hour to go out of the city, not to go to the city).

More or less, 30 passengers at 16h, and 20 passengers returning. Later, in Delicias, sometimes more passengers but that's all.

Maybe this line has a thread with more posts than passengers


Quote:
And do they want to plan some fare that allows use of C1 line in conjunction of trams?

Yes but not saving money (at least in the next year)

I explain it:

- Tramway single ticket: 1,35 euro
- Tramway paying with a touchless card: 0,74 euro
(credit inside card doesn't expire)

- Commuter single ticket: 1,70 euro
- Commuter 10 tickets pass: 9,35 (thus 0,935 euro)
And... pass will expire within one month so if you are not going to travel five return journeys, you may think twice.


Proposal:

Touchless card already used for metropolitan buses (and free transfer in local buses and tramway), available also in commuter.
1,70 euro the journey (commuter and free transfer to bus or tramway)

You do not save money (1,5 cents more... so I guess which would be new single fares... ) but tickets do not expire.

So, not frequent travellers, who up to now pay 1,70 euro per journey would be able to use that card, pay the same ammount and have a free transfer (not only tramway, also buses, near Portillo there are a lot of buses to many destinations).

This could help to increase the number of passengers but it is not the solution indeed (an idea not thought for frequent travellers would not be a final solution).

Anyway, it will help and we do know that they can accept all transport cards...
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Old January 9th, 2014, 07:33 PM   #369
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These are updated Zaragoza tramway schedules

http://www.tranviasdezaragoza.es/informacion/horarios

They have been improved several times but they always kept original ones saying that frequencies could be changed only.

Nowadays I would focus on:

12:00 to 14:00 saturday and sunday
last service time (over midnight)
more capacity 7:00 to 10:00 on weekdays
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Old January 21st, 2014, 12:57 AM   #370
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Goya station, C1 Cercanías RENFE Zaragoza and trains regionals

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Old March 25th, 2014, 10:29 PM   #371
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It is three years ago when Zaragoza tramway started to operate. Since then we have had 48 millions passengers providing that at first line was not finished.
Today it has 25 stops over 12,8 km


2011: 8 millions
2012: 12 millions
2013: 22,3 millions

Up today: 48 millions (so, 2014: already 6 millions)

Several dates:

2011: service started on March. No passengers before then. Only half line was opened.
2012: service goes on for two stations until city-centre in october, and until the end of historic city in december
2013: full line is opened in March, thus the increase of passengers. Several bus lines keep running paralel to the tramway until july.


In fact, to see the number of passengers we ought consider August 2013 - July 2014 at least because of bus lines changes.
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Old April 18th, 2014, 02:25 PM   #372
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These days tramway services have bee improved on evenings. Thursday and Friday are bank holidays, therefore 15 min frequency and they have 9 on evenings.

On the other hand 24th April will have a partial bus strike
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Old July 20th, 2014, 05:18 PM   #373
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Hi,
Today, a major local newspaper makes a comparation in bus and tramway lines between 2013 March Vs 2014 March

They could had taken another month due to in 2013 there were two additional bank holidays (Easter week) and in 2014 they were in April.
Anyways, they point a global increase of 5%.


In august 2013 several lines were changed not to go paralel to tramway. I've counted these lines and have a global 660.00 passengers

But tramway has increased 1 million/month in one year. Thus 66% of increase comes from bus lines and 33% are new passengers
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 01:25 AM   #374
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WTF!!!!

Zaragoza has had the strongest hailstones storm since 1977 and... tramway service was this one
(just glance to the officer in the middle of the street taking a chair that wind move there)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adpg View Post

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Old August 22nd, 2014, 03:24 PM   #375
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Oops.




Fortunately nobody was injured, as it was parked at the depot. Apparently this happened due to a brake failure.

PS: My avatar is now sponsored by line 41, which runs from Puerta del Carmen in downtown to Rosales del Canal in the Southwest.
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Old September 24th, 2014, 05:59 PM   #376
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Zaragoza tramway has had first fatality this afternoon after opening three and a half years ago.

No more details yet. Only the place of accident
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Old October 9th, 2014, 10:56 PM   #377
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Zaragoza tram at Plaza Espana yesterday. I didn't get to use it myself, but it was full when I saw it.

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Old October 9th, 2014, 11:45 PM   #378
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This week is peak-week.
Major days and it operates 24/24 with a 5 minutes frequency (except fron 02:00 to 05:00).

I guess tomorrow friday it will have the record of passengers in the whole year
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Old October 17th, 2014, 10:58 PM   #379
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In just 10 major days (where 5 weekend or bank holiday and 5 weedays), public transport in Zaragoza had 4,5 million passengers (not bad for a 700.000 people city)

Indeed, 3.272.000 in bus and 1.250.000 in the tramway line

Totally, 560.000 more passengers than one year ago


Official press release
http://www.zaragoza.es/ciudad/notici...icia?id=221087
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Old December 23rd, 2014, 01:36 AM   #380
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Pictures of the CAF trams of Zaragoza:


3070 Calle el Coso 24 November 2014


3030 Plaza Espana 24 November 2014


3060 Gran Via 24 November 2014


3020 Mago de Oz Terminus 24 November 2014


3190 Plaza de Pilar Murallas 24 November 2014


3070 Cesar Augusto 24 November 2014

More here:
http://smu.gs/1vhWa2k
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