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Old December 4th, 2008, 10:59 PM   #741
DarkTennouHito82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DennisS View Post
Yes, you. Especially the last part:



Come on..... Do you think they are even thinking about constructing it when they are not 1000% sure that they are able to? (technologically seen, forget the economy for a second)
Dennis this is just a Proposition isn't it? Maybe they build it but not as high as here proposed. And please do not call my post a piece of crap, thank you.
I just be worried about it and have doubts wether they really be 1000% sure or not.
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Old December 4th, 2008, 11:02 PM   #742
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkTennouHito82 View Post
...
If they gonna build it anyway I hope that the construction doesn't collapse after completition. This could happen and should be an argument to wait with its construction.
...
Is it 1980? No, its 2008 and by the time the construction is done it will be 2020. Your arguments are completely foolish and solely based on your lack of knowledge about the tower's engineering and design. Do take the time to learn more about the project before making any other unintelligent assumptions.
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Old December 4th, 2008, 11:10 PM   #743
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkTennouHito82 View Post
Dennis this is just a Proposition isn't it? Maybe they build it but not as high as here proposed. And please do not call my post a piece of crap, thank you.
I just be worried about it and have doubts wether they really be 1000% sure or not.
the tower is no longer only a proposal, same for the height. the tower is approved and at least under Prep. maybe even U/C according to Soletanche bachy
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Old December 4th, 2008, 11:46 PM   #744
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Old December 5th, 2008, 02:25 AM   #745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AvanGard View Post
...Your arguments are completely foolish and solely based on your lack of knowledge about the tower's engineering and design.
I have a lack of knowledge. That's interesting.
How about you are trusting technologies that haven't even last any long-term study yet? How could they have when they are just the latest developments?
Have you ever work with concrete for example? Do you think it's good for the material to provide them with chemicals only to shorten its substantiation?
This high-performance concrete is indeed the latest technology.
But do anynone knows how the chemicals affect the material in approximately 50 years?
They've used thousands of tons of this concrete at BD.
Nobody knows about the long-term affects. Everybody was happy to see how the BD got a new Level evey 3-4 days. In my opinion this couldn't have been good for the conrete.
Don't get me wrong. Concrete in combination with steel is a wonderful material. If it has enough time for substanstiation you can build everything with it.

Anyway I didn't want to spoil your optimism.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AvanGard View Post
Is it 1980? No, its 2008 and by the time the construction is done it will be 2020.
Even the latest material, development, technology what ever can fail and collapse if you don't take care and time.

By the way I do not intent to attack anyone here. So please stay kind.
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Old December 5th, 2008, 06:20 AM   #746
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkTennouHito82 View Post
I have a lack of knowledge. That's interesting.
How about you are trusting technologies that haven't even last any long-term study yet? How could they have when they are just the latest developments?
Have you ever work with concrete for example? Do you think it's good for the material to provide them with chemicals only to shorten its substantiation?
This high-performance concrete is indeed the latest technology.
But do anynone knows how the chemicals affect the material in approximately 50 years?
They've used thousands of tons of this concrete at BD.
Nobody knows about the long-term affects. Everybody was happy to see how the BD got a new Level evey 3-4 days. In my opinion this couldn't have been good for the conrete.
Don't get me wrong. Concrete in combination with steel is a wonderful material. If it has enough time for substanstiation you can build everything with it.

Anyway I didn't want to spoil your optimism.



Even the latest material, development, technology what ever can fail and collapse if you don't take care and time.

By the way I do not intent to attack anyone here. So please stay kind.
The problem lies in that you're basis is on assumptions. It is possible that I can die tomorrow, will it happen? Not likely.

Regardless IF it ever does collapse, the Engineers will have tried their best. But here is the thing, it won't collapse under natural conditions.

The thing holding back skyscrapers really has never been wind and instead has been both the ability to pump concrete to extreme heights and the strength of glass.

Thankfully in recent years these 2 problems have been fixed.

You can now drop a car on a 10cm (not use to the metric system at this scale, correct me if this is actually too thin) thick glass and it won't break. But because it is much stronger, the glass can be lighter. The lighter a building is outside of the main concrete core, the higher you can go. And these improvements have drastically made it possible for these new daring heights.

And thanks to new pumps, and the further advancement, I can actually see pumping going as high as 1,500 meters some day.

So the problem isn't stability or weight. The only problem left it perhaps the twisting of the building. But once again this can easily be resolved. They can have many tuned mass dampers with a solid foundation. Which either one you choose, it should solve the problem since after all this building is quite aerodynamic.

Now don't get mad. There is nothing to be mad or ashamed about. I am simply informing you of this so something like this doesn't happen again.

The main point being is that you just can't assume things because, "Well, MAYBE" on issues that people are hired for on these types of projects.

A great example of this, "Maybe" type stuff is the implementation of Parachutes on skyscrapers now. Though likely NEVER going to ever happen again, you are right. MAYBE. Well actually, MAYBE it can also be used for normal fires. So NEVER MIND.

To get on topic, regardless of activity I would really like to see an on site photo.
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Old December 5th, 2008, 11:55 AM   #747
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I think this tower collapsing because of its size is the least of our worries. Am sure they have done their homework especially considering this has been under design for 4 years.

Anyway, here's a picture from Tony90


Last edited by malec; December 5th, 2008 at 07:28 PM.
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Old December 5th, 2008, 11:58 AM   #748
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AvanGard View Post
Is it 1980? No, its 2008 and by the time the construction is done it will be 2020. Your arguments are completely foolish and solely based on your lack of knowledge about the tower's engineering and design. Do take the time to learn more about the project before making any other unintelligent assumptions.
I agree completely! This guy has no knowledge of structure engineering and he is just talking off his head.
FYI - This building has been in design for almost 5 years already. I remember when it was called "AL BURJ" and was to be the center of the Water front project.

Many companies are involved with the structure of a Supertall. Even the material is subtracted to top engineering companies around the world. They share knowledge of the latest engineering practices. If top engineering companies say this tower can be built, it can be.
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Old December 5th, 2008, 02:37 PM   #749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Matter View Post
You can now drop a car on a 10cm (not use to the metric system at this scale, correct me if this is actually too thin) thick glass and it won't break.
I think you meant 10mm (0.4 inches) 10cm is about 4 inches which is a ridiculous thickness for glass! Yet another reason everybody needs to convert to the metric system so we don't have to worry about conversions.
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Old December 5th, 2008, 06:58 PM   #750
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malec View Post
I think this tower collapsing


What you mean? (being sarcastic are you?)
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Old December 5th, 2008, 07:28 PM   #751
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lol, read the whole sentence
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Old December 6th, 2008, 12:11 AM   #752
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OK OK I will move this thread.

Reason is this as has been pointed out.
http://www.bachy-soletanche.com/sbf/...2574F2005852BA

Oct 24, 2008 - Dubai : foundation works for the tallest tower in the world

The Dubai Nakheel Tall Tower is part of the Nakheel Harbour and Tower project and involves the construction of a new town on a 270 hectare site in the centre of Dubai. At a height of more than 1 km, when completed the Nakheel Tall Tower, the project’s central structure, will be the tallest building in the world.
In early 2008, Solétanche Bachy constructed three test barrettes and then, from April to June 2008, installed a 130 m diameter diaphragm wall including the capping beam. Last August, we commenced the construction of 392 barrettes to form the foundations of the Tall Tower. Additionally, Solétanche Bachy will be responsible for the construction of the pumping system, earthworks, a draining foundation raft and a concrete blinding layer. Foundation works are due to be completed by January 2010.




Now please, don't fill this thread with useless posts like "wooohoooo", "Great Tower!!!!!", "(insert a million smileys here)", and so on.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 12:39 AM   #753
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are you still so pessimistic about the construction malec?
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Old December 6th, 2008, 12:42 AM   #754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malec View Post
I think this tower collapsing because of its size is the least of our worries. Am sure they have done their homework especially considering this has been under design for 4 years.

Anyway, here's a picture from Tony90
Where this place is located?

I still do not know where this tower is going to be built.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 01:23 AM   #755
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seems it is quite difficult to look on the first page
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Old December 6th, 2008, 02:13 AM   #756
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Originally Posted by ZZ-II View Post
seems it is quite difficult to look on the first page
I saw the first page.
And also I saw:
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...postcount=1728
It does not seem to me that this place is near of the sea as in the figures.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 02:20 AM   #757
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calm down. this is the place, believe it or not
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Old December 6th, 2008, 02:25 AM   #758
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woow its actually u/c now!!! im still not 100% sure itll get build though, but this is good news.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 03:11 AM   #759
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msradell View Post
I think you meant 10mm (0.4 inches) 10cm is about 4 inches which is a ridiculous thickness for glass! Yet another reason everybody needs to convert to the metric system so we don't have to worry about conversions.
I agree actually. I am trying to learn metric. It's not that hard, but conversions are hard. Especially since I am technically math illiterate. lol

Anyway it looks like there is a lot of activity on site already. Nice.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 03:36 AM   #760
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are you still so pessimistic about the construction malec?
Probably for the same reason I am: Nakheel is broke and it's hard to get loans.
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