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Old October 10th, 2008, 01:52 PM   #41
hellospank25
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i guess houses in johannesburg must be really cheap to buy considering the overal conditions of the city and the high crime rate, yeah?
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Old October 10th, 2008, 02:02 PM   #42
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Wow, j'burg is really starting to be refurbished into something nice! good job!!
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Old October 10th, 2008, 02:06 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hellospank25 View Post
i guess houses in johannesburg must be really cheap to buy considering the overal conditions of the city and the high crime rate, yeah?
Average house prices in Johannesburg are higher than the national average. An average house in SA costs R1million, about $120US. Overall conditions of the city? Johannesburg is larger area wise than Los Angeles. So you have great areas, and bad areas. High crime rate? Johannesburg's crime rate has been declining sharply since 1995. However, a sharp increase in armed robbery is problematic (although this happened all over south africa, even in sleepy towns such as Rustenburg and Nelspruit). Pretoria probably suffers more from these types of crimes than Johannesburg.
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Old October 10th, 2008, 02:41 PM   #44
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that's really cheap in Australia the average price of a home is around $350.000 US dollars
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Old October 10th, 2008, 02:59 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hellospank25 View Post
that's really cheap in Australia the average price of a home is around $350.000 US dollars

Well, there is a difference... Australia is a DEVELOPED country. SA is developing (and even this is not enough, because we don't play in the same league as the Asian Tigers or the South American countries!). The average price of a home in the northern suburbs of Johannesburg is about four times the national average.

Our housing market has cooled down significantly thanks to the credit act - an act that was brought into place to protect banks and customers against reckless lending. This meant that housing had to cool, after all, we were one of the top 5 countries in terms of the housing market's performance!

But yes, aus is lovely, and I can see why you would choose to pay more to live there than to live in SA. Plus, it is safer, cleaner and overall better. This does not mean Johannesburg is an open sewer.
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Old October 10th, 2008, 03:05 PM   #46
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i would actually rather live in a city where houses are cheap, i hate how high the prices have increased in Australia to buy a house. That is why i am considering moving to Canada in a few years, where houses are cheaper than here
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Old October 10th, 2008, 03:31 PM   #47
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Quote:
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i would actually rather live in a city where houses are cheap, i hate how high the prices have increased in Australia to buy a house. That is why i am considering moving to Canada in a few years, where houses are cheaper than here
I think we might see house values drop more all over the globe - as people are barred from lending money left and right, and as houses become too expensive to afford because of this. In terms of houses being cheaper... You must remember that it is important to factor in how much you earn and how much something costs. South Africans find our houses increasingly unaffordable (I am in this category) because we earn less!
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Old October 10th, 2008, 04:02 PM   #48
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Extremely interesting and raw.
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Old October 10th, 2008, 04:06 PM   #49
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raw?
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Old October 10th, 2008, 04:12 PM   #50
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it feels kinda raw. I can't really explain it...
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Old October 10th, 2008, 04:17 PM   #51
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Could it be because of the photography? All of the pics where taken by Johannesburg Forumers. Mine all taken with an itty bitty twaddle of a cellphone camera. Pule's pics with a better camera. We try to capture different sides of the city... In many pics the CBD is quiet, because sundays are often the only days many of us have to take pictures. Plus, I always try to take pictures in such a way that I don't make people feel uncomfortable (had a lady attacking me in Chicago, thinking I was taking pictures of her childer!).

But Jozi is a raw city, it has an edge. You fall in love the one minute, the next she turns on you with a baseball bat.

I think I understand your comment to a certain extent.
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Old October 10th, 2008, 04:21 PM   #52
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Quote:
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But Jozi is a raw city, it has an edge. You fall in love the one minute, the next she turns on you with a baseball bat.

I think I understand your comment to a certain extent.
Yeah, that's partly it. I think many cities in developing countries have this.
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Old October 10th, 2008, 08:09 PM   #53
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I'm so glad to see Joburg is getting better and better after the terrible situation in the 90s.



For those of you not aware of what the CBD and neighbourhoods like Hillbrow and Berea were like check out the following photo series from 2003:

http://michaelstevenson.com/contempo...s/jhb/jhb1.htm

And more information about the CBD and what caused the decay:

Quote:
White residents fled Johannesburg's inner city in the 1990s. The removal of the Group Areas Act foreshadowed a flow into the city of black residents and owners of small businesses seeking opportunities and better lives. Former denizens looked back in self-righteous justification at a city that was given over to plunder and mayhem. It was a self-fulfilling prophecy, backed up by eyewitness reports and statistics. Everyone had their horror stories.

In amongst this turmoil existed the tower blocks occupied by tenants who were holding onto occupancy and managing the buildings in ways of their own devising. Their story had gone something like this: in the 1990s the owners absconded, leaving managing agents to retrieve what rents they could. In most cases, these agents were corrupt, did not pay the utilities, and disappeared with the money. These were tidy sums, handed over by poor people who conscientiously paid up to avoid having to go back where they came from.

The decay of Jo'burg's centre can be ascribed to many factors but perhaps none more so than the absence of Body Corporates. These had become relics of a more genteel era; the communal responsibilities that are contentious in even the most well-heeled blocks were not marked out. Windows were broken and not repaired. Lifts froze and their shafts became tips.

The relationship between tenants and owners or their agents deteriorated with disputes over the state of the buildings, and in some cases resulted in unpaid rents and dues. The buildings started looking like fire hazards, and the City Council began closing on them for unpaid utilities.

In between the needs of City Council and the aspirations of developers anticipating the bloom of an African city lies the fate of Jo'burg's residents. The outcome will decide whether or not Johannesburg becomes, again, a city of exclusion.
What I wonder is where the people went that got evicted from the buildings in the CBD. And did the crime rate go up in the areas these people moved to?
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Old October 12th, 2008, 12:41 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chopsky View Post
I'm not sure why the race of a community would be 'offensive', but nonetheless, yes, theres many more whites in Sandton than there are in other areas of Johannesburg, but that's the reality of the situation. If you want to see the nicer areas, you need to look where there's more whites. There's still PLENTY of black people there. The street life would definitely be diverse.
My answer is to think about it ... I am sure you will find a reason.

On a related note...
Anglo-Whites were very much a part of center city Jo'burg, then they fled, relocated new biz district around Sandton, high salary jobs there, expensive to live there, and many people talk about how it's hip / happening, others say "upscale" - but all it is - is just hedonistic conspicuous consumption...

Just what is Sandton contributing to Jo'burg and/or SA, culturally speaking?

Are they furthering the development of a vibrant SA culture - or are they just building an SA version of the western capitalistic culture that looks like everyone else and building walls around themselves blocking themselves off from their neighbors?.

You know, many Jo'burgers seem to think that having a Louis Vuitton in Sandton represents culture ...
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Old October 12th, 2008, 04:48 PM   #55
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The Gautrain Rapid Rail link is currently under construction in Johannesburg which will definitely do wonders public transport-wise. A BRT Bus system is also being implemented and is very close to completion. The taxi recapitalisation system is also replacing old taxis with newer, safer versions if that helps.

Johannesburg isn't where it needs to be, but it's getting there quickly. It's being "rebuilt" basically.
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Old October 12th, 2008, 09:59 PM   #56
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very interesting, I wish all of Africa could just be as modern as Jo´Burg, Durban or Cape Town!
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Old October 13th, 2008, 12:29 AM   #57
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I'm impressed by South Africa, especially in terms of natural beauty and climate. It can be compared to the Mediterranean, California or Australia, just with completely different flora and fauna. I can imagine myself living there easily.
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Old October 13th, 2008, 01:50 AM   #58
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South Africa is very intriguing.
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Old October 13th, 2008, 01:55 AM   #59
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Johannesburg in 2003 looked like Toronto in the 1970s.
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Old October 13th, 2008, 04:20 AM   #60
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I don't mean to stir anything or upset anybody but I was wondering. I checked out the skyscrapers in Johannesburg and found out that most were built in the 1970s. Afterwards and to this day, hardy if any skyscrapers were built. How come?
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