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Old June 12th, 2015, 06:22 PM   #4361
megalithe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UrbanImpact View Post
This is a private development.........you can't tell people how to build their property other than zoning/codes/ordinances./community boards If that starts happening then you can be sure it would be abused. Weather we like it or not, it's not our property.
thats not how it works for these projects.
they get BIG tax breaks. and the public CAN make demands.
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Old June 12th, 2015, 06:41 PM   #4362
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thats not how it works for these projects.
they get BIG tax breaks. and the public CAN make demands.
Many projects get big tax breaks in the USA. I'm an Architect, I know.
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Old June 12th, 2015, 06:41 PM   #4363
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Wow dude! This new design would perfectly fit somewhere in Moscow or any other Bandoostan, filled with all those wacky towers build by nouveau riche mafia bosses dreaming of such a big and "cool" looking things since their village childhood.
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Old June 12th, 2015, 07:17 PM   #4364
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megalithe View Post
thats not how it works for these projects.
they get BIG tax breaks. and the public CAN make demands.
The public can make all sorts of demands. Just don't expect any results.

Start a petition. They always work. Super effective.
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Old June 12th, 2015, 07:18 PM   #4365
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Unfortunately Foster's is scrapped.
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Old June 12th, 2015, 09:20 PM   #4366
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Two words: New Coke.
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Old June 12th, 2015, 09:55 PM   #4367
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Old June 13th, 2015, 01:39 AM   #4368
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The redesign of 2WTC is already being poorly-received, and it looks like no one wants the new design built. I am pretty sure that Bjarke Ingels has never before designed a major skyscraper.

I heard that this redesign was deemed necessary given the different requirements for TV studios as opposed to financial companies. And it looks like the new design will conflict with the below-grade work under the original design that was already finished.

About the original design, one has to wonder if the flat, lowrise part of 2WTC had space for satellites, but then those satellites' signals would have been blocked by nearby skyscrapers. Stupid News Corp and 21st Century Fox insist on having some of their satellites on the very top of 2WTC.

My opinion: I also reject the new design for 2WTC. What are they thinking? This design will be such a disaster that even the ugliest Brutalist building in the world will have a better design than this. I'm saying, do not build this design. Either un-scrap build the original Norman Foster Design, or waste everyone's time and energy trying to find a completely new design for 2WTC that will make up for the original Foster design being scrapped.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 01:39 AM   #4369
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Wow, I missed a lot lol. I actually like the view from the memorial. The other views are pretty cringe-worthy. My biggest problem is with how big it is. The base is a monstrosity. Do they really need that much square footage? Can that base even work at that site? There's no imagination and, most importantly, no recognition of where it is. It looks like something he scribbled on a napkin after a few beers. They need to narrow it, make it more vertically oriented, get rid of the ugly cantilevers and turn it towards the memorial. That would essentially make it a larger version of 111 W 57.

I was slow to warm up to Foster's design, but I grew to love it. Most importantly, it had design features that were critical to the master plan. The diamonds at the top were the realization of Daniel Libeskind's "Wedge of Light" concept and would reflect sunlight down on the memorial. It was arguably more of a monument to the memorial than 1WTC. This is empty and devoid of meaning with way too much of a selfish, "look-at-me" feel. Anywhere else, that would be fine, but here, the message should not be "look-at-me", it should be "look at this place." Since it's Ingels, I was expecting the design to wallow in its own vanity, I was just hoping that it would be better at it.

I'm not as gloom and doom about it as a lot of people on this forum, but dear God I'm tired of this egotistical "modern architecture" BS. I hope they at least modify it some from this. I liked some of the modifications someone proposed earlier.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 02:37 AM   #4370
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People are complaining because of this silly hatred against Fox. The project is stunning and the Seven Hanging Gardens are glorious.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 03:16 AM   #4371
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If I agreed with you, we would both be wrong.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 03:25 AM   #4372
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Old June 13th, 2015, 03:27 AM   #4373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rafaelkafka View Post


People are complaining because of this silly hatred against Fox. The project is stunning and the Seven Hanging Gardens are glorious.
In my opinion too much of cuboid shapes

Primary 2WTC design is/was absolutely unique and must be not changed
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Old June 13th, 2015, 03:35 AM   #4374
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this is the only angle I can say I don't think is all that bad.




I don't think i'll ever get around to appreciating this, it looks like half of a shorter 1 WTC with jagged edges instead of sleek ones :



edit: i've also just noticed Gehry's Beekman tower i front of 3 WTC. They must've been short on time editing that video.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 03:40 AM   #4375
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrocer View Post
In my opinion too much of cuboid shapes

Primary 2WTC design is/was absolutely unique and must be not changed
To be fair, the old WTC was nothing but "cubic shapes", however it was still awesome.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 03:48 AM   #4376
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I agree about how good the original WTC looked.

However, if this ends up being a cubic tower, then 1WTC will look out of place being the only tower in the complex with an atypical shape. Foster's 2WTC really complemented 1WTC's triangular faces, whereas the redesign ostracizes it.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 03:56 AM   #4377
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It just looks like a lazy piece of work. It would just seem to me if satellite dishes are the biggest reason for this along with floor plate size that there would be a way to accommodate that and still keep the design at a level worthy of its location. I wonder if any tech gurus are able to incorporate the technology of those dishes into the structure of the building? To design something of this size for a tenant to be so specific seems foolish in the long run.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 04:34 AM   #4378
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After some thinking, I've come to make up my mind in a positive way for this new design. On the west side and from the memorial, while the shape is simple, the setbacks and cantilevers gite it a unique look. Same from the east side, it evoques the original twins and adds an interesting touch with the gardens.
I also like the inmense base, its intimidating and imposing, just like twins were, and i think that strongness feeling is what many people want from WTC. And the look from below is quite futuristic and high tech from the cantilevered side and sleek from the straight ones.
It's from the north and south point of view that the design really annoys me. Its too fat, generic, and kind of childish and uninspired, with some serious lack of verticality. That makes me think, if the boxes were turned 90 degrees it could work better, but it would lose functionality. THIS is where i think BIG should work more and do some tweaking.
As for not seeing Foster's one being built, i wish strongly he reuses that design somewhere.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 04:51 AM   #4379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L.A.F.2. View Post
I agree about how good the original WTC looked.

However, if this ends up being a cubic tower, then 1WTC will look out of place being the only tower in the complex with an atypical shape. Foster's 2WTC really complemented 1WTC's triangular faces, whereas the redesign ostracizes it.
That's a really good point. The renderings above I don't think look that bad. The view from the north though really does look bad. If they got rid of those ugly cantilevers, I think it would look better but I still don't like the size of it. And, as I mentioned, it is utterly devoid of all symbolic significance while Foster's design was loaded with beautiful examples of it.
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Old June 13th, 2015, 07:17 AM   #4380
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The "best option" is whatever the client wants. It's an office building before it's a work of art. Ideally it would be both.
The best option should be whatever gets this thing built fastest and starts bringing in revenue. Correct me if I'm wrong, but modifying Foster's design to fit Fox's needs seems like it would be much more cost effective and time efficient than bringing in an entirely new architect. They already have it built to street level in the shape of Foster's design and the new one looks like it doesn't fit that footprint. Additionally, the new design with its cantilevers and setbacks seems it would take much longer to construct that a design that is flat 80% of the way to the top.
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