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Old April 29th, 2017, 01:07 AM   #6141
dres0ne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarshallKnight View Post
My desktop recently futzed out and I couldn't get Sketchup to cooperate with my laptop, but I decided to take a stab at this using TinkerCAD, since there's not much else to do with 2WTC but wait.

I decided to step back and approach things conceptually, rather than aesthetically, and laid out a few nagging issues with the current designs, as well as issues plaguing the WTC development as a whole:
  • Foster's diamond design, while beautiful, is cut from a different cloth than the other towers.
  • BIG's design is top-heavy (never mind the nauseating teetering effect), and lacks the graceful deference to the Memorial of Foster's.
  • Although the setbacks of BIG's design are more in keeping with the overall master plan, they don't have much specific relationship to the other towers in the complex.
  • Neither design creates much appearance of a "twin" to One WTC.
  • Both designs are single-use, meaning the search for a single massive office tenant has plagued the developer for years.
  • The WTC still lacks a hotel, dedicated restaurant, or residential space of its own.
To answer these issues, I've come up with a massing unlike either Foster or BIG's designs -- really it's kind of a hybrid between 3 and 4 WTC -- that I think has the following advantages:
  • The setbacks and angles of the facades are aligned to match various surfaces of the other three towers (the Northwest facade = the Northwest facade of 1WTC, the upper setback = the upper setback of 3WTC, the East facade = the upper West facade of 4WTC, etc.)
  • The pattern of the setbacks creates a visual pivot point at the NE corner of the site, not unlike the original design for 35 Hudson Yards.
  • The setbacks break up the volume into the tower into multiple programs -- trading floors at the base, large office above that, boutique office above that...
  • And the uppermost volume narrows to an ideal width for a hotel or condos, with a large terrace on the upper setback for an amenity space like a restaurant, residential pool, etc.
  • The inclusion of a hotel or residential component could jumpstart construction without an anchor tenant.
  • The setbacks and the narrow upper volume also allow more light/sightlines into the Memorial area, and preserve sightlines of 1WTC from more angles, especially from the East (where both Foster and Big's designs mostly block it)
  • With a height and width matching the roof of 1WTC, the silhouette viewed from the North is that of a twin.
Obviously this is just a thought experiment, but I think something like this could accomplish a lot of what the developers need and what we as skyscraper fans want. Let me know what you think.



2WTC West Side Highway View 2 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr



2WTC South Streetview 1 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr



2WTC Memorial View 2 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr


2WTC NE View 1 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr


2WTC NW View 1 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr


2WTC Twin View 1 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr


2WTC North Streetview 1 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr


2WTC NW Aerial 1 by Marshall Knight, on Flickr


WOW! Good job, nice concept.
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Old April 29th, 2017, 09:48 PM   #6142
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He did? I had no clue.
there is a thread about it in skybar in North American section.
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Old April 30th, 2017, 09:30 PM   #6143
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But,CTBUH says that Foster's design is " never completed " and the other design is " proposed " .
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Old May 1st, 2017, 06:41 AM   #6144
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lol CTBUH
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Old May 1st, 2017, 09:46 AM   #6145
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CTBUH sometimes has weird facts. Right on this topic, according to them the old 2 WTC had a height to tip of 415 meters. Looking at Photos though it included an observation deck with walkways that reached over 425 meters high, and even a smaller antenna that reached 435 meters high, so why wasn't the height to tip changed. And I am still so anxious to hear about news from this tower!!! Even the Chicago Spire site is apparently in the planning stages again for something new (but don't get too excited), and that has been abandone for 9 years now. The way this is going, we might actually see Hudson Yards Phase I and II completed before this resumes.
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Old May 1st, 2017, 10:08 AM   #6146
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Yeah, that is kinda frustrating. You take a look at Hudson Yards and see they are doing four towers at the same time and here everything takes ages.
But on another thought, maybe it's good for something we don't see right now. Just think about what would be standing in the place of 1WTC if they started construction right away with one of their first approved designs. I love the WTC complex as it is and maybe the time was necessary to get it this way.
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Old May 1st, 2017, 02:58 PM   #6147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyLoomis1982 View Post
Yeah, that is kinda frustrating. You take a look at Hudson Yards and see they are doing four towers at the same time and here everything takes ages.
But on another thought, maybe it's good for something we don't see right now. Just think about what would be standing in the place of 1WTC if they started construction right away with one of their first approved designs. I love the WTC complex as it is and maybe the time was necessary to get it this way.
Planning for what would eventually become Hudson Yards began in the late 90s/early 2000s, though...

In the end, it all comes down to financing, which ultimately prevaricates on what tenants sign on.

A 2.8-3 million sq. ft. development is not exactly going to go up in a flash. Hudson Yards is largely residential- WTC is largely not. Comparisons between the two are ultimately futile ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Old May 1st, 2017, 03:51 PM   #6148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixboi08 View Post
Planning for what would eventually become Hudson Yards began in the late 90s/early 2000s, though...

In the end, it all comes down to financing, which ultimately prevaricates on what tenants sign on.

A 2.8-3 million sq. ft. development is not exactly going to go up in a flash. Hudson Yards is largely residential- WTC is largely not. Comparisons between the two are ultimately futile ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Yeah, you are probably right. Still it "feels" like what I wrote before, at least to me. One place is going up with multiple towers at once and the other is not.

But, as mentioned before I think everything needs it's time and I can absolutely live with the slower progress at the WTC site. Maybe we should look at it this way: with the WTC we can focus more on every single project that is being built. The next goals are the finishing touches of 3WTC and the St. Nicholas Church. When they are finished hopefully the PAC will start to rise and 2WTC will follow soon.
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Old May 10th, 2017, 09:04 AM   #6149
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downtown sunset by Thomas Stürz, on Flickr
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Old May 10th, 2017, 10:00 AM   #6150
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whole lotta nuffin'
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Old May 11th, 2017, 12:07 AM   #6151
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Every time I see a new post in this topic, I get excited, then disappointed again....
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Old May 11th, 2017, 12:08 AM   #6152
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iiConTr0v3rSYx View Post
Every time I see a new post in this topic, I get excited, then disappointed again....


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Old May 11th, 2017, 01:03 AM   #6153
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I like that nothing tall will be built on the PAC site. It allows for 7WTC to still be apart of the complex.

As 3 is finishing up, it's frustrating to not see 2 being built. The gap is so obvious in most pictures now.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 12:21 AM   #6154
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2WTC being on hold forever is my favorite running joke.
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Old May 12th, 2017, 03:46 PM   #6155
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Quote:
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2WTC being on hold forever is my favorite running joke.
Wonder if Larry will live to see it all finished? He is 85 now. Maybe it is time to freeze him?
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Old May 13th, 2017, 03:33 AM   #6156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarshallKnight View Post
My desktop recently futzed out and I couldn't get Sketchup to cooperate with my laptop, but I decided to take a stab at this using TinkerCAD, since there's not much else to do with 2WTC but wait.

I decided to step back and approach things conceptually, rather than aesthetically, and laid out a few nagging issues with the current designs, as well as issues plaguing the WTC development as a whole:
  • Foster's diamond design, while beautiful, is cut from a different cloth than the other towers.
  • BIG's design is top-heavy (never mind the nauseating teetering effect), and lacks the graceful deference to the Memorial of Foster's.
  • Although the setbacks of BIG's design are more in keeping with the overall master plan, they don't have much specific relationship to the other towers in the complex.
  • Neither design creates much appearance of a "twin" to One WTC.
  • Both designs are single-use, meaning the search for a single massive office tenant has plagued the developer for years.
  • The WTC still lacks a hotel, dedicated restaurant, or residential space of its own.
To answer these issues, I've come up with a massing unlike either Foster or BIG's designs -- really it's kind of a hybrid between 3 and 4 WTC -- that I think has the following advantages:
  • The setbacks and angles of the facades are aligned to match various surfaces of the other three towers (the Northwest facade = the Northwest facade of 1WTC, the upper setback = the upper setback of 3WTC, the East facade = the upper West facade of 4WTC, etc.)
  • The pattern of the setbacks creates a visual pivot point at the NE corner of the site, not unlike the original design for 35 Hudson Yards.
  • The setbacks break up the volume into the tower into multiple programs -- trading floors at the base, large office above that, boutique office above that...
  • And the uppermost volume narrows to an ideal width for a hotel or condos, with a large terrace on the upper setback for an amenity space like a restaurant, residential pool, etc.
  • The inclusion of a hotel or residential component could jumpstart construction without an anchor tenant.
  • The setbacks and the narrow upper volume also allow more light/sightlines into the Memorial area, and preserve sightlines of 1WTC from more angles, especially from the East (where both Foster and Big's designs mostly block it)
  • With a height and width matching the roof of 1WTC, the silhouette viewed from the North is that of a twin.
Obviously this is just a thought experiment, but I think something like this could accomplish a lot of what the developers need and what we as skyscraper fans want. Let me know what you think.


[URL="https://flic.kr/p/TygFj1"]
Someone in charge of something, please see this. It's perfect!!!!
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Old May 14th, 2017, 06:11 AM   #6157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TallestKidOnTheBlock View Post
Someone in charge of something, please see this. It's perfect!!!!
That's certainly not what will think. It may look okay in a shadow view like this but in reality it wouldn't look anywhere as near as good as the original design did/would.
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Old May 14th, 2017, 07:10 PM   #6158
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It may look okay in a shadow view like this but in reality it wouldn't look anywhere as near as good as the original design did/would.

If I'd meant for anyone to take those mock-ups as a serious alternative to Fosters and BIG, I would've hired a professional renderer. I'm not an architect; I'm just experimenting with some very basic precepts of western design and working from a form-follows-function philosophy to answer a challenge posed in this thread.

Like many here, I would like to see Foster's original design rise (and am heartened by the reports that it's still be on the table). But I also don't think it's egotistical to say I'd much prefer something like these massing models over BIG's offensively bad stack of disaster.
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Old May 20th, 2017, 02:35 AM   #6159
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3WTC is almost complete and there is still no news about this?
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Old May 20th, 2017, 02:48 AM   #6160
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Speaking of tower 3, has any other tenant besides GroupM even lease space in tower 3?
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