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View Poll Results: Who should host the 2015 and 2019 Rugby World Cups?
2015: England - 2019: Italy 9 11.25%
2015: England - 2019: Japan 14 17.50%
2015: England - 2019: South Africa 5 6.25%
2015: Italy - 2019: Japan 12 15.00%
2015: Italy - 2019: South Africa 6 7.50%
2015: Japan - 2019: Italy 9 11.25%
2015: Japan - 2019: South Africa 5 6.25%
2015: South Africa - 2019: Italy 8 10.00%
2015: South Africa - 2019: Japan 12 15.00%
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 10:24 AM   #221
parcdesprinces
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I'm not sure that rugby is a "minor sport" in Ireland.... Like in France, it's not the first sport, but it's much more popular than indoor sports for example (which are truly minor here, just like in Ireland I presume) !



For me that looks like a whole nation in its stadium (as it should be everywhere):

image hosted on flickr











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Old September 3rd, 2009, 01:03 PM   #222
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Originally Posted by krudmonk View Post
What a shame. Canada would have been better off staying with their commonwealth brothers in playing rugby instead of modifying their game like our country did. Rugby is a minor sport in Ireland and Australia yet they fare pretty well on the international stage. Canada could have been there.
Any sport that attracts 80,000+ people regularly can hardly be called minor.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 01:53 PM   #223
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Originally Posted by Calvin W View Post
Yes Canada actually participates and does fairly well in Rugby. An awesome sport to play and pretty decent to watch as well.
I'm flabbergasted at how Canada manages to field a team capable of 13th when you consider where the sport is in this country. It's very impressive, but unfortunately I don't think it will translate into support amongst the general population.

I read somewhere that rugby was one of the most popular sports in Canada back around 1900, but then the sport just fell right off the map. It's bizarre how a sport can lose it's grip in a country like that. I suppose if it happened, the reverse can happen too.

Do you think rugby appeals to the same crowd that watch (Canadian) football? If so, rugby might find it tough making inroads. Football is quite entrenched in the dominant culture, especially on the prairies, Nova Scotia, and increasingly in Quebec.

You're from Saskatchewan, are you not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by krudmonk View Post
What a shame. Canada would have been better off staying with their commonwealth brothers in playing rugby instead of modifying their game like our country did. Rugby is a minor sport in Ireland and Australia yet they fare pretty well on the international stage. Canada could have been there.
I suppose it depends on your point of view. Canada developed her own sports, and I think it's something Canadians can be proud of. If Canada had stuck with rugby, there may never have been gridiron. Many people don't appreciate gridiron, but that sport has made a huge cultural contribution to both Canadian and US society.
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Last edited by isaidso; September 3rd, 2009 at 02:04 PM.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 02:04 PM   #224
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Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
I'm flabbergasted at how Canada manages to field a team capable of 13th when you consider where the sport is in this country. It's very impressive, but unfortunately I don't think it will translate into support amongst the general population.

I read somewhere that rugby was one of the most popular sports in Canada back around 1900, but then the sport just fell right off the map. It's bizarre how a sport can lose it's grip in a country like that. I suppose if it happened, the reverse can happen too.

Do you think rugby appeals to the same crowd that watch (Canadian) football? If so, rugby might find it tough making inroads. Football is quite entrenched in the dominant culture, especially on the prairies, Nova Scotia, and increasingly in Quebec.

You're from Saskatchewan, are you not?

im pretty sure that the sport of rugby league (not rugby union) would far better suit nfl and cfl fans. they are starting a professional rugby league competition in america which will be featured on nbc, so you might see the sport of rugby league kick off in the states in a few years
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 02:09 PM   #225
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Originally Posted by Pimpmaster View Post
im pretty sure that the sport of rugby league (not rugby union) would far better suit nfl and cfl fans. they are starting a professional rugby league competition in america which will be featured on nbc, so you might see the sport of rugby league kick off in the states in a few years
As far as America goes, rugby is probably further developed in Canada than the United States. As mentioned, some Canadian football stadiums could accommodate rugby. Can the same be said for US football stadiums? The US football field is much smaller than the Canadian football field.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 03:54 PM   #226
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As mentioned, some Canadian football stadiums could accommodate rugby. Can the same be said for US football stadiums? The US football field is much smaller than the Canadian football field.
Not too many can. American Football field are 49m wide to Rugby Union's max of 70m. I do believe the IRB permits 65m wide fields if both team agree. Argentina play their national games at the River Plate which is marked out 65m wide, a good way to restrict an expansive running team. Australia has played Scotland in a fully sactioned test in Glasgow's Hampton Park with the field dimensions set at 65m wide instead of the 68/70m Australia is used to.

Anyway, too few American stadiums can properly fit even a 65m / 100m field with 11m in goal areas (Rugby League standard is 8m deep in goal areas), so that 71.4 yds / 134 yds. Plus the IRB required minimum of 6m (6.6 yds) space from side line to fence. Then you have the common high fences of American football stadiums so the front few rows can see over the players and coaches on the side lines, resulting in that potenial space being lost to the designed sight lines. Unlike CFL fields, a Rugby field can not be tapered in the in goal areas to fit the stadium like Edmontons Commonwealth Stadium.

The only American Football stadiums I can think off the top of my head that can fit a rugby Union field would be Kyle Field in Texas, Rentschler Field in Hartford and LandShark Stadium in Miami (wide enough in football mode but one end would would have to be slightly retracted like the baseball configuration to fit the fields length). Any american athletics stadium could obviously fit a Rugby field. The Australian Kangaroos (national Rugby League) team has played the USA on Franklin Field in Philly, also on Field turf where soem Australians suffered serious knee injuries, no doubt to the lack of familiarity to the surface.

Last edited by Walbanger; September 3rd, 2009 at 04:07 PM.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 06:20 PM   #227
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As most if not all CFL stadium can fit a Rugby Union field, I thought I'd try and make a list of American Stadiums that can fit a Rugby union field with IRB permmited but compromised dimensions of 120m/65m (71.4yds/132yds).
Note: Some venue can fit a full 68m/122m field.
Surfaces have not been considered, only physical dimensions.
Stadiums with Athletics Tracks will be have an *.

Alabama:
Jordan Hare Stadium - Auburn Tigers, Auburn
Legion Field Field - UAB Blazers, Birmingham

California:
LA Coliseum (need temporary stand removed) - USC Trojans, Los Angeles

Connecticut:
Rentschler Field - UConn, Harford

Flordia:
Land Shark Stadium - Miami Dolphins and Miami U, Miami Gardens

Illinois:
McAndrew Stadium* - Southern Illinois Salukis (great dogs), Carbondale
Memorial Stadium - Illinois Fighting Illini, Champaign

Indiana:
Scheumann Stadium - Ball State, Munice

Iowa:
Drake Stadium* - Drake Bulldogs, Des Moines

Michigan:
Ryearson Stadium* - East Michigan Eagles, Ypsilanti

New Jersey:
Rutgers Stadium - Rutgers, Piscataway

New Mexico:
University Stadium - New Mexico Lobos, Albuquerque

New York:
Schoellkopf Field* - Cornell Big Blue, Ithaca
UB Stadium* - University of Buffallo Bulls, Amhurst

North Carolina:
Kidd Brewer Stadium* - Appalacian State, Boone
Wallace Wade Stadium* - Duke, Durhan

Texas:
Kyle Field - Texas A&M, College Station
Fouts Field* - North Texas Eagles, Denton

Washington:
Husky Stadium* - Washington Huskies, Seattle
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 06:35 PM   #228
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Wallace Wade and Kidd Brewer can fit a rugby field?

I know Bank of America Stadium in Charlotte can, they was some talk of using it as one but then the rugby team realized it wouldn't be cheap.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 07:09 PM   #229
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Wallace Wade and Kidd Brewer can fit a rugby field?

I know Bank of America Stadium in Charlotte can, they was some talk of using it as one but then the rugby team realized it wouldn't be cheap.
The fact that they have athletics tracks sugests that they could fit one, I'm not saying that the in field area can but the whole sporting area inide of the stands can fit a Rugby field, as I said in the previous post I have ignored surfaces, ie the presence of a track, Astro or Field Turf.

As for Bank of America Stadium. It is wide enough but being only 122m long at its maximum fence to fence it would leave the end goal line against the fence. If a rugby team was going to use it or if it was for Rugby 7's the IRB is far more flexible for lower levels of the game, and they could have got away with 5m in goal areas to make a total field length of 121 yards, in that case the whole field would be visible.

After making the above list it has occured to me that for a World Cup to be hosted in North America and other minor rugby countries the IRB would probably be willing to use smaller dimensions, say 65m/116m (8m in goals). This would make available many more American Stadiums and Soccer stadiums in the likes of Italy and Japan.

Rugby League is less worried about the depth of in goal areas, which has seen many games played at Old Trafford while Wembley was being rebuilt.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 09:06 PM   #230
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parcdesprinces View Post
I'm not sure that rugby is a "minor sport" in Ireland.... Like in France, it's not the first sport, but it's much more popular than indoor sports for example (which are truly minor here, just like in Ireland I presume) !
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSE View Post
Any sport that attracts 80,000+ people regularly can hardly be called minor.
Bad wording. Australia's drawn 100,000 for a Bledisloe, too. I just meant that it's not the first or second (or maybe third) most popular sport in those countries. Outside of internationals, both nations have only four provincial teams playing the game at the top level.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 10:12 PM   #231
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Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
I read somewhere that rugby was one of the most popular sports in Canada back around 1900, but then the sport just fell right off the map. It's bizarre how a sport can lose it's grip in a country like that. I suppose if it happened, the reverse can happen too.
Well, it didn't fall off the map per se -- it evolved into and was succeeded by the McGill version of the game that became popular around 1870 (which McGill passed on to Harvard). Canadian Rugby didn't become popularly known as Canadian Football until about the 1940s when the CRFU began to allow the recruitment of American imports, who referred to the gridiron game as football.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 10:22 PM   #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krudmonk View Post
Bad wording. Australia's drawn 100,000 for a Bledisloe, too. I just meant that it's not the first or second (or maybe third) most popular sport in those countries. Outside of internationals, both nations have only four provincial teams playing the game at the top level.
I know Australia have drawn big crowds, I was including them along with Ireland in my original post.

I don't see the point you are making with regards to the provinces? Ireland only have four provinces, so do Wales. Australia have four, well New Zealand and South Africa only have 5 and the odds are on the 15th franchise going to Australia.

I know that they aren't the most popular sports in there country, but I'm just saying to dismiss them as minor sports is a bit unfair. I would call Rugby a minor sport in the USA. By your logic, basketball is a minor sport in America, as (I think I'm right in saying) it's not as popular as baseball or gridiron.
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Old September 3rd, 2009, 11:31 PM   #233
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I already said my original comment was poorly worded, guy.
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Old September 4th, 2009, 01:24 AM   #234
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Originally Posted by Walbanger View Post
The fact that they have athletics tracks sugests that they could fit one, I'm not saying that the in field area can but the whole sporting area inide of the stands can fit a Rugby field, as I said in the previous post I have ignored surfaces, ie the presence of a track, Astro or Field Turf.
A lot of American stadiums have tracks with a tighter radius than international tracks. Wallace Wade is only about 61 meters wide if I remember correctly.

There are plans to rip out the track though, I believe.
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Old September 4th, 2009, 02:52 AM   #235
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Originally Posted by krudmonk View Post
I already said my original comment was poorly worded, guy.
Oh right!

Sorry, I read that as you saying my reply was badly worded, hence my confusion!
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Old September 4th, 2009, 08:05 AM   #236
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A lot of American stadiums have tracks with a tighter radius than international tracks. Wallace Wade is only about 61 meters wide if I remember correctly.
Yes the infield is 61m wide, but a thanks to the ruler tool on google earth, one can see that a tempory turf could be laid over the track.
Quote:
There are plans to rip out the track though, I believe.
Really? thats cool, I'll have to read more.

A RWC will take place in North America with in the next 40 years so I do enjoy familiaring myself with the possible infrastructure, though I doubt many will still be in the same state by the time the US, Canada or both bid and host.

The very little I know of Rugby in the USA seems to be show most support is in the North East, California and Colorado, well the USA Eagles seem to play their internationals in these areas. Alabama and other southern states seem to have football stadiums that could, can fit a Rugby Field but I doubt there is anything close to support for games.
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Old September 13th, 2009, 06:18 AM   #237
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I really think it should go to Argentina at some point. I don't know how big the sport is their or if it has a Rugby Union league set up, but this country's Rugby is on the up and up so they should be contenders.
Argentina to host JWC 2010

The JWC 2010 will be hosted in the Littoral region of Argentina

The International Rugby Board has announced that Argentina will host the IRB Junior World Championship 2010.

“The Championship is hugely important to the IRB in terms of providing a platform for the next generation of international Rugby stars to showcase their skills on the international stage and develop into elite athletes. It also plays a significant role in increasing global playing standards. Argentina has the facilities and infrastructure to ensure that the Tournament will be organised to a very high standard which is vital for its success.”

“The Union has achieved significant growth in player numbers since 2007 and continues to produce outstanding results on the international stage. A key strategic objective of the Union is to bring elite international Rugby to Argentina on a regular basis and hosting the IRB Junior World Championship next year provides an excellent opportunity to showcase the best Under 20 players in the world to its passionate Rugby community.”

The tournament will be played in Argentina’s Littoral region. Rosario, Santa Fe and Paraná will all host matches, bringing a festival atmosphere to a tournament which provides the future stars of the Game with a high-intensity platform to showcase their talent.

We are extremely impressed with what the Littoral region can offer. Aside from the world class training and playing facilities, the Littoral region is ideally situated to reach out to new Rugby fans in an area where there has been significant growth in participation in recent years. I am looking forward to what will be an exciting chapter in the history of the tournament,” said IRB Tournaments Manager Philippe Bourdarias.


http://www.irb.com/jwc/news/newsid=2031668,printer.htmx
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Old September 13th, 2009, 07:37 AM   #238
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Pretty lame. Isn't Tucumán the rugby hotbed?
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Old September 14th, 2009, 04:17 AM   #239
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Well, it didn't fall off the map per se -- it evolved into and was succeeded by the McGill version of the game that became popular around 1870 (which McGill passed on to Harvard). Canadian Rugby didn't become popularly known as Canadian Football until about the 1940s when the CRFU began to allow the recruitment of American imports, who referred to the gridiron game as football.
It's true that Canada altered rugby into 'rugby-football' to form a new distinct sport, but that was in the 1860s-1870s as you mentioned. At the turn of the century, both rugby and rugby-football co-existed and were popular. Isn't it true that it's only at this juncture that rugby declined, while rugby-football became part of the dominant culture on the entire continent?

That rugby-football dropped the 'rugby' from its name to be simply called football or Canadian football is neither here nor there. It was already a distinct sport, or what we now call gridiron, well before the name change.

Judging from history, rugby on this continent has suffered from the preference for Canadian football. Whether both sports can prosper together is a big question mark. Perhaps, a rugby World Cup in Canada would be just what the sport needs to test the viability of rugby's return to prominence here? Canada may be a better choice than the United States, as football is even more entrenched in the national culture there than it is in Canada. Football culture in Canada is strong, but may be more open to supporting rugby as well.
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Last edited by isaidso; September 14th, 2009 at 04:24 AM.
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Old September 14th, 2009, 04:29 AM   #240
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"Rugby football" has always been the name of the game, as seen in the governing bodies: Rugby Football Union and Rugby Football league.
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