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Old October 31st, 2013, 05:38 PM   #6361
the man from k-town
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Old October 31st, 2013, 07:22 PM   #6362
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One57


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Old October 31st, 2013, 08:16 PM   #6363
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Another swipe at my beloved tower.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-1...for-views.html
With $90 Million Condos, Needle Towers Jostle for Views

Quote:
Two duplex apartments at the One57 condo tower have sold for more than $90 million each -- a staggering number even in Manhattan’s super-luxe market.

One57, just steps from New York’s Carnegie Hall, is not only crazy expensive, it’s super-tall for a residential building.

Designed by Paris architect Christian de Portzamparc, the tower rises to 1,000 feet, with panoramas of Central Park and midtown Manhattan.

The new building is one of perhaps a dozen needle-thin towers planned for New York. Carol Willis, the founder of Manhattan’s Skyscraper Museum, calls them “a new type in the history of the skyscraper.”

Super-slims are unique to Manhattan. “The economy of land values drives what can be built,” Willis said.

“Sky High and the Logic of Luxury,” an exhibition now on view at the museum makes that case with models, floor plans and diagrams of acrobatic engineering.

In buildings with just one sprawling residence per floor, the owner shares the views only with passing falcons.

You would think these towers would cast deep shadows for blocks around, but their skinniness minimizes the gloom.

The staggering price tags and a perception (possibly fanciful) that the universe of global billionaires is big enough to support a few hundred more units have developers rushing to erect super-slims. The competition for the best views is fierce.

Here’s my street-level assessment of the three 57th Street needles.

One57 (157 West 57th Street)

How does Extell President Gary Barnett get away with selling shiny, gift-wrapped ordinariness for top prices?

One57 crashes unceremoniously into the street, though a not-yet-installed rippling canopy may bring a note of whimsy.

The tower’s exterior, still famous for the construction crane that drooped alarmingly after Hurricane Sandy, is nearly complete.

Endless acres of cheap-looking frameless glass in cartoonish stripes and blotches of silver and pewter muddy this tower’s profile. Enough of lazy, no-character glass walls.

Skillful marketing is cheaper than real architecture. Architect Christian de Portzamparc salvages a bit of dignity with winsomely curving greenhouse hats atop the setbacks. That shaping of the views seems to have commanded the highest prices.

432 Park Avenue

Despite the name, 432 Park is really on 57th street. Developed by the CIM Group with builder Harry Macklowe, it’s rising to almost 1,400 feet as a cubic silo of concrete with 10-foot-square windows that punch the exterior.

The windows seem to be at war with the extraordinarily slender form.

If it’s finished with finesse, though, this chest-thumper might be gutsy enough to command the sky.

Inside, the monumental windows and 12.5-foot-high ceilings conjure a modernist baronial grandeur. The lowest 9,000-square-foot apartment floors will start 300 feet high -- an elevation sufficient to see past surrounding towers -- atop a pile of residential amenities.

It’s by far the most important building in New York by Vinoly, who has earned recent notoriety for a London tower with reflections that have melted auto trim.

111 W. 57th Street

This tower, by far the skinniest of the needles so far, will rise from the courtyard of the Steinway building, a stoic classical pile that houses the legendary piano showroom.

The condo will culminate in a series of bronze-trimmed setbacks and finials that visually dissolve the building into the sky. (The Steinway Building’s offices will be converted to apartments, though the ornate showroom will remain. Steinway may sell pianos elsewhere within the development).

While the midtown face of the tower thins dramatically at the top, horizontal bands of full-height glass look north to Central Park, and wrap the corners to widen the view.

Rippling moldings in terra cotta run vertically up the skinny sides. If all of these ideas meld gracefully, this will be the most alluring of the midtown super-slims.

Apartment layouts, prices and amenities are still being worked out, but the tower will accommodate no more than one residence per 5,000-square-foot floor, with some duplexes.

(“Sky High and the Logic of Luxury” runs through April 19th at the Skyscraper Museum. Information: http://www.skyscraper.org.)
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Old October 31st, 2013, 08:31 PM   #6364
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Old November 1st, 2013, 02:11 AM   #6365
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This magnificent building is dominating midtown New York, but not for long...
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Old November 1st, 2013, 05:43 AM   #6366
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Luxury Skyscraper Shadows Are Devouring Central Park - Gothamist
http://gothamist.com/2013/10/29/skys...uin_centra.php


I think that the construction boom on 57th Street may need to be reconsidered going forward. After 107 and 432, Torre Verre and 225 ... maybe its time for another Street to take the spotlight.

Don't get me wrong, I love these buildings, and I love One57. But Central Park should take precedence. Lets put some supertalls on the Harlem side. Or in Queens/Brooklyn ... Or in the Teens on Manhattan.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 06:17 AM   #6367
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Quote:
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Luxury Skyscraper Shadows Are Devouring Central Park - Gothamist http://gothamist.com/2013/10/29/skys...uin_centra.php I think that the construction boom on 57th Street may need to be reconsidered going forward. After 107 and 432, Torre Verre and 225 ... maybe its time for another Street to take the spotlight. Don't get me wrong, I love these buildings, and I love One57. But Central Park should take precedence. Lets put some supertalls on the Harlem side. Or in Queens/Brooklyn ... Or in the Teens on Manhattan.

And take away affordable housing in Harlem, Brooklyn, Queens and in the Teens in Manhattan by building these types of super highrise housing? It's not going to happen for these kinds of skyscrapers and the infrastructure in any of those areas could not handle that kind of traffic. Midtown & Lower Manhattan are the only places equipped to have high concentration of supertalls. These 2 areas also has the least Nimby resistance because they understand the importance of these types of buildings there.

It's a convincing picture. Right? They want you to think the evil shadows are like that all the time. In reality most of the year except winter the sun moves exactly East to West on 57th street. In the winter, the sun is positioned a bit differently... But you are only talking about maybe a 1 hour window that the evil shadow would have a max impact. Most of the winter is overcast anyway. Should Nasa develop a super laser to incinerate the clouds casting shadows directly into Central Park?

I mean, if Evil shadows is going to dictate how our city will be built, then we might as well eliminate all threat by chopping the top 50 floors of every skyscrapers in Manhattan and change the name of Manhattan to Manhattan beach.

In the summer I want shade & in the winter I want to be inside. If I want to get a tan and get roasted, I'll head to Sheep's Meadow, Long Beach or to the Hamptons. If that author afraid of Shadows don't like it, he can move to the Bronx, Brooklyn, Queens, Staten Island, Joisey, Westchester, and Long Island to be Evil shadow free. Rant over. Lol.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 06:29 AM   #6368
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These shadows will indeed be an issue in Central Park, especially when the sun is more to the south, and lower in the sky, as it is in the fall, winter, and early spring.

To see where the sun rises and sets throughout the year, use the app at the link below.

http://www.suncalc.net/#/40.7652,-73...13.10.31/23:27


Slide the orange ball along the time slider to see the sun's position at various times of day. Click in the date box to access the calendar to change the date.

Last edited by McSky; November 1st, 2013 at 06:37 AM.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 06:38 AM   #6369
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical_Gotham View Post
And take away affordable housing in Harlem, Brooklyn, Queens and in the Teens in Manhattan by building these types of super highrise housing? It's not going to happen for these kinds of skyscrapers and the infrastructure in any of those areas could not handle that kind of traffic. Midtown & Lower Manhattan are the only places equipped to have high concentration of supertalls. These 2 areas also has the least Nimby resistance because they understand the importance of these types of buildings there.

It's a convincing picture. Right? They want you to think the evil shadows are like that all the time. In reality most of the year except winter the sun moves exactly East to West on 57th street. In the winter, the sun is positioned a bit differently... But you are only talking about maybe a 1 hour window that the evil shadow would have a max impact. Most of the winter is overcast anyway. Should Nasa develop a super laser to incinerate the clouds casting shadows directly into Central Park?

I mean, if Evil shadows is going to dictate how our city will be built, then we might as well eliminate all threat by chopping the top 50 floors of every skyscrapers in Manhattan and change the name of Manhattan to Manhattan beach.

In the summer I want shade & in the winter I want to be inside. If I want to get a tan and get roasted, I'll head to Sheep's Meadow, Long Beach or to the Hamptons. If that author afraid of Shadows don't like it, he can move to the Bronx, Brooklyn, Queens, Staten Island, Joisey, Westchester, and Long Island to be Evil shadow free. Rant over. Lol.
Your dismissive tone suggests you don't understand the problem.

And since when do supertalls have to be built just for the elites?? Can't we have some 1000 foot tall affordable housing???
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Old November 1st, 2013, 06:49 AM   #6370
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Quote:
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And since when do supertalls have to be built just for the elites?? Can't we have some 1000 foot tall affordable housing???
I'm being dismissive cuz That author is striking fear in people and making it seem it's apocalypse for the park. How can developers profit building 1000 ft affordable housing? Funding from the govt = higher taxes for us? Those shadows at worst reach 60-61st street and that is only within maybe a hour of the day? The author of the evil shadows make it seem that those shadows are going to cover the whole park from 60th to 110th street. There is no issue. Those towers are super slim so impact is not bad as that author suggest. Not even close.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 06:54 AM   #6371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical_Gotham View Post
How can developers profit building 1000 ft affordable housing? Funding from the govt = higher taxes for us? Those shadows at worst reach 60-61st street and that is only within maybe a hour of the day? The author of the evil shadows make it seem that those shadows are going to cover the whole park from 60th to 110th street. There is no issue. Those towers are super slim so impact is not bad as that author suggest. Not even close.
The shadows cast by the older buildings have always been there, but the new shadows that will be cast by this phalanx of new supertalls along 57th Street are and order of magnitude larger than before and its being very irresponsible to NOT take them into consideration. And yes there is currently one "super slim" tower (One57) ... but array a large number of superslims ... and you get a rather large total shadow field to cope with.

Nowhere have I said "We shouldn't build" ... I'm just saying that maybe we can build elsewhere in the city after this set of newcomers (One57, Verre, 107, 432, 225) ... like Hudson Yards/Hudson Boulevard, Atlantic Yards, Long Island City, etc.

Profit is not always the motive to build things. And there is this huge entity called the New York City Government that can also build things ... and can drive the creation of building projects ... and provide incentives to build for non traditional clients.

But that's a conversation for a separate thread. I brought it up tangentially in here because the impetus for the article was the shadow that One57 is casting on Central Park.

I do think that too many people, maybe myself included, have been too caught up in what the view OF the tower looks like and not what the tower does to the city around it. And a reminder once and a while about the realities of shadows in cities is worthwhile.

Last edited by Riley1066; November 1st, 2013 at 07:01 AM.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 07:02 AM   #6372
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There are many places building affordable housing. It's called Harlem, Bronx, Queens, Lower East Side etc.. Midtown is the worlds greatest business center. Honestly, IMO affordable housing should not have a place there. Yes I agree we should mindful about shadows and the city does take that into account. I dunno. Nimbyism = fear and that's what the author is trying to do.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 07:08 AM   #6373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertical_Gotham View Post
Nimbyism = fear and that's what the author is trying to do.
I think your definition of the "Back Yard" part of NIMBY needs to be re-assessed.

If the "Back Yard" in this case is just the high 50s Streets ... that's not a huge subtraction from the total number of places that can grow really really tall in New York City.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 07:24 AM   #6374
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Look I know you're all for the current supertalls proposed along 57th, it's just honestly IMO the effect won't be as bad even once all of those will be built. This is why midtown east rezoning is important cuz that is an area that developers can concentrate.

The problem is you have authors fearing the shadows from new towers will swallow up the Chrysler as well and block the view of the Chrysler from Jersey. There are so many reasons... Like I said. Nimbyism = fear. Even in the 50th streets down to the 30's. Heck, I'll go as far as the 20's actually. Forget the teens down to TriBeCa. Nimbyism is iron clad there. So what r the area's left to build such buildings?

Soon, there is no place to build other than making a cloud city.

1,000 ft Affordable housing skyscrapers sprouting around the city = Gene Kaufmans of the world. I shudder the thought.
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Last edited by Vertical_Gotham; November 1st, 2013 at 07:56 AM.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 02:15 PM   #6375
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Quote:
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That eiffel tower looks 100 feet tall
if wikipedia is to believed it is 108m as tall as the eiffel tower replica in the shenzhen world park. so 1:3 to scale of the original tower
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Old November 1st, 2013, 02:53 PM   #6376
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Originally Posted by the man from k-town View Post
you can actually see 432Park rising already.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 03:09 PM   #6377
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From the bloomberg article
'Super-slims are unique to Manhattan. “The economy of land values drives what can be built,” Willis said.'

That's rubbish. Hong Kong is full of them. So is Dubai.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 05:42 PM   #6378
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I would suspect they mean among US markets.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 05:56 PM   #6379
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Quote:
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you can actually see 432Park rising already.


If you don't know where to look it might be a bit hard to spot. Pointed it out.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 08:30 PM   #6380
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Greetings from London

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