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Old January 2nd, 2009, 08:14 PM   #101
bigbossman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpicyMcHaggis View Post
Because basketball and football clubs don't have the same owners?
olympiacos do http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympiacos_CFP

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socratis_Kokkalis

and so do many others...
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Old January 2nd, 2009, 08:16 PM   #102
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Not true at all, the NBA owes nothing to FIBA or Euroleague, it is richer and more powerful. If it says jump the rest of the basketball world says... how high. If the NBA wanted to introduce a team in europe theres nothing FIBA can really do, as mentioned by someone else previously, it works in football because FIFA and UEFA run all the competitions, but in Basketball the NBA aren't governed by FIBA infact they have different rules!
I was planning to reply to all of what you said but when i saw this part... i will stop here. Bye.
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Old January 2nd, 2009, 08:17 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
No they are not. Olympiacos Basketball club is owned by Angelopoulos brothers. Did you even read the links you posted?

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so are Real madrid and barcelona
Those clubs don't have owners since they aren't private. Anyway seems to me that you have lack of any sports knowledge so i'll give up from further discussion.
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Old January 2nd, 2009, 08:20 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
CFP is the football team

BC is the basketball team

The owners are the Angelopoulos brothers

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympiacos_BC

Very rarely a football team has the same owner with the basketball team
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Old January 2nd, 2009, 08:21 PM   #105
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And that was my last post.
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Old January 2nd, 2009, 08:23 PM   #106
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No they are not. Olympiacos Basketball club is owned by Angelopoulos brothers. Did you even read the links you posted?
Point is it's just a diversionary tactic by you. Granted i was wrong, i read that he chaired the whole organistation and assumed that meant the specifics, shoot me why don't you

Quote:
Those clubs don't have owners since they aren't private. Anyway seems to me that you have lack of any sports knowledge so i'll give up from further discussion
hence why i changed my point before you posted yours, it's clear that you have changed the discussion as i had disproved your points, anyway, nice chatting
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Old January 2nd, 2009, 09:09 PM   #107
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I was planning to reply to all of what you said but when i saw this part... i will stop here. Bye.
he does have a point though...thats why FIBA is changing a lot of their rules to coincide with the NBA
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Old January 2nd, 2009, 11:08 PM   #108
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Its like saying in footaball, Arsenal will stop playing in the Premier league and the Champions League and join the American MLS.



No, it is like saying the Chicago Fire or New York Red Bull would be given a chance to join Premier league. Why would Arsenal go join an inferior league? Teams (or new teams) would perhaps be inclined to join a richer more prestigious leagues.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 12:28 AM   #109
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he does have a point though...thats why FIBA is changing a lot of their rules to coincide with the NBA
It's different to be a partner or taking ideas from the best than be a servant. More or less he is saying that we are servants of the americans.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 12:30 AM   #110
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It's different to be a partner or taking ideas from the best than be a servant. More or less he is saying that we are servants of the americans.
when did i say you were servants... sort out your inferiority complex.

The NBA is better clearly, you can't argue with that!
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 12:33 AM   #111
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No, it is like saying the Chicago Fire or New York Red Bull would be given a chance to join Premier league. Why would Arsenal go join an inferior league? Teams (or new teams) would perhaps be inclined to join a richer more prestigious leagues.
Then if they care so much to involve the game in London then why they aren't doing the obvious? Enjoy the league of their continent, the biggest and most important league in the world (after NBA), the Euroleague? What they are waiting?
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Last edited by KONSTANTINOUPOLIS; January 3rd, 2009 at 12:42 AM.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 12:35 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
when did i say you were servants... sort out your inferiority complex.

The NBA is better clearly, you can't argue with that!
Basically this is what you said:

"If it says jump the rest of the basketball world says... how high. If the NBA wanted to introduce a team in europe theres nothing FIBA can really do
"

How would you describe this relationship?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbossman
The NBA is better clearly, you can't argue with that!
Did i said otherwise?

As for the inferiority complex, i am not the one who is repeating all the time about how great his city is. You are the one who is doing that.
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Last edited by KONSTANTINOUPOLIS; January 3rd, 2009 at 12:44 AM.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 01:07 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by bigbossman View Post
Real MAdrid would keep their current team, but would pay for a franchise slot in the NBA. and would call it Real Madird
And why would they do that??
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 01:11 AM   #114
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And why would they do that??
i never said they would... but if european franchises were made available... it could happen!
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 01:26 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KONSTANTINOUPOLIS View Post
Basically this is what you said:

"If it says jump the rest of the basketball world says... how high. If the NBA wanted to introduce a team in europe theres nothing FIBA can really do
"

How would you describe this relationship?
what has that got to with servants. That statement illustrates where the power is in the game of basketball. You read your own agenda into it. The NBA can do as she pleases as she has no one in basketball to hold her accountable... the NBA doesn't however rock the boat, but there is no reason why if she did she would lose out...

Quote:
Did i said otherwise?
If you didn't say otherwise why are you complaining about statements which affirm it then...

Quote:
As for the inferiority complex, i am not the one who is repeating all the time about how great his city is. You are the one who is doing that.
When did i ever say London was great, i never once bigged up London, i merely repeated the point that London a growing basketball market has great potential, which any economist would tell you, it does.

Howevere, you were the one trying to affirm the point at every opportunity, that London basketball is crap (which i agreed with), and greek basketball is better (which i also agreed with). But unfortunately that was never the issue in this debate..
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 01:43 AM   #116
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Then if they care so much to involve the game in London then why they aren't doing the obvious? Enjoy the league of their continent, the biggest and most important league in the world (after NBA), the Euroleague? What they are waiting?
as unreadable as that is...

In Britain Basketball is seen largely as the NBA full stop. Thats why the only way basketball would gain a foothold in Britain is if loads of good players came over to play and represent us!

The main reason the BBL will never succeed is that it isn't a quality product! As i mentioned previously only established sports in Britain have fans with a high tolerance to quality. whether Euroleague is high quality or not, the name means nothing to the majority of sports fans over here, but everyone has heard of the NBA.

therefore

if a sport is to grow in a nation where it has a small foothold (like it does in Britain, despite a substantial following), it can do so in many ways, here are two...

A. grow the game from grass routes level and let it build in popularity over the years (this is along process),

or

B. you can expose the population to high quality sport and hope to capture their imagination (short process).

Option A is what has been persued in the past, option B is what would happen if the NBA expanded into London and as the exhibition games have proven this option does tons more to stimulate the populace of Britain towards basketball than the BBL ever did or ever will do.

This is a British argument for the NBA expanding, i dare say in other countries there would be different reasoning, but as i have repeatedly said i see no reason why it can't be a success over here...
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 03:09 AM   #117
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I think it would be cool to get both an Asian and European division on board. I would think that the NBA would be shy about taking both on board at the same time though. The NBA would probably see what success it had in Europe before it sets up shop in Asia.

Four or five teams in a Asia and Europe divisions would work. To the one person who said is 32 teams for a league? I don't think it matters much as long as the divisions and conferences have the same number of teams. The only serious wonder I have is if there was a talent drop off from its players. More then any other sport basketball depends on their superstars and their is only so many impact superstars that make their teams competitive (one of the reasons I love the NFL over the NBA as its less superstar dependant). Also an Asian/Europe conference would make the league a truly 24/7 league but scheduling times with East Asia and the U.S. is much more complicated compared to the 5-7 hour European/NA difference. Will people early in the morning in Tokyo or Chicago really wake up early to watch their team on TV play on the road? That said, if I were to recommend a four or five team addition I would go.

Europe
1.) London
2.) Madrid
3.) Milan
4.) Berlin (or perhaps Frankfurt, Munich, Hamburg if they provide a better arena deal)
If a fifth team - Barcelona or Rome

Asia
1.) Tokyo
2.) Shanghai
3.) Seoul
4.) Osaka
If five either Hong Kong or Beijing...Would love to give it to Manila given the Philippines is basketball mad but don't know if they have a wealthy enough economy.
.
Diluting the talent of the league would be my biggest concern of such a large league. 10 more teams would of eat up much of the draft pool. Also, in such a global league---would cities like Memphis, Milwaukee, Salt Lake City, Sacramento, Portland, Oklahoma City, or New Orleans have a place in a league with these new, rich mega cities?
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 03:16 AM   #118
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How many people in Europe would automaticaly have a bias against the league because its American? Like everything, they would assume we are trying to force our culture down your throats.

Perhaps the league needs to look at China before putting teams in Spain or wherever. A Bucks-Rockets game of no importance last year drew an estimated 200 million t.v. audience in China. Can't argue with those numbers.
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 03:50 AM   #119
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The only way I could imagin it working is if they made a full size European League and had interleague play mid-season like the MLB does. That way you only have do the traveling overseas during one portion of the season and durring the championship series.

How long of a flight and what is the time differnce from LA or Utah to Berlin?
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Old January 3rd, 2009, 04:26 AM   #120
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How many people in Europe would automaticaly have a bias against the league because its American? Like everything, they would assume we are trying to force our culture down your throats.
The league may be based in the USA, but basketball is not US culture. Basketball is Canadian and US culture. The sport's roots are strongly rooted in both countries. Even the NBA can trace its roots to Canada. The first NBA game ever was played in Canada, not the USA.

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Originally Posted by Judge Phillip Banks View Post
Diluting the talent of the league would be my biggest concern of such a large league. 10 more teams would of eat up much of the draft pool. Also, in such a global league---would cities like Memphis, Milwaukee, Salt Lake City, Sacramento, Portland, Oklahoma City, or New Orleans have a place in a league with these new, rich mega cities?
It's inevitable that the talent pool for NBA teams in Canada and the US will get diluted. As professional basketball continues to develop around the world, top players will one day have opportunities to make equal money in Europe, Asia, and even south America.

Not only will Memphis, Milwaukee, Salt Lake City, Sacramento, Portland, Oklahoma City, and New Orleans get permanently shut out, but it also explains why practically all of Canada goes without NBA teams as well. Beyond Toronto, there simply aren't cities big enough in Canada to compete with cities as populated as Chicago, Dallas, Los Angeles, etc.

If the NBA wants to remain the premier basketball league in the world without diluting the talent base, the likely outcome is that half the NBA franchises in the US will lose their teams to cities like Beijing, Istanbul, and Sao Paolo, etc.

Looking 20 to 30 years out, any city under 6 million might find themselves in a precarious situation as team owners look to move to bigger, richer cities beyond north America. Cleveland, Detroit, Indianapolis (Indiana), Milwaukee, Charlotte, Orlando, Denver, Minneapolis (Minnesota), Oklahoma City, Portland, Salt Lake City (Utah), Oakland (Golden State), Phoenix, Sacramento, Memphis, New Orleans, and San Antonio will all be in big trouble. Boston, Atlanta, Miami, Washington, Dallas, and Houston may be safe, but even they will face increasingly intense competition from larger foreign markets.

This may sound outlandish to an American, but if Buffalo can lose the Bills to Toronto, Boston can lose the Celtics to Shanghai. A city with a market of 6 million people competing with a city with a market of 20 million? The US and Canada are rich, but the rest of the world is rapidly catching up. NBA fans in the US should be more concerned with keeping the teams they have than seeking further expansion of the NBA in their country.
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Last edited by isaidso; January 3rd, 2009 at 04:44 AM.
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