Three Spires | Southwark | 250m/200m/100m | 66/50/31 fl | Pre-planning - Page 6

golddex · January 25th, 2009, 02:34 PM

I wouldnt worry about the influence of these 3 towers on the Shard, since Guy's hospital already puts paid to having it stand alone.

and i agree with the designer Zhandra Rhodes to have more parkland - this area is very gritty and the only way to get the bankers to move from the west end is offer them some greenspaces.

Smoggie_Si · January 25th, 2009, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by golddex

and i agree with the designer Zhandra Rhodes to have more parkland - this area is very gritty and the only way to get the bankers to move from the west end is offer them some greenspaces.

Jeez, ffs has anyone commenting on this scheme actually been around the area?

Bermondsey Street is chockful of lawyers and bankers, it is an extremely trendy and desirable area, full of the kind of loft warehouses that the more cutting edge City folk love. My neighbours are almost all City finance or legal people, designers or doctors. This is not some grimy area in need of regeneration, it ain't even an up and coming area like it was 3 years ago when I moved here, it's upped and come already. This scheme is a cherry on top, it isn't a catalyst for regeneration. Sellar needs this scheme to go ahead more than the SE1 community does.

I do agree with Zandra that some more green space would be nice but there are already plenty of nice green spaces nearby. Speaking of which, getting Zandra onside with this scheme will be crucial to the developers. She's been instrumental to the regeneration of Bermondsey Street and her opinion holds a lot of water with the local community who can be very vocal when they are opposed to a proposed development, witness the Recall site on Bermondsey Street!

DarJoLe · January 25th, 2009, 11:22 PM

This is the site in question. Until we see the scheme in detail of course I can't comment on what buildings will be staying or what will be going, but the photos below show the current structures on the site. I don't think it will include the 1970s office blocks which appear 'in front' of Guys in the first photo, but will be placed on what is the temporary car park space in the foreground.

Obviously it's very early to comment, but unless this has some kind of magical base area, I don't see this huge project being an easy neighbour with the low scale buildings to the south, especially the residential estates. The Shard manages it partly because it is over the station, and almost feels as if it floats above London Bridge. This scheme will very much be part of the fabric of the surrounding streets, and needs a very well designed 'sense of place' that manages to bleed into its boundaries. Having visited the site now, I've had few ideas that would make this scheme work with regards to its relationship to the London Bridge railway arches, I'll go into more detail tomorrow.

image hosted on flickr

image hosted on flickr

delores · January 26th, 2009, 02:23 AM

Knowing the area quiet well I have to say this street is a gritty part of Old London that is in need of some tender loving care. I am a bit concerned though that the towers will make it even darker than it is already is and as Darljole points out will really have to knit the area's together down bermondsy street as so not to destroy what is actually good there.

TampaMike · January 26th, 2009, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wjfox

Typical NIMBY reaction -

http://www.london-se1.co.uk/forum/read/1/101078/page=2

"Oh for F**** sake!

This is what I was afraid of. One stupid great tower gets permission and now they think "Lets squash everything and make loads of money with lots more stupid great towers."
I hope the whole ruddy lot of them go bust."

Are some of these people fucking serious? Is this even affecting them at all or just another poor excuse to keep on bitching? They do know that Shard or this project will bring in 10000000x more than each of their houses do,right?

But I want to see renders first. According to what we have seen, it looks like someone pulled the spine outta three towers.

Gherkin · January 26th, 2009, 03:02 AM

Is there a helipad on Guys Tower? I'd imagine there are a few health and safety laws that would be broken if all of these towers go up so close to the hospital.

potto · January 26th, 2009, 10:03 AM

Nope

london lad · January 26th, 2009, 10:40 AM

The 1970's blocks are a separate scheme for a student block at around 98-98m.

The extent to how this area can develop, especially with regards high rise development its defined by the area in the pictures which is mainly carparks and possibly the site of the old warehouse. Nothing will ever be allowed of height past this site as the area is pretty much predefined as predominately lowrise housing.

I would expect architects of the calibre of H&M to have taken into consideration the surrounding area and Sellar would also have this in mind what with the trouble he has had to get to get the Shard through planning. I would expect the towers to be rather slim & based to the north of the site so to avoid completely overshadowing the 4-5 estates to the South. Behind the scenes work have been ongoing for at least 6 months, probably more so numerous meetings would already have been made with Southwark, the mayors office & local stakeholders.

It is worth considering that the Shard, although further up the road in a denser & predominately non residential area will still dominate the surrounding area as you would expect a 1,000 foot tower would do. Also the redeveloped London Bridge station, which at around 8-10 storeys will in no way be as tall as any tower but will be a large block sitting on top of the already high railway viaduct so will also loom over the immediate area.

I guess we will have to wait for the plans to be released in a couple of weeks before we can realistically weigh the pros & cons.

El_Greco · January 26th, 2009, 05:57 PM

Why do they always build crap buildings to house students?

Gherkin · January 26th, 2009, 09:57 PM

Because students don't have the money to live in luxury flats.

the spliff fairy · January 27th, 2009, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Greco

Why do they always build crap buildings to house students?

Textbook capitalism

Comdot · January 27th, 2009, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smoggie_Si

Jeez, ffs has anyone commenting on this scheme actually been around the area?

si, you are definitely our resident expert on the area and i should hope so seeing as you live just round the corner.

jayo · January 28th, 2009, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gherkin007

Because students don't have the money to live in luxury flats.

Look at parkway gate in Manchester.

london lad · January 28th, 2009, 09:39 PM

Theres an article on this in the ES homes & property supplement. I don't know if the writer knows a bit more or is widely exaggerating & is not very accurate with his descriptions.

Firstly he says the new quarters as big as CW and incorporates Guys hospital (30 acres) which is included in the scheme. He says the planning application is due to be lodged on 17th Feb.

Not sure on the accuracy of the ES reporting (& I don't rate it very highly as it says the development could start by the end of the year which is doubtful) but if Guys is included im sure G&ST have mentioned in a feasibility study before that there is the possibility of the area between this development & Guys tower could potentially be sold of to private developers.

Gonna be interesting to find out these plans in a couple of weeks.

Comdot · January 28th, 2009, 09:41 PM

london hospital towers nearing completion and now this is mentioned...

london lad · January 28th, 2009, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comdot

london hospital towers nearing completion and now this is mentioned...

Nothing really in common though as both hospitals generally serve different parts of London and are different NHS Trusts.

Comdot · January 28th, 2009, 09:55 PM

wild speculation but with one 'superhospital' complete they will be able to commission another and that could be used in replacing guy's? does anyone on here know the hospital plans for the future?

twilight_2008 · January 28th, 2009, 10:49 PM

I wouldn't exactly cry if Guy's was demolished, especially if it was a part of this development.

Manuel · January 28th, 2009, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by london lad

Firstly he says the new quarters as big as CW and incorporates Guys hospital (30 acres) which is included in the scheme. He says the planning application is due to be lodged on 17th Feb.

And the developer is supposed to be in discussion with the council and GLA for only 6 months? either the proposal is much older or the application is not submitted in february...that looks a very short period of time for such a massive development...

Comdot · January 28th, 2009, 11:09 PM

so was there a public consultation held on the 'three houses'?

January 25th, 2009, 11:22 PM	#103
DarJoLe Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: London Posts: 15,667 Likes (Received): 394	This is the site in question. Until we see the scheme in detail of course I can't comment on what buildings will be staying or what will be going, but the photos below show the current structures on the site. I don't think it will include the 1970s office blocks which appear 'in front' of Guys in the first photo, but will be placed on what is the temporary car park space in the foreground. Obviously it's very early to comment, but unless this has some kind of magical base area, I don't see this huge project being an easy neighbour with the low scale buildings to the south, especially the residential estates. The Shard manages it partly because it is over the station, and almost feels as if it floats above London Bridge. This scheme will very much be part of the fabric of the surrounding streets, and needs a very well designed 'sense of place' that manages to bleed into its boundaries. Having visited the site now, I've had few ideas that would make this scheme work with regards to its relationship to the London Bridge railway arches, I'll go into more detail tomorrow. image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr image hosted on flickr __________________ "I can quite confidently and with pride say that if everything goes to plan London 2012 will be the best Olympic Games and will surpass Barcelona and Sydney in terms of atmosphere, style and achievement. And not just about the sport. The whole city and its people will come alive and want to be a part of this. It just feels right." DarJoLe, May 19th 2006.

January 26th, 2009, 05:57 PM	#109
El_Greco I Like Palm Trees Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London Posts: 16,757 Likes (Received): 270	Why do they always build crap buildings to house students? __________________ My Photos : Lisbon\|Madrid\|Rome\|Naples\|London\|Rotterdam\|Fes

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January 25th, 2009, 02:34 PM	#101
golddex Registered User Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: London Posts: 206 Likes (Received): 0	I wouldnt worry about the influence of these 3 towers on the Shard, since Guy's hospital already puts paid to having it stand alone. and i agree with the designer Zhandra Rhodes to have more parkland - this area is very gritty and the only way to get the bankers to move from the west end is offer them some greenspaces.

January 26th, 2009, 02:23 AM	#104
delores Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 4,563 Likes (Received): 25	Knowing the area quiet well I have to say this street is a gritty part of Old London that is in need of some tender loving care. I am a bit concerned though that the towers will make it even darker than it is already is and as Darljole points out will really have to knit the area's together down bermondsy street as so not to destroy what is actually good there.

January 26th, 2009, 03:02 AM	#106
Gherkin actual gherkin Join Date: May 2005 Location: Leeds Posts: 13,730 Likes (Received): 160	Is there a helipad on Guys Tower? I'd imagine there are a few health and safety laws that would be broken if all of these towers go up so close to the hospital.

January 26th, 2009, 10:03 AM	#107
potto Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: London Posts: 13,498 Likes (Received): 250	Nope

January 26th, 2009, 10:40 AM	#108
london lad Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 8,155 Likes (Received): 45	The 1970's blocks are a separate scheme for a student block at around 98-98m. The extent to how this area can develop, especially with regards high rise development its defined by the area in the pictures which is mainly carparks and possibly the site of the old warehouse. Nothing will ever be allowed of height past this site as the area is pretty much predefined as predominately lowrise housing. I would expect architects of the calibre of H&M to have taken into consideration the surrounding area and Sellar would also have this in mind what with the trouble he has had to get to get the Shard through planning. I would expect the towers to be rather slim & based to the north of the site so to avoid completely overshadowing the 4-5 estates to the South. Behind the scenes work have been ongoing for at least 6 months, probably more so numerous meetings would already have been made with Southwark, the mayors office & local stakeholders. It is worth considering that the Shard, although further up the road in a denser & predominately non residential area will still dominate the surrounding area as you would expect a 1,000 foot tower would do. Also the redeveloped London Bridge station, which at around 8-10 storeys will in no way be as tall as any tower but will be a large block sitting on top of the already high railway viaduct so will also loom over the immediate area. I guess we will have to wait for the plans to be released in a couple of weeks before we can realistically weigh the pros & cons.

January 26th, 2009, 09:57 PM	#110
Gherkin actual gherkin Join Date: May 2005 Location: Leeds Posts: 13,730 Likes (Received): 160	Because students don't have the money to live in luxury flats.

January 28th, 2009, 09:39 PM	#114
london lad Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: London Posts: 8,155 Likes (Received): 45	Theres an article on this in the ES homes & property supplement. I don't know if the writer knows a bit more or is widely exaggerating & is not very accurate with his descriptions. Firstly he says the new quarters as big as CW and incorporates Guys hospital (30 acres) which is included in the scheme. He says the planning application is due to be lodged on 17th Feb. Not sure on the accuracy of the ES reporting (& I don't rate it very highly as it says the development could start by the end of the year which is doubtful) but if Guys is included im sure G&ST have mentioned in a feasibility study before that there is the possibility of the area between this development & Guys tower could potentially be sold of to private developers. Gonna be interesting to find out these plans in a couple of weeks.

January 28th, 2009, 09:41 PM	#115
Comdot Taikun Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Manchester Posts: 10,199 Likes (Received): 0	london hospital towers nearing completion and now this is mentioned...

January 28th, 2009, 09:55 PM	#117
Comdot Taikun Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Manchester Posts: 10,199 Likes (Received): 0	wild speculation but with one 'superhospital' complete they will be able to commission another and that could be used in replacing guy's? does anyone on here know the hospital plans for the future?

January 28th, 2009, 10:49 PM	#118
twilight_2008 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Stourbridge, West Midlands Posts: 1,325 Likes (Received): 0	I wouldn't exactly cry if Guy's was demolished, especially if it was a part of this development.

January 28th, 2009, 11:09 PM	#120
Comdot Taikun Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Manchester Posts: 10,199 Likes (Received): 0	so was there a public consultation held on the 'three houses'?