BADAGRY | Badagry 10-Lane Expressway Construction Project

[JoblessBeggar]

Originally Posted by pappy

I agree with you and I've actually voiced similar concern on this site before. I just don't see how this ground level light rail will work in Lagos knowing the kind of city Lagos is. But people see renders and they get excited without realizing that this thing, though well-intentioned, will fail eventually.

Exactly what kind of city is Lagos? And how do you define failure for a project that will add six additional lanes, including light rail and BRT facilities?

This project is in Badagry, where there is lots of available land for the expressway's expansion. Why would anyone incur the unnecessary extra expense of using elevations or sub-ground structures for such a straightforward project (that is already projected to cost about $2 billion as currently designed).

[JoblessBeggar]

Originally Posted by Naija

My problem with such projects in Nigeria is that they take eternity to complete. Just take the V.I.- Epe Expressway has an example that has 3km finished on an average of 1 year!!!!!

Again, we have to differentiate between greenfield projects and redesign/upgrade projects especially a PPP project.

In such a PPP project, construction is a sequential activity in many respects. For example, a key factor influencing the timely execution of the project, is securing the Right of Way by Lagos State. This involves the requisition of land from and payment of compensation to landowners; removal of obstructions from the Right of Way; relocation of utility services (e.g., PHCN pylons/cables, Lagos Water Corporation pipes, and fibre optic cables belonging to telecom operators). Accordingly, works progress is directly linked to the pace at which the Right of Way has been handed over to LCC free of encumbrances (including the resolution of lawsuits).

The project itself, which had to co-exist with an estimated daily traffic load of about 50,000+ cars, involved the expansion of the road from 4 to 6 lanes, and the replacement of the existing asphalt base with a three-layered sub-base of cement-treated sand, stone-base and asphalt secured to the base, while plied the road every day. In fact, many key features of the newly refurbished stretch are not visible to the naked eye because they are buried in designated locations underneath the road surface (e.g., in new banks of service ducts installed to house fibre-optics and other cables). The project also involved the clearing the verges, and construction of new boundary walls (after knocking down the existing walls), drainage channels, central reservation, underground ducts, storm water culverts, kerbs and crossings, retaining walls, and the installation of street lights.

[Nsukka]

Originally Posted by JoblessBeggar

Again, we have to differentiate between greenfield projects and redesign/upgrade projects especially a PPP project.

In such a PPP project, construction is a sequential activity in many respects. For example, a key factor influencing the timely execution of the project, is securing the Right of Way by Lagos State. This involves the requisition of land from and payment of compensation to landowners; removal of obstructions from the Right of Way; relocation of utility services (e.g., PHCN pylons/cables, Lagos Water Corporation pipes, and fibre optic cables belonging to telecom operators). Accordingly, works progress is directly linked to the pace at which the Right of Way has been handed over to LCC free of encumbrances (including the resolution of lawsuits).

The project itself, which had to co-exist with an estimated daily traffic load of about 50,000+ cars, involved the expansion of the road from 4 to 6 lanes, and the replacement of the existing asphalt base with a three-layered sub-base of cement-treated sand, stone-base and asphalt secured to the base, while plied the road every day. In fact, many key features of the newly refurbished stretch are not visible to the naked eye because they are buried in designated locations underneath the road surface (e.g., in new banks of service ducts installed to house fibre-optics and other cables). The project also involved the clearing the verges, and construction of new boundary walls (after knocking down the existing walls), drainage channels, central reservation, underground ducts, storm water culverts, kerbs and crossings, retaining walls, and the installation of street lights.

Damn, you're still trying hard to make excuses for the ever so typical bad planning and poor/slow worth work efforts of the Nigerian social structure.

[sammyjay77]

Nsukka, are you saying this is going to be badly done or you just want us to follow the trend of the western world where they have subways or elevated rails?

What then happens to originality?

[JoblessBeggar]

Originally Posted by Nsukka

Damn, you're still trying hard to make excuses for the ever so typical bad planning and poor/slow worth work efforts of the Nigerian social structure.

Thanks for the stereotypical generalizations, my "African-American" brother.

Anyway, I was merely discussing the peculiarities (that may not readily be apparent to most) of ONE specific project that I am familiar with, simply because someone specifically mentioned it. Conversely, there are several other road projects in Lagos (Ajose-Adeogun, Ademola Adetukunboh, Bourdillion dualisation, ecectra) that were completed in barely a few months. Accordingly, it can be inappropriate to make overly broad generalizations -- no more than it would be for me to make generalizations of the US based on the fact that it took about 20 years (and a cost overrun of almost $20 billion) to complete the 3.5 mile "big dig" road project in Boston.

A seminal life lesson is that truly smart folks never draw conclusions BEFORE listening to all sides of any story.

[Nsukka]

Originally Posted by sammyjay77

Nsukka, are you saying this is going to be badly done or you just want us to follow the trend of the western world where they have subways or elevated rails?

What then happens to originality?

Look, all I'm saying is that it shows a total lack of foresight and one may even argue incompetence to put a project like this right at ground level, and especially if they do not place some sort of wall or fencing up along the outer edges, while it running right through major urban districts.

I'm hoping that they at least are sensible and considerate enough to install a wall or fencing around the project if they are so bold as to put this SPEEDWAY right at ground level while running right through the middle of major residential and commercial areas.

You can't just have this type of system flowing right through a populated area all half-assed as if it were just any ol regular roadway. It needs to be pointedly isolated from the surrounding areas with access to it made very difficult without going through the ways in which access to it was engineered to be. These access points should be well spaced at about intervals of no less than about 2 miles, though most reasonably it should be about every 3 miles on average in which will allow for better spacing for more fluid merging and exiting of traffic into the ISOLATED system.. thus maintaining its desired purpose and integrity in which is to move traffic along smoothly and seamlessly.

In most places in the world the Isolation of the network is achieved via simply elevating the whole system up off of the ground and or sinking it about 30 to 50 feet or so below ground, some systems are even walled off.

Fencing is least commonly seen, in that it is least pronounced and its integrity is often diminished via vandalism of the fencing in which destroys the engineered isolated consistency of the network from the public... designed to protect the public from the many dangers in which are faced via access to the system outside of the points in which were specifically established for that purpose. This project is very nice and can be very helpful to the public, though at the same time, if it is not monitored and structured properly it can also quickly turn into one of the public's worst death traps.

[Nsukka]

Originally Posted by JoblessBeggar

Thanks for the stereotypical generalizations, my "African-American" brother.

Anyway, I was merely discussing the peculiarities (that may not readily be apparent to most) of ONE specific project that I am familiar with, simply because someone specifically mentioned it. Conversely, there are several other road projects in Lagos (Ajose-Adeogun, Ademola Adetukunboh, Bourdillion dualisation, ecectra) that were completed in barely a few months. Accordingly, it can be inappropriate to make overly broad generalizations -- no more than it would be for me to make generalizations of the US based on the fact that it took about 20 years (and a cost overrun of almost $20 billion) to complete the 3.5 mile "big dig" road project in Boston.

A seminal life lesson is that truly smart folks never draw conclusions BEFORE listening to all sides of any story.

I'm not being stereotypical on this issue UnemployedBeggar, I'm just stating the facts as they stand. You know and I know that it isn't all that common for things to be done in Naija with the set demand to have the finished product be safe and asteticly appealing, in that most often it usually all about throwing up any ol half-ass finished product and getting it into serving its intended purpose, all while the thing looking like crap, it's lacking in safty quality.

Sifficiant funds are not spent on it to mantian what little sppeal and integrity it may posess.. thus worsoning the situation over a short span of time. This is too often the Nigerian way, and we all know it very well.

Many simply don't seem to know the value of taking pride in the presentation of your work, the product you put out is a direct showing of your integrity and a direct reflection of who you are as a person. If you half-ass almost everything you do, then I can rightly assume that you will have comparable concern for my personal well being while in the mids of you work.

[SportBilly]

Originally Posted by Nsukka

Look, all I'm saying is that it shows a total lack of foresight and one may even argue incompetence to put a project like this right at ground level, and especially if they do not place some sort of wall or fencing up along the outer edges, while it running right through major urban districts.

I'm hoping that they at least are sensible and considerate enough to install a wall or fencing around the project if they are so bold as to put this SPEEDWAY right at ground level while running right through the middle of major residential and commercial areas.

You can't just have this type of system flowing right through a populated area all half-assed as if it were just any ol regular roadway. It needs to be pointedly isolated from the surrounding areas with access to it made very difficult without going through the ways in which access to it was engineered to be. These access points should be well spaced at about intervals of no less than about 2 miles, though most reasonably it should be about every 3 miles on average in which will allow for better spacing for more fluid merging and exiting of traffic into the ISOLATED system.. thus maintaining its desired purpose and integrity in which is to move traffic along smoothly and seamlessly.

In most places in the world the Isolation of the network is achieved via simply elevating the whole system up off of the ground and or sinking it about 30 to 50 feet or so below ground, some systems are even walled off.

Fencing is least commonly seen, in that it is least pronounced and its integrity is often diminished via vandalism of the fencing in which destroys the engineered isolated consistency of the network from the public... designed to protect the public from the many dangers in which are faced via access to the system outside of the points in which were specifically established for that purpose. This project is very nice and can be very helpful to the public, though at the same time, if it is not monitored and structured properly it can also quickly turn into one of the public's worst death traps.

There are light rail projects just like this in major cities around the world. I have personally seen similar things in Calgary and Barcelona. So I think this project is in order. In fact in Calgary streets in the CBD have ground level rail crossing them with no major fencing. Just see the links http://stephenrees.files.wordpress.c..._2005_0713.jpg and http://www.lightrail.nl/Spain/spain-...a-besos001.jpg.

The second link is Avenue Diagonal in Barcelona, the other is in Calgary. I think this 10-lane expressway is more like Avenue Diagonal.

[Nsukka]

Originally Posted by SportBilly

Sorry but there are light rail projects just like this in major cities around the world. I have personally seen similar things in Calgary and Barcelona. So I think this project is in order. In fact in Calgary streets in the CBD have ground level rail crossing them with no major fencing. Just see the link http://stephenrees.files.wordpress.c..._2005_0713.jpg

So what, that's poor planning and design if that is the case there.. It's nothing to be repeated. By the way, this has less to do with the rail component added in center and more to do with the actually broader roadway component. This is more so where the danger lies in placing this project at ground level. The rail system although can be a problem as well in it's current position of being right at the same level as the roadway with no prominent stopping barrier between the rail lines and the roadway.

During an accident a car can simply fly right off the road and right on to the tracks and or if a train happens to fly off track for whatever reason.. it'll fly right off and on into the roadway causing an even greater catastrophic mess of a an accident with the cars. These are all things that needed to be thought about and resolved by simply engineering the project properly via a simply process of elevation distribution; not placing incompatible environments in which cause a hazard to each other at the same elevation field, thus allowing for the presence of the most secure barrier for preventing catastrophe (earthen walls) or moats.

By the way, please do not attempt to sagest that something in which is feasable in a well developed, backwood city of only about a million and a half people, sitting in the frozen tundra of Canada would be acceptable in a poorly developed mega-metropolis of over 16Mill people in the mid of a topical region. Apples and Oranges my friend, apples and oranges.

[sammyjay77]

Am out of this....

[SportBilly]

Originally Posted by Nsukka

So what, that's poor planning and design if that is the case there.. It's nothing to be repeated. By the way, this has less to do with the rail component added in center and more to do with the actually broader roadway component. This is more so where the danger lies in placing this project at ground level. The rail system although can be a problem as well in it's current position of being right at the same level as the roadway with no prominent stopping barrier between the rail lines and the roadway.

During an accident a car can simply fly right off the road and right on to the tracks and or if a train happens to fly off track for whatever reason.. it'll fly right off and on into the roadway causing an even greater catastrophic mess of a an accident with the cars. These are all things that needed to be thought about and resolved by simply engineering the project properly via a simply process of elevation distribution; not placing incompatible environments in which cause a hazard to each other at the same elevation field, thus allowing for the presence of the most secure barrier for preventing catastrophe (earthen walls) or moats.

By the way, please do not attempt to sagest that something in which is feasable in a well developed, backwood city of only about a million and a half people, sitting in the frozen tundra of Canada would be acceptable in a poorly developed mega-metropolis of over 16Mill people in the mid of a topical region. Apples and Oranges my friend, apples and oranges.

Points well taken but there is a reason for it been called "LIGHT" rail......

And yes I am proud to be CANADIAN....

[Casawi]

Interesting project

[friendsofthecity]

I quite agree with Nsukka comments here cos they carried with them a great sense of safety which is the basic issue in the Nigeria project plans. I think there's an urgent need for what he pointed out to be taken into proper consideration before going on about the project. It's a great project and there's no doubt about that -the ignoring of the safety side of it as pointed out by Nsukka is a great lack of foresight on the side of the planner.

[Naija]

I understand the points raised by Nsukka and can't agree any less. Quite a lot of projects are conceived and executed in Nigeria without the big picture in mind. Whenever a project is conceived, you just can't look at what you aim to achieve only but you also have to consider safety, environment friendliness, capacity to expand, suitability for disabled people, etc. We have the tendency to blindly and naively praise grandiose projects in Nigeria without looking at the finer details of the project. Has any of you guys realized that all those new road construction ongoing in several parts of Lagos don't have sidewalks designed to aid disabled people to wheel or lift themselves easily unto them and am sure you are all still comfortable with building roads with open gutters in the 21st century!!!
But not that i can blame Nigerians. Its just that such basic facilities that should come automatically with the growth of a city are so lacking in Nigeria that whenever such projects are announced, Nigerians go gaga with ecstacy. For instance its a shame that Lagos doesn't have a light rail system and has only one true mall to service a population of 16 million.
I applaud the plans and efforts of the governor but you all have to realize that things have been left undone for too long that even much more needs to be urgently done.

And yes, projects draggggggggg ooooonnnnnn for too long in Nigeria. For those of you that live in Lagos, you must have noticed that the construction company in charge of the Lekki -Epe road has started bulldozing the side of road down to the third roundabout. I can bet it will remain that way without much difference till the raining season arrives again prompting them to do the bulldozing all over again!!!!!

[JoblessBeggar]

Originally Posted by Naija

I understand the points raised by Nsukka and can't agree any less. Quite a lot of projects are conceived and executed in Nigeria without the big picture in mind. Whenever a project is conceived, you just can't look at what you aim to achieve only but you also have to consider safety, environment friendliness, capacity to expand, suitability for disabled people, etc. We have the tendency to blindly and naively praise grandiose projects in Nigeria without looking at the finer details of the project. Has any of you guys realized that all those new road construction ongoing in several parts of Lagos don't have sidewalks designed to aid disabled people to wheel or lift themselves easily unto them and am sure you are all still comfortable with building roads with open gutters in the 21st century!!!
But not that i can blame Nigerians. Its just that such basic facilities that should come automatically with the growth of a city are so lacking in Nigeria that whenever such projects are announced, Nigerians go gaga with ecstacy. For instance its a shame that Lagos doesn't have a light rail system and has only one true mall to service a population of 16 million.
I applaud the plans and efforts of the governor but you all have to realize that things have been left undone for too long that even much more needs to be urgently done.

Under Lagos State regulatory standards (issued by the Fashola administration), every major road construction must include the provision of walkway, lay-bys, covered drains, service ducts, streetlights, traffic lights, as well as an alternative source of energy to power the street lights. In fact, I have not seen a single new road project with open gutters.

PS: And unless you are talking of "strip" malls (which would be unsuited to a largely land-strapped Lagos), Lagos actually have more than one mall. Apart from the Silverbird Galleria, the City Mall, the Palms, Mega Plaza and the new mall in Yaba, there are several shopping centres in Lagos and numerous open-air markets -- the AFRICAN equivalent of shopping malls.

[JoblessBeggar]

Originally Posted by sammyjay77

Am out of this....

Bro, I am right behind you.

One had been under the impression that folks come here to exchange information and source new knowledge, only to discover that some apparently come here to massage their apparently fragile egos and/or more concerned with winning meaningless petty arguments (or what in their minds are arguments) rather than attempt to expand their body of knowledge. Otherwise, when someone raises a point and receives an explanation from sources perhaps most uniquely place to provide such an explanation, one would expect that the rational thing to do would be to at least acknowledge the explanation.

[pappy]

I don tire for naija pipul o! How can you have light rail at ground level knowing how Lagosians drive? How can you have light rail at ground level with so many people walking the streets and illegal stalls and mad men are bound to pop up? Lagos is not Calgary or Barcelona so we can't even compare the people planning this need to really put alot of things into consideration. If this light rail is elevated like it is in Singapore we won't have to worry about car accidents blocking the tracks, we won't have to worry about wreckless drivers using the tracks to avoid 'go-slow' or we won't have to worry about rain floods rendering the track useless when there's heavy rain etc. These are the things they need to put into consideration. Nsukka is right that render is poor.

[pappy]

Originally Posted by Nsukka

I'm not being stereotypical on this issue UnemployedBeggar, I'm just stating the facts as they stand. You know and I know that it isn't all that common for things to be done in Naija with the set demand to have the finished product be safe and asteticly appealing, in that most often it usually all about throwing up any ol half-ass finished product and getting it into serving its intended purpose, all while the thing looking like crap, it's lacking in safty quality.

Sifficiant funds are not spent on it to mantian what little sppeal and integrity it may posess.. thus worsoning the situation over a short span of time. This is too often the Nigerian way, and we all know it very well.

Many simply don't seem to know the value of taking pride in the presentation of your work, the product you put out is a direct showing of your integrity and a direct reflection of who you are as a person. If you half-ass almost everything you do, then I can rightly assume that you will have comparable concern for my personal well being while in the mids of you work.

Thank you my brother. Its very refreshing to hear a non-Nigerians honest view that's neither putting us down or telling us what we want to hear. Believe me I'm one of the few Nigerians that understand what you're talking about, I've been saying the same thing about this Lagos rail project for a while now. How they want to operate rail that's ground level in a city like Lagos is just pure madness to me.

[Moonblue]

Originally Posted by pappy

Thank you my brother. Its very refreshing to hear a non-Nigerians honest view that's neither putting us down or telling us what we want to hear. Believe me I'm one of the few Nigerians that understand what you're talking about, I've been saying the same thing about this Lagos rail project for a while now. How they want to operate rail that's ground level in a city like Lagos is just pure madness to me.

Why don't you look at the single render that is causing all this outcry again and tell us what lane the rail is on? At present cars don;t even drive on the BRT lane which is physically segregated from the rest of the lanes because of hefty fines and high borders which would present a challenge. And here we are talking about a railway line that is even beyond/afer the segregated BRT lane?

[usersky0010]

ELEVATED LIGHTRAIL LAGOS-NIGERIA ON STEROIDS
image hosted on flickr


image hosted on flickr

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