#Airlines: Virgin Australia

[Eco-rat]

So if DJ becomes full service, how does it avoid becoming Ansett? Old hosties with a sense of entitlement and overpaid? Regional routes that are run for political reasons, rather than profit. Might be a double edged sword; a curse.

[Wezza]

Originally Posted by Eco-rat

So if DJ becomes full service, how does it avoid becoming Ansett? Old hosties with a sense of entitlement and overpaid? Regional routes that are run for political reasons, rather than profit. Might be a double edged sword; a curse.

Ansett had an ageing fleet of alot of different a/c types, their maitainence costs alone would have been huge.

[MelbourneCity]

Originally Posted by Wezza

Ansett had an ageing fleet of alot of different a/c types, their maitainence costs alone would have been huge.

And Ansett was also heavily unionised. While Virgin does have some unions, I'm sure they are nowhere near as powerful of what Ansett had.

When Ansett ordered the Boeing 767, they asked Boeing to add a navigator's position in to the cabin. The 767 was designed with two man crew operation - Captain and co-pilot. Union pressure!

Regional routes that are run for political reasons, rather than profit.

What routes are run for political reasons?

I don't think Virgin's management are anywhere near as bad as Ansett's successive poor management... it all culminated when a weak AirNZ took over, as we know.

[Wezza]

Originally Posted by MelbourneCity

And Ansett was also heavily unionised. While Virgin does have some unions, I'm sure they are nowhere near as powerful of what Ansett had.

When Ansett ordered the Boeing 767, they asked Boeing to add a navigator's position in to the cabin. The 767 was designed with two man crew operation - Captain and co-pilot. Union pressure!

Yeah I remember that, ridiculous! I believe they were the only 767's ever built which needed a 3 man crew.

[Eco-rat]

Originally Posted by MelbourneCity

And Ansett was also heavily unionised. While Virgin does have some unions, I'm sure they are nowhere near as powerful of what Ansett had.

When Ansett ordered the Boeing 767, they asked Boeing to add a navigator's position in to the cabin. The 767 was designed with two man crew operation - Captain and co-pilot. Union pressure!


What routes are run for political reasons?

I don't know of any now, but in the 70s and 80s it was legion. Old JBP was legendary for spending Qld taxpayers money extending country runways so that 727s or whatever could land. A bit of a fetish of his.

I know they used to fly half empty 727s to Mt Isa with JBPs money so he could trumpet how he was developing Qld.

I don't think Virgin's management are anywhere near as bad as Ansett's successive poor management... it all culminated when a weak AirNZ took over, as we know.

This is all political intervention, pure and simple. The asset strippers moved in when it was obvious the old management weren't up to it, and when they finished, the avio-geo-politics of will Singapore buy this/buy that/gotta be a big man and have a big airline rubbish started.

The Kiwis even now run the rubbish "because we are surrounded by sea, gotta have an airline" rather than consider, if they had a viable, thriving economy, a place where people wanted to go, foreign airlines would be stacking above Auckland to land there.

Rather than queueing to take off with emigrating Kiwis.

[Eco-rat]

I should add wot eny fool who've studied Labour Economics 101 will recall, the reason Ansett was loaded up with ageing hosties and punitive industrial awards is BECAUSE of the legal duopoly.

Bad management creates bad unions - rule number 1 in Labour Economics

Big management creates big unions - rule number 2.

The unions will demand what the company can bear - and a duopolist can bear quite a lot.

This is the evils of economic regulation - thus spake Eco-rat.

[bwistle]

Virgin and ANZ have given out details about there trans tasman alliance

http://www.asx.com.au/asxpdf/2010050...49z2g28ylj.pdf

[Danubis]

Originally Posted by Eco-rat

Nup. If I want tropics and rainforest, can do that overseas, usually cheaper.

is there rainforest near darwin?

[MelbourneCity]

Just read the press release. What it doesn't answer is how this affects Pacific Blue's domestic services in New Zealand.

[tayser]

I'd be willing to bet ADL will be a beneficiary out of this - daily services to all three big kiwi airports with both DJ and NZ codes on them (and 6 new daily contrails over Melbourne *snort*).

[skystar320]

We all know AirNZ screwed Ansett.

[Wezza]

This bit was interesting:

Virgin Blue is close to unveiling our "Airline of the Future" concepts which in our 10th year will reveal the fresh direction of the 'new blue'

Could this be hinting at moving into a full service carrier?

[bwistle]

mmm, thats what i was thinking, i think its about them the rebranding of the airline

[Wezza]

Yeah i'm almost positive they will rename Virgin Blue as V Australia.

[beastjim]

Originally Posted by Wezza

Could this be hinting at moving into a full service carrier?

What would the difference be though? In my mind they pretty much match Qantas in just about every area except for providing food and the pay for baggage on the cheapest tickets.

[bwistle]

qantas also gives you free entertainment, but that still only on the overhead tvs

[Wezza]

Originally Posted by beastjim

What would the difference be though? In my mind they pretty much match Qantas in just about every area except for providing food and the pay for baggage on the cheapest tickets.

Food included in the ticket price & a proper business class.

[Airbus_A320]

I think it will be more like Business/Economy/Economy Light. The last category there gets 27" seat pitch and pays for everything, but the airfare is lower of course. Hoping RED is put on every seat back along with DECENT leather seats for a change.

[skystar320]

They wont do a three class configuration on a narrowbody domestic routes. Ultimate Fail. More than likely it would be Business & Economy with 'Business" having a funky new name

[aussieboy]

Originally Posted by skystar320

They wont do a three class configuration on a narrowbody domestic routes. Ultimate Fail. More than likely it would be Business & Economy with 'Business" having a funky new name

This is exactly what DJ has practically announced already

Its how Virgin America operates (First, Main Cabin Select, Main Cabin)