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Old June 15th, 2013, 11:48 PM   #1001
Viriatuus
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Both Luik and Ličge, as Lüttich as well, are names of the city. And all of them quite old.
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Old June 16th, 2013, 11:14 AM   #1002
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Old June 16th, 2013, 11:16 AM   #1003
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But none of them could be taken as native. In Ličge, autochthons speak French.
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Old June 16th, 2013, 03:20 PM   #1004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Palance View Post
Unfortunately spelled as Nimwegen, where it shoud be Nijmegen.
Why unfortunately? In the local dialect it's "Nimwegen" as well...

"Nimwegen" is the native name, Nijmegen, Nimegue, Nimega, etc. are exonyms
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Old June 16th, 2013, 03:25 PM   #1005
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City names are not spelled according to archaic spelling or dialect names. Fortunately the signs say Amsterdam and not Amstelredam or Mokum.

There is no need to make signs unnecessary cluttering by using double names, unofficial names, italics, brackets, or seeing them as an outing of politics.
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Old June 16th, 2013, 04:24 PM   #1006
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Fair enough - but my point was that "Nimwegen" is not an exonym. It's neither an obsolete way of spelling as those would be "Nieuwmeghen", "Numaga" or "Ulpia Noviomagus Batavorum" depending on how far back in history you go.

And about using different forms of the place name, isn't this the thing going on in Europe for already a long time? "Góra Świętej Anny" is double signed as "Sankt Annaberg", in northern Poland you'll find plenty of places with Polish/Kashubian, and in Eastern Germany you'll find places with German/Sorbian (a Polish dialect, about as far from Polish as Limburgish is from Dutch)

Speaking about Limburgish, which I believe the dialect in Nijmegen is related to, you'll find in the southern Netherlands places signed in both spellings, such as "Roermond" as "Remunj" and "Kerkrade" as "Kirchroa".

So, personally, in the case of Nijmegen I don't see the problem that it's signed like that in Germany, as it's both the endonym for the city as well as the German name for it. It would of course be different if they would start signing "Den Haag" as "Haag" or "Den Bosch" as "Herzogenbusch"
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Old June 16th, 2013, 04:39 PM   #1007
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You are referring to city limit signs, which do not have the same function as directional signage.

Exonyms are an outdated concept from times where we hardly crossed borders and we didn't know any foreign languages. The far majority of foreign city names do not have exonyms. Some exonyms are dying out and only important ones will likely remain (such as capitals and cities with great historic or tourist significance).

Especially in football the endonyms are much more often used than exonyms. In the Netherlands we talk of Paris-Saint-Germain or Bayern München or AS Roma, not Parijs, Beieren or Rome.
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Old June 16th, 2013, 05:23 PM   #1008
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Bayer Monaco, Rapid Vienna, Dinamo Zagabria, Stella Rossa, etc... are frequently used in Italian.
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Old June 16th, 2013, 10:36 PM   #1009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
Bayer Monaco, Rapid Vienna, Dinamo Zagabria, Stella Rossa, etc... are frequently used in Italian.
I think it's interesting that in English Bayern Munich is the normal term for the club, but Barvaria Munich is never used, and Bayern Muenchen is very rare.
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Old June 16th, 2013, 10:53 PM   #1010
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It's matter of opinion of course... but I'm pretty sure that there is no language where Newcastle, Rio de Janeiro, Sao Paulo or Buenos Aires are translated and all of them can be translated

(Newcastle obviously the same in English, January River, St. Paul and Good Airs)
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Old June 16th, 2013, 11:20 PM   #1011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Proterra View Post
So, personally, in the case of Nijmegen I don't see the problem that it's signed like that in Germany, as it's both the endonym for the city as well as the German name for it.
It is a problem. Outside Nijmegen none uses Nimwegen, and signage should be people who are not familiair with the area of other names, but simply want to go to a city. And since 99,99% of all Dutch roadmaps (and surely navigation systems as well) show Nijmegen, that how it should be put on signage, not anything else.
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Old June 17th, 2013, 01:57 AM   #1012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broccolli View Post
Or trademark... I buy slovenian (food)=Kupujem slovensko
In Slovak language, this literally means: "I buy Slovakia" And "slovenka" means "slovak woman".

But turning the topic back on.

I'd personally prefer the original name of the city on traffic signs. The only exception could be the case of different alphabet or script. Then the transcription could be a good decision.

This model is (except Ukrainian names) valid in Slovakia. Thus we have "Wien", "Budapest", "Miskolc", "Kittsee", "Kraków" instead of "Viedeň", "Budapešť", "Miškovec", "Kopčany" or "Krakov".

Perhaps, the most user friendly is used in Hungary (which have in my opinion the best traffic sign system I've ever seen). Hungarian alternative is displayed beside the original name. But this might be a little contraproductive e.g. you are driving towards Kassa and just after having passed the border-crossing, Kassa direction disappears.

Basically, to avoid confusions on road, uniform system should be introduced in Europe
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Old June 17th, 2013, 03:52 AM   #1013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by volodaaaa View Post
In Slovak language, this literally means: "I buy Slovakia"
How much?
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Old June 17th, 2013, 10:53 AM   #1014
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How much?
Not sure, but I guess not much.
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Old June 17th, 2013, 11:53 AM   #1015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alserrod View Post
It's matter of opinion of course... but I'm pretty sure that there is no language where Newcastle, Rio de Janeiro, Sao Paulo or Buenos Aires are translated and all of them can be translated

(Newcastle obviously the same in English, January River, St. Paul and Good Airs)
In Italian is San Paolo.
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Paolo_%28citt%C3%A0%29

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielFigFoz View Post
I think it's interesting that in English Bayern Munich is the normal term for the club, but Barvaria Munich is never used, and Bayern Muenchen is very rare.
Same here, nobody says "Baviera Monaco" but always "Bayern Monaco" or simply "Bayern". Don't know the reason why Muenchen is translated but Bayern isn't.
On the countrary, there are two major Italian teams named after the English name of the city: Milan and Genoa. That's because football was introduced in Italy by Brits at the end of the XIX century and many important teams were founded back then. Initially football was popular only in Northwest Italy so there were small towns like Casale Monferrato that won several national championshpis!

Last edited by italystf; June 17th, 2013 at 11:59 AM.
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Old June 17th, 2013, 12:02 PM   #1016
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Like no one in Italy says "Inter Milan" but just "Inter".
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Old June 17th, 2013, 02:37 PM   #1017
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Like no one in Italy says "Inter Milan" but just "Inter".
In England the two Milan teams are commonly known just as Milan & Inter.
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Old June 17th, 2013, 06:15 PM   #1018
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If only in Spain we had foreing cities written. Nevertheless the name (there are not many differences with French and Portuguese... but if only we had... instead of pointing just the number of kilometres to the border in most of cases)


off-topic. Related to football teams, in Spain almost half of them are called "real XXXXX". In fact they are known only two of them mainly like that: Real Madrid (to distinguise from Atletico Madrid) and Real Sociedad (team from San Sebastián, could be translated as Royal Society)

But Real Valladolid, Real Betis, Real Zaragoza, Real C.D. Espanyol, Real... and so on, maybe half of them have the name of Real (translated as Royal)

It was a honour given to some teams a long time ago. Not now.

When I watch an international match and see that a Spanish team is called only "real" I got amazed because that would be the name of half of the teams.

Except in some cases, you can say the name of the city to call the team
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Old June 17th, 2013, 06:21 PM   #1019
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Italians often confuse me when they use Internazionale. not once i thought "who the hack are these now?!"
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Old June 18th, 2013, 10:34 AM   #1020
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x-type View Post
Italians often confuse me when they use Internazionale. not once i thought "who the hack are these now?!"
Until very recently, I didn't even know Inter's full name was Internazionale. It is never used.
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