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Old September 10th, 2011, 10:23 PM   #301
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one very strange thing I had noticed when I was in Beograd is that in many buses there are no devices to require the stop! It happend that the bus skipped my stop and I had to talk to the driver asking him to stop at least at the next one!
Another strange thing is the ticket system which is pretty unique but unconfortable beacause it doesn't allow you to take different buses or trams connections with the same ticket but you must change it as you change the bus. but mabe now things have changed..
Anyway I loved beograd and its trams
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Old September 11th, 2011, 02:28 PM   #302
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blaise. View Post
one very strange thing I had noticed when I was in Beograd is that in many buses there are no devices to require the stop! It happend that the bus skipped my stop and I had to talk to the driver asking him to stop at least at the next one!
The stop buttons are not used in Belgrade, you as a passenger are required to stand in front of the door when you wish to exit. If there’s nobody at the door the driver will just skip the stop.

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Originally Posted by blaise. View Post
Another strange thing is the ticket system which is pretty unique but unconfortable beacause it doesn't allow you to take different buses or trams connections with the same ticket but you must change it as you change the bus. but mabe now things have changed..
Anyway I loved beograd and its trams
The system is primitive and it was intended to be a temporary solution, however temporary solutions in Serbia tend to last for decades. I’m glad you loved the city and its trams.

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Originally Posted by Aleksandar_M View Post
This is the old, pre WWII network. Only line number 2 kept the same route.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 12:48 PM   #303
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In the mean time,brand new smart card system will be operational in Belgrade on the end of the year,validators are alredy installed in some trams and trolleybuses.Also passanger info system will be operational with traffic monitoring center,including Gps,stations display,video survaillance.
Smart card and monitoring system includs buses,trams,trolleybuses,trains.

Last edited by dexmex; September 14th, 2011 at 01:20 PM.
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Old September 15th, 2011, 11:09 AM   #304
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European financing?
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Old September 16th, 2011, 08:53 AM   #305
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No, it is financed from the budget city of Belgrade.Belgrade still does not use Eu funding.For large city infrastructure projects such as, amazing Ada Bridge,reconstruction of Gazela bridge, Metro,Water or waste plants untill now Belgrade used Ebrd credit lines,for building of Metro French loan with Alstom project leadership, and recently Chinese loan for a new Belgrade Danube bridge and Russian loan for railway infastrucure.

Last edited by dexmex; September 16th, 2011 at 12:27 PM.
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Old October 6th, 2011, 06:12 PM   #306
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As of today, construction of a metro system in Belgrade, currently Europe's largest city without such a key piece of infrastructure, is one giant step closer to reality

Quote:
Alstom Accepted as Likely Contractor for Belgrade’s First Subway
QBy Misha Savic - Oct 6, 2011 10:17 AM ET

Belgrade’s city assembly approved an agreement for Alstom SA (ALO)’s transport unit to take part in developing a subway in the Serbian capital.

The assembly authorized the municipal government to sign a Memorandum of Understanding with Alstom Transport for 15 kilometers (9.3 miles) of tracks, including seven kilometers underground, based on a feasibility study by Egis Rail.

Alstom is “ready to provide all the technical support” during the feasibility period and expects to eventually win the contract, Miodrag Jelisavcic, Alstom’s representative in Serbia, said in a phone interview.

The project is part of a “strategic partnership” signed in April between French President Nicholas Sarkozy and Boris Tadic, the president of the former Yugoslav republic that wants to win European Union candidacy status as early as this year. Among financing options for the subway plan, France would help secure the financing and Alstom may choose a subcontractor for digging tunnels, building platforms and train stops.

Serbian Deputy Premier Bozidar Djelic estimated Alstom Transport’s part of the contract would be worth 1 billion euros ($1.34 billion) following his trip to France. Today’s document doesn’t specify the value.

Another co-financing plan have Serbian find funds for the construction part of the project and Alstom provide trains and rail equipment. A third option is a public-private partnership, in which Alstom would become a concessionaire for the future subway.

France pledged support of 3 million euros for the feasibility study and the designs.


‘Sufficient’ Finance Capacity

The study and the design for the first subway line are set to be completed by the end of 2012, followed by a financing agreement. Serbia then has two years to negotiate a binding contract with Alstom, without seeking another company for the job. The first line may open as early as 2017.

The city has “sufficient capacity” to support the subway development “because our level of debt is not big and we can service loans that we take,” Mayor Dragan Djilas said today at an assembly session at city hall.

Serbia’s parliament has yet to ratify the Strategic Partnership Agreement, which France has done.
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Old October 6th, 2011, 10:23 PM   #307
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Quote:
So Belgrade is getting its first metro line. Do you have any maps? What's included in that €1bn contract? I missed out on Sofia's and Warsaw's metro so I'd like to monitor this one from beginning till the end to learn more about metro systems. Any other info?
I think it's better if I ask my questions here. Is there a website or anything? Where do you get the news from?
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Old October 7th, 2011, 02:38 AM   #308
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Lafreak84,Well,it is interesting that Belgrade already have a commuter high capacity subway,wich connect suburbs withe the center of city.Recently restarted after it has been forggoten for decade.Many people use this subway daily now.So if you decide to visit Belgrade, please find one of the deepest subway station in Europe
[IMG]http://i37.************/11m7zag.jpg[/IMG]

About new Metro sistem all info's are from mainstream media for now,but you can also find more info's and history of this project on wikipedia as "Belgrade Metro".
[IMG]http://i37.************/muv906.jpg[/IMG]

Last edited by dexmex; October 7th, 2011 at 02:58 AM.
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Old October 8th, 2011, 07:59 AM   #309
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It's rather like German S-Bahn or Polish SKM, than like Metro.
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Old October 8th, 2011, 08:59 AM   #310
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This is just segment of M2 going trough main railway station,but new visualisation we can expect next year from French Egis and Alstom,so we don't know how does it look like finnaly.
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Old October 8th, 2011, 11:02 AM   #311
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I meant Београдски железнички чвор and БГ ВОЗ
in Warsaw similar is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Cross-City_Line
I'm waiting impatiently for Belgrade Metro since 2004 when just after my registration on SsC БЕЛАМ project was introduced...
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Last edited by Petr; October 8th, 2011 at 11:11 AM.
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Old October 10th, 2011, 10:31 AM   #312
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Oh yes,i would say that Wrasaw SKM i similar to a Belgrade BGVoz system with capacity and route,especially i like your new trains,i t would be nice if "Pesa" introduce that new trains here in Belgrade or even test it here.
About future BG Metro project,well Belam is Lrt,so as city parliament voted for high capacity Metro, so we can expect from Egis and Alstom completly different version,as mayer announced,in old Belgrade Metro will be completly undergroung but in New Belgrade across river Sava it will be above ground, but that is not clear what does it mean?.Now we have some reaction from opposition they demand completley undergorund trace,and that presented concept is medium capacity which is not enough for size for city such as Belgrade 2.milions.Well elections are near,so political campain is heating.

Last edited by dexmex; October 10th, 2011 at 10:45 AM.
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Old October 11th, 2011, 08:24 AM   #313
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How many CAF trams are already in service in Belgrade and how many still to arrive? Are there any talks of more trams like these being bought by GSP or for now only the 30 (i think) that are already purchased?
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Old October 11th, 2011, 06:03 PM   #314
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1501 is on repair, 1502 is in regular service, 1503 is used for driver training and 1504 is on testing.
26 more trams are going to be delivered, rumors say 50 more will be ordered.
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Old October 11th, 2011, 08:33 PM   #315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dexmex View Post
Oh yes,i would say that Wrasaw SKM i similar to a Belgrade BGVoz system with capacity and route,especially i like your new trains,i t would be nice if "Pesa" introduce that new trains here in Belgrade or even test it here.
About future BG Metro project,well Belam is Lrt,so as city parliament voted for high capacity Metro, so we can expect from Egis and Alstom completly different version,as mayer announced,in old Belgrade Metro will be completly undergroung but in New Belgrade across river Sava it will be above ground, but that is not clear what does it mean?.Now we have some reaction from opposition they demand completley undergorund trace,and that presented concept is medium capacity which is not enough for size for city such as Belgrade 2.milions.Well elections are near,so political campain is heating.
Heavy Metro will be a huge financial challenge for Belgrade even with a help of the central government. Warsaw without EU funds built 17 stations in 23 years. On the other hand Belgrade with its 20% of population of Serbia can count on support the way that is impossible in Poland.
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Last edited by Petr; October 11th, 2011 at 08:40 PM.
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Old October 11th, 2011, 11:28 PM   #316
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Actually, that's not entirely correct.
The City of Belgrade alone is embarking on this project, with very little or no help from the Serbian state. That has been clearly stated.


Btw...

Quote:
Belgrade residents doubt in metro construction

10.10.2011 15:28:00 | Author/Source PressCut

A great number of the citizens of Belgrade do not believe Belgrade will ever get a subway, according to a poll conducted on 1013 respondents following the announcements of the city government that the metro will be built by 2017. Many say that the subway will not be built in less than several decades.

The lack of trust in the Belgrade government’s announcements is understandable, considering the fact that the politicians have been discussing the construction for decades, trying to assess whether the citizens need a metro at all or how much the entire project would cost.
(B92)
Belgrade metro is a century old project ... originally, the city was to be among the first in Europe, along with London & Budapest, to build an "underground railway" but Balkan wars & financial difficulties delayed the project...for some time
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Old October 11th, 2011, 11:33 PM   #317
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Something interesting....in a way, one could say that work on Belgrade metro has already started, as the infrastructure for the first station (on a future line #3) is nearing completion...of course, until the rest of the stations are built, this one will be utilized by a new tram line:










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Old October 12th, 2011, 05:45 PM   #318
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazySerb View Post
Actually, that's not entirely correct.
The City of Belgrade alone is embarking on this project, with very little or no help from the Serbian state. That has been clearly stated.

Btw...

Belgrade metro is a century old project ... originally, the city was to be among the first in Europe, along with London & Budapest, to build an "underground railway" but Balkan wars & financial difficulties delayed the project...for some time
In Warsaw first ideas come from year 1903 either. In late 30's project was very advanced. Construction of a metro system was planed for the first half of the 40's, more precisely for the World's Fair in '44.
In 90's and 00's Poles outside Warsaw laughed at the slow speed of the construction of the new metro stations in the capital. Only after opening of the last stations of the 1th line, and now after start of the construction of the 2nd line people have stopped laughing.
1st line is a true backbone of the urban transport in Warsaw. The lesson for Belgrade is that it's better to built metro slowly, then wait for the better days.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazySerb View Post
Something interesting....in a way, one could say that work on Belgrade metro has already started, as the infrastructure for the first station (on a future line #3) is nearing completion...of course, until the rest of the stations are built, this one will be utilized by a new tram line:

http://www.beobuild.rs/visuals/data/...9-RAPET-01.jpg

http://www.beobuild.rs/visuals/data/...9-RAPET-04.jpg

http://www.beobuild.rs/visuals/data/...9-RAPET-05.jpg

]http://www.savabridge.com/images/poze/september3/sept10.jpg

http://www.savabridge.com/images/poz...er3/sept12.jpg
Nice project. It's good that the infrastructure is developed all the time. Also stations from 80's are well used.
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Last edited by Petr; October 12th, 2011 at 06:03 PM.
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Old October 13th, 2011, 12:10 AM   #319
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Quote:
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Heavy Metro will be a huge financial challenge for Belgrade even with a help of the central government. Warsaw without EU funds built 17 stations in 23 years. On the other hand Belgrade with its 20% of population of Serbia can count on support the way that is impossible in Poland.
Thanks for interesting question from Eu view,city of Belgrade seems to be the only one in region with good financial and credit rateing,Ebrd former loans are servicing regulary and new ones are announced for Metro.From French goverment, we have a credit of 500 eur. now Belgrade can take another 500 mil form Ebrd for Metro as announced.But we + also took 800 mil $ from Russians,and we have open door to take from China as much as we can recive investments. What can i say ,it is good to have a friends on all sides
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Old October 13th, 2011, 05:56 PM   #320
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By money from France, Russia, and China You mean loans?
Warsaw will get 650 million euro refunding for the central part of the second metro line.
Entire country will get 67 billion euro funds in years 2007-2013. It's clearly better to be a part of the EU, than have friends who lend you money.
In Poland there's a law which doesn't allow local government to have bigger debt than 60% of its annual income. It prevents local governments from bankruptcy, which takes place in Berlin at the moment.
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Last edited by Petr; October 13th, 2011 at 06:02 PM.
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