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Johnny de Rivative · May 10th, 2011, 10:11 PM

Yes, Joy, they changed it from TOS to TMS, the same thing, but perhaps they thought the acronym was becoming too descriptive!!

But there is now a more imminent feel about things. With the new 6 minute headways, Salford Quays feels awash with trams, and Mosley Street more so!

An article in the June edition of 'To-day's Railways' (out now) also makes these comments under the heading "NEW ROUTES IN JUNE?" :-

"The difficulties with the MediaCity branch have naturally made TfGM cautious about the new lines to Central Park and to Chorlton, which will hopefully open in June after full testing. Oldham Mumps should follow this autumn, with Rochdale and Droylsden due to open in Spring 2012"
It seems they are slightly out on that last bit, and no mention of Velopark, but looking back at the original timeline projections, it seems that things in the South have slipped only a little on testing etc. (It seems they were looking at the beginning of May, but does testing & driver training still now need 6 months?), so fingers crossed for next month :-

LNGCats · May 10th, 2011, 10:19 PM

To get to Central Park in June we will require TOS (as I like to continue to call it) to be operational through Victoria at least as far as Queens Rd, potentially Woodlands, Abrahm Moss or even the Crumpsall junction.

future.architect · May 10th, 2011, 10:20 PM

My theory,TOS kind of implies some kind of self-driving system. TMS, ie 'Management' is kind of closer to the truth.

LNGCats · May 10th, 2011, 10:22 PM

Reminds me of the Disk Operating System, happy days.

conn1231 · May 10th, 2011, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LNGCats

Yes TMS = TOS.

Yes, those new signals, mostly still under plastic wrappers are TOS signals.

There are a couple on then if that's so, one on the Castlefield viaduct.

mackenziesoley · May 10th, 2011, 10:57 PM

Question, once the TOS is live to G-mex can trams 3014 onwards then run on the Eccles/Media from Piccadilly?

LNGCats · May 10th, 2011, 10:59 PM

So long as they can get out of the depot yes.

WatcherZero · May 10th, 2011, 11:48 PM

I think the differing acronyms a minor issue arising from the fact the contract was tendered for a new 'Tram Operating System' whereas the name of the system Thales sold them is 'Tram Management System' or rather 'Tram Managment and control System' abbreviated TMcS. Not really a change in name just from a service description to product name.

LNGCats · May 11th, 2011, 07:20 AM

Just travelled inbound on first tram from Alty (which regularly seems to have to wait for Eccles tram to join track just south of Cornbrook since the new timetable).

No change in status of the signalling from what I can tell.

Block signalling clearly stilll in use along the route I have used and TOS signals all switched off (other than on Chorlton line) and many still under plastic covers.

Tony_H1 · May 11th, 2011, 07:40 AM

Oh dear. The waits a killer! The Yellow Machine 1027 was out and about last night again, returned through Vic at about 05:10

Freel07 · May 11th, 2011, 08:48 AM

To sum up on a few of the most recent posts.

The 'railwayesque' signals between Pomona and Cornbrook have been there since the line opened and are part of the block signalling. Any bagged signals in that area will be TMS signals.

For 3014 onwards to run from Piccadilly to St Werburgh's Rd TMS will need to be operational from St Werburghs Rd through Cornbrook and Deansgate to Piccadilly. I don't know whether it would be needed up to Queens Rd or whether all the maintenance on these trams can be done at Old Trafford for a short period. Remember Old Trafford is not intended for the heavier maintenance.

I'm not sure why they would run both MC to Piccadilly and the Cornbrook Shuttle LNG. Also the comment I made about shadow running was meant to indicate that HMRI now don't do the approval, that comes from the projects own safety approval process managed by TfGM. they may still want aperiod of trial running.

As for the final commissioning I guess we will have to wait for notice of a weekend shutdown.

LNGCats · May 11th, 2011, 08:56 AM

Sorry, I meant that I would imagine at some point, before the Chorlon line starts up in anger, that the MC shuttle will cease to run to Picc and instead will only get as far as Cornbrook (as per maps in trams) due to lack of capacity in the city centre and that is the real service those trams should be serving.

I would have thought, given the problems previously experienced, that TfGM would want to successfully commission the Cornbrook turnback prior to the Chorlton line going live (probably during the testing / driver awareness phase).

r02bapurdie · May 11th, 2011, 06:15 PM

Hi

I took some picture at South Chadderton today, you can found them on is link.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/metrolink_work/

Joydivison82 · May 12th, 2011, 12:19 AM

Was in town for the first time in ages (apart from at night) today as I decided to leave the car at home and use a borrowed bus ticket to get to Openshaw where I have been working on call.

When I was in town I noticed a lot more trams than usual, I think it must be the Media City affect. Hopefully when the new lines open there will be far more trams than buses in Picciddily.

loweskid · May 12th, 2011, 12:40 AM

From 'The Advertiser' today....

Air your views on Metrolink.

Residents concerned about the Metrolink are invited to have their say at a public meeting in Droylsden. Councillors will be joined by Metrolink chiefs at Droylsden Academy on Cryer Street, from 6.30-7.30 on Thursday May 19.

Chorlton Bloke · May 12th, 2011, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joydivison82

When I was in town I noticed a lot more trams than usual, I think it must be the Media City affect. Hopefully when the new lines open there will be far more trams than buses in Picciddily.

Yes, I was in town on Tuesday and decided to take a ride out to Media City.
I actually had to wait the best part of half an hour for a tram but in all that time the was no time when there wasn't a tram at the stop. At one time there were two on the Piccadilly station side and a third waiting behind to get to the stop. On the other platform were two Alti trams, not coupled and an Eccles tram closely followed by a Bury tram as the two Alti trams left.

Got the impression that they were deliberately loading the system, perhaps checking how it would cope under heavy load. There certainly weren't the passengers to justify the number of trams.

future.architect · May 12th, 2011, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chorlton Bloke

Yes, I was in town on Tuesday and decided to take a ride out to Media City.
I actually had to wait the best part of half an hour for a tram but in all that time the was no time when there wasn't a tram at the stop. At one time there were two on the Piccadilly station side and a third waiting behind to get to the stop. On the other platform were two Alti trams, not coupled and an Eccles tram closely followed by a Bury tram as the two Alti trams left.

Got the impression that they were deliberately loading the system, perhaps checking how it would cope under heavy load. There certainly weren't the passengers to justify the number of trams.

Sounds like driver training going on as well.

Chorlton Bloke · May 12th, 2011, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by future.architect

Sounds like driver training going on as well.

Erm, well I did see a few out of service trams heavily laden with drivers all clustered in and around the cab.

BTW, it did look as if headways were totally out of the window too.

WatcherZero · May 12th, 2011, 04:56 AM

Well the old way to retime the services was to wait in the siding at Piccadilly, dont think they can do that anymore with the sheer weight of trams though and they seem to be terminating services at Piccadilly Gardens when they need to get the timings correct again, saves 3 or 4 minutes I guess.

LNGCats · May 12th, 2011, 06:28 AM

Getting from Picc Gardens and back again from Picc takes 12 mins in the timetable so will be saving a lot more than 3 or 4 mins.

May 10th, 2011, 10:11 PM	#8521
Johnny de Rivative heard it here second . . Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Droylsden Posts: 2,209 Likes (Received): 1249	Yes, Joy, they changed it from TOS to TMS, the same thing, but perhaps they thought the acronym was becoming too descriptive!! But there is now a more imminent feel about things. With the new 6 minute headways, Salford Quays feels awash with trams, and Mosley Street more so! An article in the June edition of 'To-day's Railways' (out now) also makes these comments under the heading "NEW ROUTES IN JUNE?" :- "The difficulties with the MediaCity branch have naturally made TfGM cautious about the new lines to Central Park and to Chorlton, which will hopefully open in June after full testing. Oldham Mumps should follow this autumn, with Rochdale and Droylsden due to open in Spring 2012" It seems they are slightly out on that last bit, and no mention of Velopark, but looking back at the original timeline projections, it seems that things in the South have slipped only a little on testing etc. (It seems they were looking at the beginning of May, but does testing & driver training still now need 6 months?), so fingers crossed for next month :- __________________ Nostalgia for an age yet to come . . . (Pete Shelley - it's a buzz, cock) Last edited by Johnny de Rivative; May 10th, 2011 at 10:21 PM.

May 10th, 2011, 10:20 PM	#8523
future.architect Far East London Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 5,086 Likes (Received): 95	My theory,TOS kind of implies some kind of self-driving system. TMS, ie 'Management' is kind of closer to the truth. __________________ ΓΝΩΘΙ ΣΕΑΥΤΟΝ

May 10th, 2011, 10:57 PM	#8526
mackenziesoley Registered User Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 2,403 Likes (Received): 80	Question, once the TOS is live to G-mex can trams 3014 onwards then run on the Eccles/Media from Piccadilly? Last edited by mackenziesoley; May 10th, 2011 at 11:12 PM.

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May 10th, 2011, 10:19 PM	#8522
LNGCats Registered User Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 11,168 Likes (Received): 128	To get to Central Park in June we will require TOS (as I like to continue to call it) to be operational through Victoria at least as far as Queens Rd, potentially Woodlands, Abrahm Moss or even the Crumpsall junction.

May 10th, 2011, 10:22 PM	#8524
LNGCats Registered User Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 11,168 Likes (Received): 128	Reminds me of the Disk Operating System, happy days.

May 10th, 2011, 10:59 PM	#8527
LNGCats Registered User Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 11,168 Likes (Received): 128	So long as they can get out of the depot yes.

May 10th, 2011, 11:48 PM	#8528
WatcherZero Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 15,649	I think the differing acronyms a minor issue arising from the fact the contract was tendered for a new 'Tram Operating System' whereas the name of the system Thales sold them is 'Tram Management System' or rather 'Tram Managment and control System' abbreviated TMcS. Not really a change in name just from a service description to product name.

May 11th, 2011, 07:20 AM	#8529
LNGCats Registered User Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 11,168 Likes (Received): 128	Just travelled inbound on first tram from Alty (which regularly seems to have to wait for Eccles tram to join track just south of Cornbrook since the new timetable). No change in status of the signalling from what I can tell. Block signalling clearly stilll in use along the route I have used and TOS signals all switched off (other than on Chorlton line) and many still under plastic covers.

May 11th, 2011, 07:40 AM	#8530
Tony_H1 was Local lad Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Manchester Posts: 901 Likes (Received): 131	Oh dear. The waits a killer! The Yellow Machine 1027 was out and about last night again, returned through Vic at about 05:10

May 11th, 2011, 08:48 AM	#8531
Freel07 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Manchester Posts: 3,293 Likes (Received): 775	To sum up on a few of the most recent posts. The 'railwayesque' signals between Pomona and Cornbrook have been there since the line opened and are part of the block signalling. Any bagged signals in that area will be TMS signals. For 3014 onwards to run from Piccadilly to St Werburgh's Rd TMS will need to be operational from St Werburghs Rd through Cornbrook and Deansgate to Piccadilly. I don't know whether it would be needed up to Queens Rd or whether all the maintenance on these trams can be done at Old Trafford for a short period. Remember Old Trafford is not intended for the heavier maintenance. I'm not sure why they would run both MC to Piccadilly and the Cornbrook Shuttle LNG. Also the comment I made about shadow running was meant to indicate that HMRI now don't do the approval, that comes from the projects own safety approval process managed by TfGM. they may still want aperiod of trial running. As for the final commissioning I guess we will have to wait for notice of a weekend shutdown.

May 11th, 2011, 08:56 AM	#8532
LNGCats Registered User Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 11,168 Likes (Received): 128	Sorry, I meant that I would imagine at some point, before the Chorlon line starts up in anger, that the MC shuttle will cease to run to Picc and instead will only get as far as Cornbrook (as per maps in trams) due to lack of capacity in the city centre and that is the real service those trams should be serving. I would have thought, given the problems previously experienced, that TfGM would want to successfully commission the Cornbrook turnback prior to the Chorlton line going live (probably during the testing / driver awareness phase).

May 11th, 2011, 06:15 PM	#8533
r02bapurdie Andrew Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Oldham near Freehold Metrolink stop Posts: 2,147 Likes (Received): 317	Hi I took some picture at South Chadderton today, you can found them on is link. http://www.flickr.com/photos/metrolink_work/

May 12th, 2011, 12:19 AM	#8534
Joydivison82 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,164 Likes (Received): 8	Was in town for the first time in ages (apart from at night) today as I decided to leave the car at home and use a borrowed bus ticket to get to Openshaw where I have been working on call. When I was in town I noticed a lot more trams than usual, I think it must be the Media City affect. Hopefully when the new lines open there will be far more trams than buses in Picciddily.

May 12th, 2011, 12:40 AM	#8535
loweskid Registered User Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Manchester Posts: 600 Likes (Received): 231	From 'The Advertiser' today.... Air your views on Metrolink. Residents concerned about the Metrolink are invited to have their say at a public meeting in Droylsden. Councillors will be joined by Metrolink chiefs at Droylsden Academy on Cryer Street, from 6.30-7.30 on Thursday May 19.

May 12th, 2011, 04:56 AM	#8539
WatcherZero Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 15,649	Well the old way to retime the services was to wait in the siding at Piccadilly, dont think they can do that anymore with the sheer weight of trams though and they seem to be terminating services at Piccadilly Gardens when they need to get the timings correct again, saves 3 or 4 minutes I guess.

May 12th, 2011, 06:28 AM	#8540
LNGCats Registered User Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 11,168 Likes (Received): 128	Getting from Picc Gardens and back again from Picc takes 12 mins in the timetable so will be saving a lot more than 3 or 4 mins.