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Old April 20th, 2014, 01:48 AM   #2821
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La Encina junction-Xativa-Valencia HSL + La Encina-Xativa-Valencia classic line.
Section La Encina-Xativa.

Images taken at La Font de la Figuera, where the HSL (in use in Iberian gauge between La Font de la Figuera and Xativa), and the classic line (in use between Xativa and L´Alcudia de Crespins, under upgrade between L´Alcudia de Crespins and Moixent, and under reconstruction between Moixent and La Font de la Figuera) will cross, the HSL over the classic line.

The section between La Font de la Figuera and Xativa of the HSL will have to be regauged from Iberian to standard, and reelectrified from 3 kV DC to 25 kV AC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RDaneel View Post
Image taken on November-22-2013:





Image taken on April-13-2014:


DSCN1126 por danlx86, en Flickr
Quote:
Originally Posted by RDaneel View Post

DSCN1125 por danlx86, en Flickr


DSCN1127 por danlx86, en Flickr


Current situation on the first image, future situation on the second image:

Quote:
Originally Posted by RDaneel View Post
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Old April 20th, 2014, 04:41 AM   #2822
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News!!

The ERTMS/ETCS-2 will finally enter service on the Albacete-Alicante HSL on Sunday 20 April (that is, today).

An Easter special Alvia Alicante-Madrid will be the first to start operating under the new signalling system.

I´m not sure wether all the trains will operate under the ERTMS/ETCS-2 from tomorrow or it will be a progressive thing.

The top speed between Albacete and Alicante gets finally increased to 300 km/h.

The best travel time Madrid-Alicante gets cut to 2h05min.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 04:50 AM   #2823
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Side-effects of the new fare system on Easter holidays...

Messages posted on April 18.

I translated from Spanish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adpg View Post
All trains Seville-Barcelona are full until April 25.
All trains Seville-Zaragoza are full until April 28.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adpg View Post
Seville-Madrid on Sunday 20, all trains are full, even double AVEs with 16 coaches (8 coaches + 8 coaches).

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Old April 20th, 2014, 05:11 AM   #2824
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Venta de Baños-Burgos HSL.

Images of the works at the Estépar false tunnel, the least advanced part of this section.

I translated the comments from Spanish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jotaerre View Post
We can now tell the cutting on the hill.











On the tunnel hillside.





In hindsight, the viaduct over river Arlanzon.







We keep on climbing the hillside.





Looking up the hill, there´s still much to be done.













On top of the hill.





It´s difficult to grasp the size of the thing, it´s massive.









I suspect that here will be the tunnel portal.







Looking towards Estépar.





Zooming, we see a wildlife pass which will have 7 metres of earth on top.













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Old April 20th, 2014, 10:52 AM   #2825
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It's great to hear that HS trains on some lines are being sold out. Any idea how close to the line capacity is the current schedule of about 1 train per hour between Madrid and Seville? Could it be doubled or tripled if there was demand and spare trains?
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Old April 20th, 2014, 03:08 PM   #2826
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
It's great to hear that HS trains on some lines are being sold out. Any idea how close to the line capacity is the current schedule of about 1 train per hour between Madrid and Seville? Could it be doubled or tripled if there was demand and spare trains?
Well, in the stretch between Madrid and Torrejón de Velasco there are not only the Sevilla trains, but as well the Valencia, Albacete/Alicante, Toledo, Ciudad Real/Puertollano, Málaga and the ones to Huelva, Cádiz, Algeciras and Granada. So, this is a pretty charged stretch of the network.



This is the general organization of schedules of arriving and departing trains at Puerta de Atocha. The new two tracks from Torrejón to the southern access to the Atocha-Chamartín tunnel need to be installed at some point for increasing capacity. At peak hours, there are trains every 5 minutes so, I don't think LZB allows more trains... not sure though... maybe 437.001 can tell you.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 04:10 PM   #2827
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
It's great to hear that HS trains on some lines are being sold out.
Not only in some lines.
That´s the general trend since the new fare system was implemented.

Obviously, in the case I posted we´re talking about a peak period and a line (the one to Andalusia -Seville, Malaga, Cordova) that serves a region that gets extremely touristy during the Easter holidays.

But the other routes, be them AVE or Alvia, or even non-HSR, are also getting better and better in terms of occupancy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Any idea how close to the line capacity is the current schedule of about 1 train per hour between Madrid and Seville? Could it be doubled or tripled if there was demand and spare trains?
There still is room enough, the section between Madrid-Atocha and Torrejón de Velasco is charged, but never as the Paris-Lyon HSL in France.
But it´s probably getting closer to the LGV Est or LGV Nord in France.

Sincé the shape of the network in Spain is rather different due to the different position of Madrid in Spain in comparison with Paris in France, something which doesn´t allow the creation of very busy routes connecting several regions all in one go -and also the fact that Spain is less populated than France, I´d say the Spanish HSR network is doing quite well, but won´t be able to give the big leap in passengers until it gets more expanded (Murcia, Granada, Galicia, Asturias, Basque Country) and thus allowing for more and more diametral trains (ie, Bilbao-Madrid-Alicante, to name one posible typical case).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reivajar View Post
Well, in the stretch between Madrid and Torrejón de Velasco there are not only the Sevilla trains, but as well the Valencia, Albacete/Alicante, Toledo, Ciudad Real/Puertollano, Málaga and the ones to Huelva, Cádiz, Algeciras and Granada. So, this is a pretty charged stretch of the network.

[...]

This is the general organization of schedules of arriving and departing trains at Puerta de Atocha. The new two tracks from Torrejón to the southern access to the Atocha-Chamartín tunnel need to be installed at some point for increasing capacity. At peak hours, there are trains every 5 minutes so, I don't think LZB allows more trains... not sure though... maybe 437.001 can tell you.
They don´t need to be installed to increase capacity, there´s still plenty of room.
Capacity could be increased right now if need be without those two new tracks, in the current situation.
Further extensions could maybe lead to a strained situation though, so that was also thought in provision for the future.

Instead, those two new tracks are needed to connect the lines to the South (Seville, Malaga) and East (Barcelona, Valencia, Alicante) to those to the North (Galicia, Asturias, Basque Country).

The lines to the North depart from Chamartín station, while the lines to the East and South depart from Atocha station.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 04:15 PM   #2828
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Which is the maximum frequency of trains supported by the LZB system used in the Madrid-Seville HSL?
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Old April 20th, 2014, 04:54 PM   #2829
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 437.001 View Post
Not only in some lines.
That´s the general trend since the new fare system was implemented.

But the other routes, be them AVE or Alvia, or even non-HSR, are also getting better and better in terms of occupancy.
Even better. You mentioned only one line in your latest post, so I didn't automatically assume it to be the case for all of them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 437.001 View Post
Sincé the shape of the network in Spain is rather different due to the different position of Madrid in Spain in comparison with Paris in France, something which doesn´t allow the creation of very busy routes connecting several regions all in one go -and also the fact that Spain is less populated than France, I´d say the Spanish HSR network is doing quite well
There are advantages and disadvantages to both systems, but I think I prefer how you did it in Madrid with only two stations which will be connected in the near future. It's really a pain if you need to change from one HS train to another in Paris... Downside of course is that the system will be prone to capacity limits sooner with so many destination sharing a small part of the route out of Madrid.

It will be more relevant to compare French and Spanish systems in 15-20 years when both systems are more or less complete and mature.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 05:30 PM   #2830
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Valladolid-Venta de Baños-Palencia-Leon HSL.
Section Valladolid-Venta de Baños.

(translated from Spanish)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pachelo View Post
Well on Sunday I went to the sector between Valladolid and Cabezón de Pisuerga.

First pic, taken 2 kn north of the Valladolid cemetery, the catenary and poles are the ones used for the HSL, but the tracks are those of the classic line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pachelo View Post
Another pic of the same area.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pachelo View Post
This pic was taken from the road to Valoria la Buena, that runs near the tunnel that exists past Cabezón de Pisuerga on the way to Palencia.
The pic was taken looking towards Valladolid.





Next pictures taken from the same spot with zoom.









This one´s taken from the same spot, but looking towards Palencia, with the tunnel portal.







Here we´re on the other side of the tunnel, you can see the portal, looking towards Valladolid.





Sleepers already prepared, the platform between Valladolid and Leon is already full of them.





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Old April 20th, 2014, 05:38 PM   #2831
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reivajar View Post
Which is the maximum frequency of trains supported by the LZB system used in the Madrid-Seville HSL?
Five minutes, I believe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Even better. You mentioned only one line in your latest post, so I didn't automatically assume it to be the case for all of them.
Actually, if the lines to Seville and Malaga show these occupancies, one can guess that the Madrid-Barcelona line shows a similar situation, and the same goes for the new Alicante HSL, which today will see the first full ETCS-2 train with passengers, running at 250km/h (not 300 km/h since the train is an Alvia and not an AVE, but I guess that the AVEs will naturally follow).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
There are advantages and disadvantages to both systems, but I think I prefer how you did it in Madrid with only two stations which will be connected in the near future. It's really a pain if you need to change from one HS train to another in Paris... Downside of course is that the system will be prone to capacity limits sooner with so many destination sharing a small part of the route out of Madrid.
I don´t know, Atocha and Chamartín alone with the Atocha-Chamartín tunnel (once finished, that is) are supposed to be able to cope with it in the mid term.

Anyway, the Atocha-Chamartín tunnel will be open without the Atocha underground extension, and without a connection to the Barcelona HSL, so there´s still room to admit even more trains.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
It will be more relevant to compare French and Spanish systems in 15-20 years when both systems are more or less complete and mature.
True.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 05:43 PM   #2832
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 437.001 View Post
Five minutes, I believe.
In that case not too many additional frequencies can be added between Atocha and Torrejón de Velasco during peak hours. For sure, capacity can be increased as not all the services are served by double trainsets. Anyway, we will if services to Alicante are increased, or even if they start to operate the services together with the Valencia trains to be separated later in Cuencia-Fernando Zobel to optimize space available in Atocha...

In 2 years we will see how the new services to Granada, Cádiz and Alicante are developed.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 05:58 PM   #2833
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reivajar View Post
In that case not too many additional frequencies can be added between Atocha and Torrejón de Velasco during peak hours.
Yes, during the peak hours the situation is getting a bit strained now. But never like Paris-Lyon.
But as soon as the Atocha-Chamartín connection opens, that will decompress again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reivajar View Post
For sure, capacity can be increased as not all the services are served by double trainsets. Anyway, we will if services to Alicante are increased, or even if they start to operate the services together with the Valencia trains to be separated later in Cuencia-Fernando Zobel to optimize space available in Atocha...
Obviously, running double AVEs with separation/coupling at Cuenca is a clear option.
Who would have told a decade ago the Cuenca people that they would be getting this many trains, when they were one of Spain´s rail bottoms?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reivajar View Post
In 2 years we will see how the new services to Granada, Cádiz and Alicante are developed.
I´m not all that worried.
Cadiz trains could be switched to Alvia by replacing some Seville AVEs by Alvias (that is, if there are enough Alvia trains, otherwise that wouldn´t be possible).
And if that came to not being possible, you could always increase the number of regional trains between Seville and Cadiz.

Granada, Murcia, and the growth of the Alicante services worry me more... to an extent, since for Granada trains you can give the same treatment as in Alicante/Valencia, the coupling being with Seville AVEs at Cordova, or Malaga AVEs at Antequera-Santa Ana.

Murcia is another beast, since that is one region which has a lot of underdeveloped potential. Same goes for Alicante. I suspect that sooner than expected Cuenca station will earn an unexpectedly high number of stops.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 06:18 PM   #2834
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In many busy railway networks there are stations which by themselves serve not that many people, but get disproportionally many trains due to being junction points to/from larger cities. Cuenca likely to become one of those.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 06:36 PM   #2835
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Valladolid-Venta de Baños-Palencia-Leon HSL.
Section Venta de Baños-Palencia.

Palencia station and surroundings.

(translated from Spanish)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pachelo View Post
Images takem on Monday 14 April.

Here I am, on the only level crossing around the Palencia station, right where the lines for Leon (double track) and Santander (single track) diverge. The level crossing is known as "los tres pasos" ("the three crossings").

On the first pic, I´m looking towards the North, and we see in the first place the line for Santander, on its left a dead-end track (built 2 years ago), with some machinery stationed in it.





With a different angle, we can see on the left the two tracks of the Leon line (the one on the far left will be changed to standard gauge and be used by the AVE) and in the middle the new point between the Leon and Santander lines, which was made 2 years ago too, and which will be very much used from April 27 on.





On the following pics, I´ve turned 180º, and I´m looking towards the south, with Palencia station in hindsight.
I´ve made them with quite a lot of zoom and they make the faraway things look too close, without much depth.
On the pic we see tracks 6 and 4, and on the right tracks 2 and 1.
We can tell track 6 is cut (last Tuesday they installed the new catenary), the operators in hindsight are working on the new bretelle point (they were connecting loads of wires), and a bit more to the right, working on a new signal on track 4.
The end of the pic is almost 1 km away from me.





Same place, but even more zoom.





More detailed, working on the signal, and finishing the extra-long central platform.





In this pic, I´m in the same spot, but more to the right, and we see in the first place the tracks coming from Leon and on the right a loop track used for parking trains.
Of the two tracks coming from Leon, the one on the right (track 1) will be the one that will see its gauge changed to standard, and from April 27 will be cut until the point we see in the middle of the pic, and from there and until Leon will keep on existing until mid-June.





From the same spot, but with much more zoom, we see tracks 1 and 2 of the station. We see technicians measuring things on the right, preparing things to start works on track 1 and its platform from April 27 on.





Change of spot, now I´m 2 km south of the station, almost out of Palencia, on an overpass from which you can see very well the flyover of the Burgos line, the central ones being the ones to Valladolid.
We can see a new point on the right side, waiting.





Same spot, much more zoom, on the right we see the flyover, the Iberian gauge tracks have been taken away, since that will be used by the HSL to reach Palencia, but not at a very high speed, since this is a provisory solution.
Then, to the left, we see the double track of the Valladolid classic line, and the point we see on the left is the second track (and the only one that is in use now) of the Burgos line.
The gauge changer is beyond that point, along the Burgos line.
The point we see on the far bottom left is the new Villalobon crossing loop, which will be heavily used from April 27 on.





Here I´m like 2 km further away from Palencia in the direction of Burgos, on the tracks that we saw start on the pics above.
The track on the left is the one for Burgos line in hindsight we see how it becomes double-track again.
The first point from the left will see the Alvias from Santander to Madrid (and the other way around) enter the gauge changer to continue to Madrid (or leave the HSL for Santander).
And the track on the right is the HSL itself, which inside Palencia will be the current track 1 and on the other end of the station will continue till Leon, it will be in standard gauge only. No high speed here, though, as you can see.





Same spot, more zoom, details of the gauge changer.







From the Magaz motoway, details of the finished gauge changer.





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Old April 20th, 2014, 06:52 PM   #2836
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Valladolid-Venta de Baños-Palencia-Leon HSL.
Section Venta de Baños-Palencia.

Palencia station and surroundings.

This scheme shows the layout envisaged at Palencia and surroundings (blue lines, standard gauge/HSL, red lines, Iberian gauge/classic line):

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Old April 20th, 2014, 07:26 PM   #2837
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The poster whose post you translated mentions 27th of April several times. What is going to happen at that date? Not entirely obvious from the post alone...
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Old April 20th, 2014, 07:37 PM   #2838
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Valladolid-Venta de Baños-Palencia-Leon HSL + Venta de Baños-Burgos HSL + Venta de Baños by-pass (Palencia-Burgos).
Venta de Baños station and surroundings.

(translated from Spanish)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pachelo View Post
Now I´m at Venta de Baños, like 1 km south of the station, looking towards Valladolid, on a new road overpass over the HSL (the overpass isn´t open yet).

On the right we see the Precon Factory, which produces railway sleepers, and the HSL, all full of sleepers.

On the top far right we gan get a glimpse of the classic line, with a class 449 EMU on a regional service.





Same spot, but looking towards Venta de Baños station.
On the left we see an Alvia running on the classic line, and behind it the rail yard for freight, and in hindsight on the right the station building, and in the middle the HSL platform, looking towards Burgos/Palencia.





Now I´m on the HSL platform, the overpass from which I took the former pictures on top, and looking towards Venta de Baños station.





Same spot, lots of zoom, Venta de Baños station and its overpass.





Same spot, but now looking towards Valladolid, on the right and in hindsight the Precon sleeper factory.





Now I´m on the Burgos HSL (much less advanced by far), I´m like 3 or 4 km north of Venta de Baños, looking towards Venta de Baños.
On the right we can see the Hontoria cement Factory, and in the first place the platform of the Burgos HSL (Burgos behind me), and in front of me the junction of the Burgos HSL with the Venta de Baños by-pass that will lead to Palencia, with a flyover. Under the flyover trains will follow to Venta de Baños and Valladolid.





Same spot, lots of zoom, details of the flyover and behind it, the viaduct over rover Pisuerga of the HSL from Burgos to Valladolid, in hindsight the Siro biscuit factory.





Same spot, but looking towards Burgos.
We can tell at first sight that it´s not as advanced as the Leon line.
The hill in hinsight will be crossed by the HSL through a tunnel, near the village of Reinoso del Cerrato, of which we can get a glimpse of the portal on the right of the electrical pole.





Zooming, we can tell how the Burgos HSL is less advanced.

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Old April 20th, 2014, 07:38 PM   #2839
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
The poster whose post you translated mentions 27th of April several times. What is going to happen at that date? Not entirely obvious from the post alone...
Tracks 1 and 2 at Palencia station will be closed in view of their change of gauge, and HSL works will intensify at Palencia.

This is important, because at certain hours, Palencia station sees quite a bit of trains in short periods, while in others there are long periods without any train.
This is difficult to solve since this is mid-line in every direction, and the train timetables are organized thinking of Madrid, Barcelona, Valladolid, the Basque Country, Galicia or Asturias.
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Old April 20th, 2014, 08:35 PM   #2840
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Madrid-Galicia HSL.
Section Zamora-Pedralba de la Pradería.


Images taken between Mombuey and Cernadilla.

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