daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old April 21st, 2013, 12:03 PM   #521
Xoser_barcelona
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Barcelona
Posts: 109
Likes (Received): 47

Quote:
Originally Posted by loefet View Post
I'm not 100% sure about this, but I have a theory that the Japanese engineers that are developing the JR Maglev took it into consideration that they would at some point in the future replace the HSR Shinkansen Lines with Maglev. The reason why I got this idea is that the dimensions of the Maglev train is so much smaller than the normal Shinkansen train that there is space to build Maglev "track" within the space available today on the non Maglev lines.
So, Yes I believe that it's possible to replace the lines if they want to. However I don't think that they will ever convert the Tokaido Shinkansen since they are building a dedicated Maglev line between Tokyo and Nagoya (and eventually all the way to Osaka), which will parallel the older Tokaido Shinkansen, so I don't see the point of doing it. Also replacing the track in the Tokaido Shinkansen would be harder than the newer lines since much of the track is built on embankments. The newer lines use a lot more Slab-track which would make it easier to pre-fab the Maglev sections and also make the conversion pretty quick, since then they would more or less just have to lift down the old pieces and replace them with the new, connect it all up and it would be ready to go. With an embankment you have to build the track from the ground up before the Maglev track would be put in.

On the second one, Yes it would be possible, if it's worth it? I don't know.
Thanks for the info!
Xoser_barcelona no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old April 21st, 2013, 02:33 PM   #522
Hegemonic
Registered User
 
Hegemonic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 936
Likes (Received): 366

Quote:
Originally Posted by quashlo View Post
Hm, I don't know if it's "worth" going there... I might wait until they start allowing the public on the test rides again, although there are some exhibits about the maglev and you can still see the maglev guideway from the third floor observation deck. It's also free (no entry fee), but it's not exactly easy to reach, since it's in semi-rural Yamanshi Prefecture. The closest station is Kasei on the Fuji Kyūkō Line, and from there you can either walk or take a taxi.

Info:
http://www.pref.yamanashi.jp/linear-...enter/top.html
OK, thanks for the info, I hope to stop by there on the way to Mt Fuji in about 3 weeks.

They both look pretty close.
Hegemonic no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 21st, 2013, 02:42 PM   #523
SamuraiBlue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,232
Likes (Received): 195

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegemonic View Post
OK, thanks for the info, I hope to stop by there on the way to Mt Fuji in about 3 weeks.

They both look pretty close.
There are days that are closed. Here is the calendar.

http://www.pref.yamanashi.jp/linear-...rkaikannbi.pdf
SamuraiBlue no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 22nd, 2013, 10:01 PM   #524
quashlo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 14,835
Likes (Received): 3215

リニア奈良・三重ルートで 建設促進県期成同盟会
http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/e-japan/nar...OYT8T01504.htm

A lobby group in Nara Prefecture is pushing to have a route passing through Nara and Mie selected for the Chūō Shinkansen maglev. Of course, this is the original planned route, although Kyōto would love to change that. JR Central is still being tight-lipped about it, though, and are primarily focusing on the initial segment between Tōkyō and Nagoya, saying the specific alignment of the Nagoya – Ōsaka segment has yet to be determined.

Hopefully, this route gets selected… Kyōto already has very excellent rail links, and maglev passengers will still be able to transfer easily at Nagoya to the Tōkaidō Shinkansen anyways. Meanwhile, Nara and Mie are a bit harder to reach currently, but the maglev should benefit both of their tourism sectors quite handsomely.
__________________
San Francisco
Japan 2013; Japan 2011
: Tōkyō I, II, III (Kamakura), IV (Yokohama), V; Ōsaka I (+Kyōto +Kōbe), II (Kyōto), III (Nara); Hiroshima; Fukuoka; Nagasaki; Kita-Kyushu + Shimonoseki; Nikkō
quashlo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 24th, 2013, 09:30 PM   #525
quashlo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 14,835
Likes (Received): 3215

JR東海、リニア中間駅の概要提示へ 5月に山梨で
http://www.chunichi.co.jp/s/article/...490202610.html

JR Central will release the details of the three intermediate stations on the Chūō Shinkansen maglev to be constructed in Gifu, Nagano, and Yamanashi Prefectures at a public workshop to be held on 2013.05.13 in Yamanashi Prefecture. As we already know, these three stations will be aboveground, fully funded by the railway at the cost of ¥35 billion each. Details regarding the underground stations in Tōkyō, Kanagawa, and Nagoya Prefectures will follow thereafter.
__________________
San Francisco
Japan 2013; Japan 2011
: Tōkyō I, II, III (Kamakura), IV (Yokohama), V; Ōsaka I (+Kyōto +Kōbe), II (Kyōto), III (Nara); Hiroshima; Fukuoka; Nagasaki; Kita-Kyushu + Shimonoseki; Nikkō
quashlo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 30th, 2013, 09:09 PM   #526
quashlo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 14,835
Likes (Received): 3215

Maglev alignment being refined to avoid Iida City historical sites
リニア駅、遺跡回避で調整 飯田線、新駅検討も

http://www.shinmai.co.jp/news/201304...I090017000.php

On 2013.04.29, it was revealed that JR Central, Iida City, and Nagano Prefecture are working to refine the alignment of the Chūō Shinkansen maglev to avoid the Gonga Ruins (恒川遺跡群) located to the southeast of Moto-Zenkōji Station on the JR Iida Line. Avoiding the ruins will likely force the maglev to the southwest of Moto-Zenkōji Station, which means that discussion may turn towards a new station on the Iida Line given the distances involved.

The Chūō Shinkansen plan calls for a station within a 5 km diameter around Moto-Zenkōji Station, oriented east-west near the Zakōji (座光寺) and Kamisato (上郷) districts of Iida City. Maintenance facilities will be constructed adjacent to the station, and a transformer substation is planned on the east side of the Tenryū River towards Toyooka Village (豊丘村).

The Nagano Prefecture Archeological Association filed a petition with JR Central in January to avoid the historical ruins, although JR Central responded that it would be difficult to reach a compromise between avoiding the ruins and connecting the maglev and Iida Line. The ruins in question include sites dating from the Nara and Heian Periods.

__________________
San Francisco
Japan 2013; Japan 2011
: Tōkyō I, II, III (Kamakura), IV (Yokohama), V; Ōsaka I (+Kyōto +Kōbe), II (Kyōto), III (Nara); Hiroshima; Fukuoka; Nagasaki; Kita-Kyushu + Shimonoseki; Nikkō
quashlo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 3rd, 2013, 04:55 PM   #527
pdovak
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 9
Likes (Received): 0

Prototype of high-speed maglev train shown to public
http://ajw.asahi.com/article/economy...AJ201306030104

Quote:
TSURU, Yamanashi Prefecture--The public got a rare chance to view a linked up prototype of the super-fast maglev "floating" train on its test track here June 3.

Operator Central Japan Railway Co. (JR Central) says the magnetically levitated train is set to enter commercial operation between Tokyo and Nagoya in 2027.

The sleek L0 series maglev train, called "Linear motor car" in Japan, will eventually service the entire Chuo Shinkansen Line that links Tokyo with Osaka through Nagano Prefecture and Nagoya.

It will bypass the Tokaido Shinkansen Line, slashing the travel time between the two cities from two and a half hours to one hour and seven minutes.

The train was designed to operate at 500 kph.

It was only last November that the first car of the train was operated in public view for the first time. On June 3, the first five cars were hooked up on the test track.

The first car is 28 meters long, of which 15 meters constitutes a streamlined “nose” to reduce air resistance at high speed. Each of the subsequent cars is 24.3 meters long. The cars are more box-like in structure than current Shinkansen models to create more interior space.

JR Central, based in Nagoya, is gearing up for full-fledged tests from September.

The maglev train has four seats in a row, one less than Shinkansen models. The first car has a total of 24 seats while each of the subsequent cars has 68.

On June 3, a five-car L0 series maglev train was pulled on the test track by a special maintenance vehicle.

"This is the first step toward commercial operations," said Yasukazu Endo, director of the Yamanashi linear test center. "Everything is being done to gear up for a full-fledged test."
Check out the photos, what a cool-looking train!
pdovak no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 3rd, 2013, 07:07 PM   #528
phoenixboi08
Registered User
 
phoenixboi08's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,550
Likes (Received): 798

I'm not trying to derail the thread, but I've been struggling to find out what goes into determining fares.

I know the cost of operation is 1 major factor, but (like many consumer electronics, say), the operator could accept a smaller profit margin, which would increase volume. Or, they could go the other way.

I guess my main question is, what is the general guideline for factoring in actual cost, and what have the one-way ticket projections been for this line so far?
phoenixboi08 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 07:05 AM   #529
SamuraiBlue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,232
Likes (Received): 195

Quote:
Originally Posted by phoenixboi08 View Post
I'm not trying to derail the thread, but I've been struggling to find out what goes into determining fares.

I know the cost of operation is 1 major factor, but (like many consumer electronics, say), the operator could accept a smaller profit margin, which would increase volume. Or, they could go the other way.

I guess my main question is, what is the general guideline for factoring in actual cost, and what have the one-way ticket projections been for this line so far?
I read somewhere that the ticket price for Shinagawa - Osaka will be about 1,000 yen higher then the present ticket price on the Nozomi.
Although it requires more electricity to run the train, the cost for maintenance will be a fraction to what is required right now on the Tokaido shinkansen.
The travel distance is shorter which also plays a part since JR fares are based on distance on track.
SamuraiBlue no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 09:43 AM   #530
Coccodrillo
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 7,200
Likes (Received): 768

Quote:
The maglev train has four seats in a row, one less than Shinkansen models. The first car has a total of 24 seats while each of the subsequent cars has 68.
Will that smaller capacity be sufficient?
__________________
1.6.2016: Basistunnel!

für Güter die Bahn ~ pour vos marchandises le rail ~ chi dice merci dice ferrovia
Coccodrillo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 02:47 PM   #531
Hegemonic
Registered User
 
Hegemonic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 936
Likes (Received): 366

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
Will that smaller capacity be sufficient?
I read somewhere that each train will be made up of 16 cars.

On another note, I visited the test facility about 3 weeks ago now on the way back from Mt Fuji.

The track looks awesome, they had installed the metal with holes on the entry to the tunnels on this section of track also.
Hegemonic no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 04:32 PM   #532
loefet
Registered User
 
loefet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Göteborg
Posts: 525
Likes (Received): 233

Nice to hear that there is progress t that place as well.
And yes the trains will be made up of 16 cars just like the normal ones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
Will that smaller capacity be sufficient?
It's not there to replace the Tokaido Shinkansen line, but to serve as a compliment to it. Yes it will have lower capacity, but the Tokaido line will still be there to take a big number of the total amount of travellers between Tokyo and Nagoya (eventually Osaka). See it like a "Super Nozomi" with it's own set of track to increase the capacity on the Tokaido Shinkansen line.
loefet no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 05:11 PM   #533
SamuraiBlue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,232
Likes (Received): 195

Quote:
Originally Posted by loefet View Post
Nice to hear that there is progress t that place as well.
And yes the trains will be made up of 16 cars just like the normal ones.


It's not there to replace the Tokaido Shinkansen line, but to serve as a compliment to it. Yes it will have lower capacity, but the Tokaido line will still be there to take a big number of the total amount of travellers between Tokyo and Nagoya (eventually Osaka). See it like a "Super Nozomi" with it's own set of track to increase the capacity on the Tokaido Shinkansen line.
In terms of capacity of line I believe Chuo Shinkansen has more compared to the Tokaido since a train can complete a Tokyo Osaka route in less the half the time therefore the you can transport double the amount within the same time period per train.
SamuraiBlue no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 05:53 PM   #534
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,979
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuraiBlue View Post
therefore the you can transport double the amount within the same time period per train.
Yes, but Tokaido Shinkansen merely employs more trains.

How many trains can travel on Chuo Shinkansen per hour? Tokaido Shinkansen has 10 trains per hour.
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 06:12 PM   #535
loefet
Registered User
 
loefet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Göteborg
Posts: 525
Likes (Received): 233

The Tokaido Shinkansen have 14 trains per hour, you shouldn't forget the Hikari's and Kodama's in terms of capacity per hour.
I think I have seen numbers that point towards 10 train/hour on the Chuo Shinkansen. So no way you cut it then you will still have more hourly capacity of departing/arriving passengers on the Tokaido Shinkansen. The Chuo Shinkansen will on the other hand have later departures than the Tokaido one, since it will take less time, so it will have about 15 more maximum departures/day/direction so it will claw back a bit more total capacity on that.
By having faster trains on Chuo Shinkansen means that they can turn around faster is correct, but if you still have a maximum of 10 departures/hour then it won't increase the capacity. What it will do is that it will require less trains to keep that departure rate compared to the slower Tokaido Shinkansen.
By doing some quick calculations then I would say that the Chuo Shinkansen line would require about 30 trains to be able to keep a 10 trains/hour traffic between Tokyo and Osaka, add a few for so you have some extra in maintenance, etc. Where as the Tokaido Shinkansen requires over 70 trains (if you assume that all of them were Nozomi's, which they aren't), so I would more or less say 100 trains to be able to run today's traffic between Tokyo and Osaka alone.
loefet no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 06:43 PM   #536
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,979
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by loefet View Post
The Tokaido Shinkansen have 14 trains per hour, you shouldn't forget the Hikari's and Kodama's in terms of capacity per hour.
When do these 14 trains run?
The standard hourly schedule out of Tokyo seems to be:
6 Nozomis - each 10 minute sharp, of which :00, :20 and :40 terminate at Osaka, :50 at Hiroshima and :10 and :30 at Hakata
2 Hikaris - :33 terminating at Osaka, :03 at Okayama
2 Kodamas - :26 terminating at Nagoya, :56 at Osaka

So just 10. Where are the other 4?
Quote:
Originally Posted by loefet View Post
I think I have seen numbers that point towards 10 train/hour on the Chuo Shinkansen. So no way you cut it then you will still have more hourly capacity of departing/arriving passengers on the Tokaido Shinkansen. The Chuo Shinkansen will on the other hand have later departures than the Tokaido one, since it will take less time,
How will the operating hours of Chuo Shinkansen compare against Tokaido? How long maintenance window does the maglev track need every night?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 4th, 2013, 07:46 PM   #537
loefet
Registered User
 
loefet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Göteborg
Posts: 525
Likes (Received): 233

Well they might not run 14 trains/hour all day, every day, but there are 14 slots in the latest revision of the time table: http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%9D%...BB.8A.E9.A7.85
Sue most of tyhe time they only run 8-10 trains/hour, but on special occasions, such as Golden Week, they have the option to run up to 14 trains/hour. I'm pretty sure that the 10 trains/hour that I have seen as quoted for the Chuo Shinkansen is also an "up to" number (until they manages to squeeze in a few more).

Since the Chuo line is no way near complete we don't know. Most likely it will end up to something similar to all other Shinkansen lines, 06:00 - 24:00. But since a Mag-Lev requires a lot less of maintenance then they might not need that much time. But since most of the other public transport shuts down at night anyway, then I doubt that they will extend the hours for the Chuo Shinkansen.
loefet no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 5th, 2013, 12:21 AM   #538
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,979
Likes (Received): 388

JR wants to have very basic stops only on Chuo Shinkansen:
http://www.japantoday.com/category/n...imple-stations
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 5th, 2013, 02:41 AM   #539
traveler
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 8,887
Likes (Received): 299

Great!
traveler no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 6th, 2013, 12:52 AM   #540
quashlo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 14,835
Likes (Received): 3215

JR Central unveils basic design render for maglev’s intermediate stations

Official press release:
http://company.jr-central.co.jp/comp...df/info_31.pdf

The basic design dimensions will be up to 50 m wide and 1000 m long. The platforms will be entirely enclosed and feature platform doors, while the station exterior will be concrete and feature noise walls or hoods as needed.

However, the biggest news is that they are looking to be as frugal and efficient in the design as possible, including not providing any station staff. They will provide an administrative office for use by railway staff, restrooms, a single station entrance / exit, and vertical circulation (stairs, escalators, and elevators). Any additional facilities requested by the local governments will be the responsibility of the local governments to fund (if you remember, JR Central initially didn’t want to be responsible for funding any intermediate stations, but they later rescinded that and will fund all of the intermediate stations). However, JR Central will provide most of the area at ground level—outside of the 300 sq m required for station circulation—for lease and use by the local governments as they please. So basically, the local governments will have to fund and build the additional amenties like station retail, souvenir shops, etc.

Other tidbits they also announced is that all seats will be reserved, and that there will be no non-reserved seating (自由席). This is not so much of a big deal, though, as JR East already does this with the Hayabusa and [i]Super Komachi/i] E5 / E6 sets on the Tōhoku Shinkansen, although the elimination of non-reserved seating will, I believe, be a first for the Tōkaidō Shinkansen. Passengers won’t be standing on the train anyways, so it makes sense to eliminate the non-reserved seating.

The ticket sales system will also be a new type of Web-based system, and there will be no TVMs, ticket counters, or other sales area / devices provided at the station.









__________________
San Francisco
Japan 2013; Japan 2011
: Tōkyō I, II, III (Kamakura), IV (Yokohama), V; Ōsaka I (+Kyōto +Kōbe), II (Kyōto), III (Nara); Hiroshima; Fukuoka; Nagasaki; Kita-Kyushu + Shimonoseki; Nikkō
quashlo no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium