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Old September 23rd, 2014, 09:24 PM   #421
Atlantropa
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Quote:
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Well firstly, all buildings affect people. From a crappy modernist block of flats to a stucco white villa with palms. People - humans, are affected by their environment.

When the state builds a monument, it doubles this affect. This is no longer the individual saying what he aspires to, but the state. This is the state showing its citizens what it aspires to and expects. The use of concrete, the marxist and communist party murals plastered all over the building, communist mosaics, symbols on the Buzludzha concrete of the monument are all designed to reinforce the culture and ideals of the communist party of Bulagia and also to commemorate the events in 1891 when the socialists led by Dimitar Blagoev assembled secretly in the area. This is a massive propaganda event.

Using an historical battle as reasoning, the height and commanding position add the the propaganda of the monument and its power. It is controlling nature in a way, dominating a peak. This monument was carefully premeditated for maximum affect and the locals who have vandalized mocking its communistic nuances are aware of it as am I.
Way better then before; put aside your speculations on the reason why Buzludzha has been vandalized, I agree on most of the observations you made here.
Still, suppose we agree that every symbol has the purpose of performing some kind of brainwashing; then almost every (at least partially) monumental building on earth will share that purpose, from menhirs to One World Trade Center; so, as That One Guy says, why pointing out that Buzludzha in particular is a "brainwashing headquarter"?, given that point of view, thousands of buildings should be "brainwashing headquarters", and that would be the normality.

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I don't think anyone here is as extreme as you, well maybe the previous poster who used the word 'hate.' That is also a very strong word. The monument is not hated, just mocked by the locals. It is seen as a warning of what can happen without democracy rather than a bit of genius architecture.

Personally I am not intolerant of it, neither do I hate it. I am impressed by its attempt to brainwash and admire how much thought the communist party of Bulgaria put into it. It is a great symbol and lesson at the same time.
I didn't mean to be "extreme", simply couldn't (and still can't) see your point. As I told you, I agree on many of your second thoughts, but imho expressions like "breainwashing headquarters" as well as cliffnotes on democracy and its enemies are completely out of place and should be avoided because of their political nature.
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Old September 23rd, 2014, 11:15 PM   #422
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"Forget your past"

More like "acknowlege your past and don't repeat the actions of those you criticize"

Turn it into a museum, or something. That way the Bulgarians can let the future generations know the harsh facts about the communist regime, and not get the impression that post-communism inspired thievery, vandalism and laziness.

So many Eastern Europeans have let their beauties of architecture, communist or not, turn to crumbling shit because they have this twisted mentality that taking care of them means communism. 15 years ago, the historic center of my native city Constanta was in a much better state than it is today, because of that very idea. The apartment blocks aren't restored, either, and end up looking like shit.
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Old September 23rd, 2014, 11:58 PM   #423
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I see socrealism every day and I am fine with that. We lived under communism for 45 years in Yugoslavia and then came Slobodan and we lived another 10 in socialism. I have nothing against this type of architecture.
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Old September 24th, 2014, 12:16 AM   #424
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatOneGuy View Post
"Forget your past"

More like "acknowlege your past and don't repeat the actions of those you criticize"

Turn it into a museum, or something. That way the Bulgarians can let the future generations know the harsh facts about the communist regime, and not get the impression that post-communism inspired thievery, vandalism and laziness.

So many Eastern Europeans have let their beauties of architecture, communist or not, turn to crumbling shit because they have this twisted mentality that taking care of them means communism. 15 years ago, the historic center of my native city Constanta was in a much better state than it is today, because of that very idea. The apartment blocks aren't restored, either, and end up looking like shit.
I'd personally restore them, transform them into museum but I'd also keep most of the writings that were added in recent times, shared by Reality7. I think that's history too
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Old September 24th, 2014, 01:27 AM   #425
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Yes of course, but letting an entire Bulgarian landmark go to waste like that is shameful.
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Old September 24th, 2014, 02:04 PM   #426
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Hotel Panorama, Sandanski, Bulgaria







photos by Petar Sabev
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Old September 24th, 2014, 07:29 PM   #427
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Yes of course, but letting an entire Bulgarian landmark go to waste like that is shameful.
The problem is that it's still used as a symbol for communism as every year hundreds of mentally disturbed individuals congregate there to consume free beer and kebabs and sing praises for an evil system

City hall in Ruse, Bulgaria





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Old September 24th, 2014, 07:33 PM   #428
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The problem is that it's still used as a symbol for communism as every year hundreds of mentally disturbed individuals congregate there to consume free beer and kebabs and sing praises for an evil system
People in churches do the same thing except with wine and biscuits.

Symbolism changes, history doesn't.
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Old September 24th, 2014, 07:35 PM   #429
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Not really. The history of Macedonia seems to change everyday depending on who is editing wikipedia..
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Old September 24th, 2014, 07:38 PM   #430
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That doesn't change what actually happened.
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Old September 24th, 2014, 07:42 PM   #431
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Actually it does. Whoever writes the history, creates it. Since the 1990s the Balkans has undergone plenty of historical revisionism. It is a cultural habit of the Balkans.
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Old September 24th, 2014, 07:53 PM   #432
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Spodek (meaning "saucer" in Polish) is a multipurpose arena complex in Katowice, Poland, opened in 1971.

Before the facade reconstruction in 2011



After



More info here
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Old September 24th, 2014, 07:53 PM   #433
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Looks like a homage to ufology.
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Old September 24th, 2014, 09:49 PM   #434
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This is about the architecture, not the politics.

Derailing the thread with political crap will lead down a dark path...
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Old September 24th, 2014, 10:10 PM   #435
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East Berlin 1980


East Berlin 1980 - Clock Showing World Times by jrjenks_agiletek, on Flickr


East Berlin 1980 - House Of the Teacher and Radio and TV Tower by jrjenks_agiletek, on Flickr
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Old September 24th, 2014, 10:23 PM   #436
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Is the House of the Teacher still in its original form? I know I've seen it in other historic photos.

edit: I just checked Google, and in fact it seems to be in great shape! It doesn't look worn out and even the murals look restored.

Last edited by ThatOneGuy; September 24th, 2014 at 10:32 PM.
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Old September 25th, 2014, 12:49 AM   #437
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertpunk View Post
This is about the architecture, not the politics.

Derailing the thread with political crap will lead down a dark path...
Politics created this type of architecture. Politics in my country created entire cities like East Berlin in socrealistic style. There is a part of Belgrade, for example, called New Belgrade constructed in this style. The two buildings that I've described are located there. Every city or town in former Yugoslavia has buildings like these and they are forever related with socialism and communism.
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Old September 25th, 2014, 12:54 AM   #438
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For me all buildings are steel, brick and concrete with no real meaning apart for their architectural value.
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Old September 25th, 2014, 01:56 PM   #439
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korisnik17229 View Post
Politics created this type of architecture. Politics in my country created entire cities like East Berlin in socrealistic style. There is a part of Belgrade, for example, called New Belgrade constructed in this style. The two buildings that I've described are located there. Every city or town in former Yugoslavia has buildings like these and they are forever related with socialism and communism.
Actually Brutalism was invented in the West and it have nothing to do with political system, you can find many such buildings in USA, Canada, Great Britain etc. while very few in Poland for example.
I'm not aware of any examples of socrealist (stalinist) style in former Yugoslavia.
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Old September 25th, 2014, 03:33 PM   #440
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Brutalism as an architectural philosophy was often also associated with a socialist utopian ideology, which tended to be supported by its designers, especially Alison and Peter Smithson, near the height of the style. This style had a strong position in the architecture of European socialist countries from 1975 to 1989 (Czechoslovakia, GDR, USSR). In Czechoslovakia brutalism was presented as an attempt to create a "national" but also "modern socialist" architectonic style.
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