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Old August 11th, 2009, 10:42 PM   #61
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I never understand why they used talgo cars with those locamotives...
I think it has to do with crash standards. They had to use standard locomotives when they were testing the talgo trains before production, and they didn't even try to make them look the same.
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Old August 11th, 2009, 11:09 PM   #62
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Then they should have made the talgo trains much higher, but they are low to keep the weight down since they have only 1 axle per car.

Now there are the new double-deck Talgo trains that are higher and would look better with the big locomotives.
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Old August 13th, 2009, 03:14 AM   #63
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EH500, a surprisingly large Japanese locomotive, 135 tonner

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Old August 13th, 2009, 03:58 AM   #64
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Failed demonstrator. 6000 hp & based on their hood unit form factor. The factory rollout had the connector cable etc covered only the pantograph showed.

PRR T1. This locomotive hauled passenger, freight & special trains. Possibly the largest duplex passenger steam locomotive ever produced.


Sadly these large duplex engines were prone to surging, and they were all scrapped by the late 50's.

Then the interesting, yet unreliable Baldwin DR-12-8-1500/2. 3000 HP 4 stroke design was ahead of its time, sadly the design proved unreliable & soon they along with baldwin itself went to the scrapper in the 60's.



They were usually pared with a second or B unit just in case.

- A
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Old August 13th, 2009, 10:27 AM   #65
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AA20-1



http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/MUSEU...s/russrefr.htm
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Old August 13th, 2009, 08:20 PM   #66
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never understood why american locomotives have a giant slab of metal sticking out the front and tiny windows.

Looks incredibly impractical
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Old August 13th, 2009, 10:04 PM   #67
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Metsfan (I'll forgive a guy from Newtown for being a Mets fan if he likes trains, LOL) the PRR's largest duplex was the S-1, not the T-1. The S-1 was single unit experimental, was 140ft long and completely impractical for regular use. Reason one being there was no place to turn it around. Turntables were not in existence on the PRR to turn something with a wheelbase that long. Too bad though, I'll bet it was awesome to see those 84" drive wheels flashing by as it pulled trains at 100+ MPH. It was used in passenger service for a few years on the road between Crestline OH and Chicago. It was used to test the dulpex theory and to show off a bit. Finding a wye to turn it on every time it made a run must have been a pain in the butt though.

The T-1 was a "production" model that was significantly smaller, almost just as fast, and a success in most estimations. There were about 50 of these and they were retired mostly because of dieselization, not because of operational shortfalls.

They also had a ten-drivered frieght duplex designated the Q-2. This monster generated just under 8,000 hpw in a test and other than drinking water faster than it could be supplied was also designated a success. Here we are almost 70 years later and there are still very few if any locomotives produced that are more powerful than this one.

Last edited by FlyFish; August 13th, 2009 at 11:53 PM.
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Old August 13th, 2009, 10:25 PM   #68
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never understood why american locomotives have a giant slab of metal sticking out the front and tiny windows.

Looks incredibly impractical

They are the safest in the world that's why. Those locomotives have plowed through massive construction bulldozers with no damage (One incident happened in NY some time ago, the Bulldozer was in far worse shape than the train. however, a non-american locomotive (especially european) that hit that same bulldozer would not be in such great shape, needless to say.

They are crash resistant and don't fly on top of eachother in a collision, they also look cool i think.
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Old August 13th, 2009, 10:57 PM   #69
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They are the safest in the world that's why. Those locomotives have plowed through massive construction bulldozers with no damage (One incident happened in NY some time ago, the Bulldozer was in far worse shape than the train. however, a non-american locomotive (especially european) that hit that same bulldozer would not be in such great shape, needless to say.

They are crash resistant and don't fly on top of eachother in a collision, they also look cool i think.
So American locomotives are built with the expectation that at some point in their lives they will crash into a bulldozer?

I'm thinking from a purely practical standpoint, would it not be better for the drivers cab to be situated as close to the front as possible for accurate buffering with some nice big windows to appreciate the scenery?

I guessing it's really a cultural difference more than anything practical.

A Euro locomotive would plow through a bulldozer with extremely similar results to the American. They are both heavy and both made of solid Steel.
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Old August 13th, 2009, 11:52 PM   #70
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So American locomotives are built with the expectation that at some point in their lives they will crash into a bulldozer?

I'm thinking from a purely practical standpoint, would it not be better for the drivers cab to be situated as close to the front as possible for accurate buffering with some nice big windows to appreciate the scenery?

I guessing it's really a cultural difference more than anything practical.

A Euro locomotive would plow through a bulldozer with extremely similar results to the American. They are both heavy and both made of solid Steel.
He explained why it is and he is correct. Don't take the bulldozer thing quite so literally. They are designed with the front ends they way they are for safety.

From a practical standpoint it is not better to sit closer to the front. You are less DEAD if you sit back a few feet in the event of a head on impact. The front of these locos are designed not to climb over one another in the event that they collide. They have this steel in the design to deflect the energy in an accident and go beside one another instead of up.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 12:25 AM   #71
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In short, this is why they are designed as such

Train on the left: Driver dead
Train on the right: Driver probably doesn't feel much



and vice versa



Quote:
Originally Posted by strandeed View Post
A Euro locomotive would plow through a bulldozer with extremely similar results to the American. They are both heavy and both made of solid Steel.
I strongly beg to differ, this is a good example of how NOT to construct a locomotive

Engine is not fine



This is better

image hosted on flickr
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Old August 14th, 2009, 12:59 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strandeed View Post
So American locomotives are built with the expectation that at some point in their lives they will crash into a bulldozer?

I'm thinking from a purely practical standpoint, would it not be better for the drivers cab to be situated as close to the front as possible for accurate buffering with some nice big windows to appreciate the scenery?

I guessing it's really a cultural difference more than anything practical.

A Euro locomotive would plow through a bulldozer with extremely similar results to the American. They are both heavy and both made of solid Steel.
No. American locomotives are built with the expectation that they will crash into a freight train.

I'm not kidding. That's FRA standards. Passenger trains like Acela have to be weighed down in order to meet safety specs (greatly increasing maintainence costs).

I would also argue that improving at-grade crossings and eliminating as many as possible (like Europe) is a much better plan than turning locomotives into tanks.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 01:02 AM   #73
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I would also argue that improving at-grade crossings and eliminating as many as possible (like Europe) is a much better plan than turning locomotives into tanks.
True, but there is still the danger of them crashing into another train. Locomotives are much heavier than tanks anyways, so why not build them so they can support their own weight in a crash?
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Old August 14th, 2009, 01:49 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay View Post
In short, this is why they are designed as such

I strongly beg to differ, this is a good example of how NOT to construct a locomotive

Engine is not fine


And here's an American locomotive that collided with another one at relatively low speed.



The engineers survived as they ran to the back of the cab before impact. The engineers on the other train jumped before impact and also survived

If a chassis collapses then that's a structural issue... nothing to do with how much metal is in front of you.

Here's food for thought.

Not a truck but then again the single locomotive was traveling at 80mph when it hits this car (huge energy involved) and to my knowledge it even had it's engine removed, thus reducing it's weight (you can see it being pushed up to speed).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekpD06P7kiI

EDIT: if my reasoning seems out please forgive me... i'm quite drunk at the moment...

Last edited by strandeed; August 14th, 2009 at 11:13 AM.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 06:20 PM   #75
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Oh god not this discussion again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay View Post
In short, this is why they are designed as such

Train on the left: Driver dead
Train on the right: Driver probably doesn't feel much

You always come with pictures, but they don't mean anything if the other information you provide is incorrect. The driver of the light rail passenger train didn't die, he saw it coming and rushed out of the cabin and even saved lives by warning the people inside the train about the upcoming crash.

Get your facts right if you want people to see your point.

For the rest there are always the statistics that clearly show that European trains are as safe or even safer then American trains.

But let's get back to big locomotives again.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 11:20 PM   #76
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But let's get back to big locomotives again.
Yeah that's probably best.


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Old August 15th, 2009, 12:14 AM   #77
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Alright yes, my fault, let's return to big locomotives.


This new Russian loco is one of my favorite, I love the red color.

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Old August 15th, 2009, 06:42 PM   #78
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Some Italian train:

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Old August 15th, 2009, 08:35 PM   #79
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Some Italian train:

Lol, it looks like a pill bug.
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Old August 15th, 2009, 08:55 PM   #80
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It looks awesome! ))
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