Indianapolis Development News

[hoosier]

It's bullshit how some people love to ridicule and criticize high speed rail as an expensive boondoggle yet are nowhere to be found when ROAD projects end up costing a fortune, especially one as unnecessary as the I-69 extension.

[hoosier]

Originally Posted by Indy Rock

http://www.ibj.com/html/detail_page_...?content=43945

That is why Indy won't see another office tower for quite some time.

I wouldn't mind seeing those buildings re-converted into residential units- that market is thriving in DT Indy. The residential vacancy rate is pretty small, less than 5%.

[BosartBrown]

Originally Posted by arenn

I think Lilly is a very well managed company and I don't begrudge them making the decisions they feel are best. And the industry changed, not just Lilly But the way they've gone about it, silent and under the covers so to speak, is a huge opportunity lost for the city.

Lilly will be in a world of trouble if they don't get new revenue coming in from new innovative drugs within the next 5 years. I hope their expansion in NYC and San Diego is about expanding and diversifying their talent pool to develop these drugs rather than completely moving their operations out of Indy. If they moved it would be 1 tough kick to the gut for this city. Another sizable risk is a buy out. Lilly is a big drug company but there are definitely some bigger ones that would buy them out for the right price.

[CorrND]

Originally Posted by hoosier

I'm in. Where is the meetup point?

I'm thinking Washington and Pennsylvania. Maybe the Cornerstone Coffee Shop, just have to verify whether they're open on Saturday. Otherwise we'll do bring your own coffee and meet at the point in front of Fogo de Chao.

[Indy Rock]

I'll be back to college that weekend. I would've loved to go though!

[AmericanDirt]

Sorry to dredge up administrative details that have long been settled, but I was trying to find details on your gathering this coming weekend on the SkyscraperCity archive, but didn't have much luck. I live in the city intermittently and would love to participate in this. I know that I'm not (yet) a regular blog contributor, but I am interested in other people's perspectives and if there is an opening I will do my best to attend. I might get called out of town for work before this Saturday, but if not, I should be able to make it there. If someone could PM me with details (time, or even a URL to the portion of this thread where the plans were discussed heavily), I'd really appreciate it.

[CorrND]

Originally Posted by AmericanDirt

Sorry to dredge up administrative details that have long been settled, but I was trying to find details on your gathering this coming weekend on the SkyscraperCity archive, but didn't have much luck. I live in the city intermittently and would love to participate in this. I know that I'm not (yet) a regular blog contributor, but I am interested in other people's perspectives and if there is an opening I will do my best to attend. I might get called out of town for work before this Saturday, but if not, I should be able to make it there. If someone could PM me with details (time, or even a URL to the portion of this thread where the plans were discussed heavily), I'd really appreciate it.

I'll just reply publicly since I want to reiterate to everybody that this is open to ANYONE that wants to attend.

You don't need to be an expert, and even though this is being organized through SSC, you don't even need to be an SSC poster. Anybody with an interest in development, architecture, construction, etc. is more than welcome to join us. Despite the number of times I've posted here, I'm 100% amateur, so don't feel intimidated.

Here's the relevant info (Dunkin Donuts is the meetup spot now, since I know they'll be open):

Skyscraper City Indy Meetup and Tour

Saturday, August 22nd at 9am
Meet at the outdoor tables at the downtown Dunkin' Donuts (NW Corner of Washington and Pennsylvania)

[Indy Rock]

Don't they have people checking up on these things?

Damage to monument worse than first thought
Tue. August 18 - 2009
Associated Press

Officials say water damage caused by leaks atop the Soldiers and Sailors Monument in downtown Indianapolis are more extensive than originally thought.

The discovery means repairs to the interior of the city landmark will take longer than expected and delay by about a month the start of exterior renovations.

That exterior work had been set to start Friday and be completed by Sept. 25.

But Brig. Gen. J. Stewart Goodwin of Indiana War Memorials said that work is now expected to begin Sept. 20 and be finished by Oct. 20.

Water entered the monument through its observation deck and its "Liberty" statue, causing part of the internal support system to deteriorate. The monument sits at the center of downtown Indianapolis' Monument Circle.

[Mr Peanut]

Originally Posted by Indy Rock

Don't they have people checking up on these things?

Hey, the monument's still standing, isn't it? That's good enough for government work.

Seriously, I'm just glad they're doing this project now instead of waiting until the monument is on the brink of collapse.

[cdc guy]

Originally Posted by idyllic indy

Hmmm... I walked around there recently, and call me crazy, but... I like the Walgreen's better. It wastes less land (has about a dozen less parking spaces) and doesn't appear to be something it's not (they're both one-story, single-use convenience store/pharmacies). The brick on the Walgreen's building looks more attractive to me. Also, the entrance is closer to the sidewalk. Plopping the building on the corner, with service areas backing up to the corner, does nothing for me if you have to walk around the building to get inside. It's actually less convenient for someone walking from 16th Street or farther north.

Walgreens and CVS have exactly the same number of parking spaces: 78 each. (Check an aerial.) Walgreens' lot is divided, with a little more than half their spaces right on the corner of 16th & Meridian and the rest just west of the building behind the adjacent apartments. The CVS lot looks bigger because (1) it's continuous, and (2) connected to an alley which was repaved as a commitment in their zoning case. Parking lot screening exists at CVS. There is none at Walgreen's. CVS handicapped parking is better-located in relation to the front door than Walgreens. CVS makes good use of the alley for access and circulation. Walgreens has more paved surface on its site dedicated to circulation than CVS.

The CVS front door is about 50-60 feet from the Meridian ROW with a direct sidewalk connection; Walgreens' is about 15 feet with access via funky stepping-stone arrangement or handicapped ramp. From north of CVS, a pedestrian does not have to cross a busy driveway apron to get to and from the front door as at Walgreen's. Having walked to each from the north, it's pretty much a wash.

From the east to CVS, there is a "back way" around the building for Herron-Morton and Old Northside pedestrians: a sidewalk along the alley with a crosswalk over the drive-through lane, which is far less busy than the driveway aprons. In the mirror image, access to Walgreens from the west is across a driveway apron and over the parking lot.

Overall pedestrian access to CVS is better and safer.

The Walgreens brick is "jumbo" brick. Some would say that is more suburban than urban in nature, and I'd agree. However, that's a style issue.

There is a real second story over about one-quarter to one-third of the CVS (starts at the 16th Street side), so it's not a "fake" two-story.

CVS created a tree lawn between sidewalk and curb on the 16th Street side. At Walgreens the 16th St. sidewalk is right next to the curb.

Walgreens has the big "W" box sign right up at 16th & Meridian. The CVS monument sign is much smaller and integrated with the wall-planter that screens the parking lot.

I'll grant you personal preference for Walgreens; that's not arguable. But in substantive, measurable site features defined by the Regional Center Design Guidelines, CVS is better than Walgreens (and not just by a little).

We can continue the debate on Saturday's walkabout, as we dodge utility poles in the sidewalk.

[socrates#1fan]

Originally Posted by Mr Peanut

Hey, the monument's still standing, isn't it? That's good enough for government work.

Seriously, I'm just glad they're doing this project now instead of waiting until the monument is on the brink of collapse.

Correction-
That's good enough for Indianapolis.
Same here, I'm glad it isn't being put off.

BTW, I think the statue is Lady Victory, not Liberty.

[idyllic indy]

Originally Posted by cdc guy

Walgreens and CVS have exactly the same number of parking spaces: 78 each. (Check an aerial.) Walgreens' lot is divided, with a little more than half their spaces right on the corner of 16th & Meridian and the rest just west of the building behind the adjacent apartments. The CVS lot looks bigger because (1) it's continuous, and (2) connected to an alley which was repaved as a commitment in their zoning case. Parking lot screening exists at CVS. There is none at Walgreen's. CVS handicapped parking is better-located in relation to the front door than Walgreens. CVS makes good use of the alley for access and circulation. Walgreens has more paved surface on its site dedicated to circulation than CVS.

The CVS front door is about 50-60 feet from the Meridian ROW with a direct sidewalk connection; Walgreens' is about 15 feet with access via funky stepping-stone arrangement or handicapped ramp. From north of CVS, a pedestrian does not have to cross a busy driveway apron to get to and from the front door as at Walgreen's. Having walked to each from the north, it's pretty much a wash.

From the east to CVS, there is a "back way" around the building for Herron-Morton and Old Northside pedestrians: a sidewalk along the alley with a crosswalk over the drive-through lane, which is far less busy than the driveway aprons. In the mirror image, access to Walgreens from the west is across a driveway apron and over the parking lot.

Overall pedestrian access to CVS is better and safer.

The Walgreens brick is "jumbo" brick. Some would say that is more suburban than urban in nature, and I'd agree. However, that's a style issue.

There is a real second story over about one-quarter to one-third of the CVS (starts at the 16th Street side), so it's not a "fake" two-story.

CVS created a tree lawn between sidewalk and curb on the 16th Street side. At Walgreens the 16th St. sidewalk is right next to the curb.

Walgreens has the big "W" box sign right up at 16th & Meridian. The CVS monument sign is much smaller and integrated with the wall-planter that screens the parking lot.

I'll grant you personal preference for Walgreens; that's not arguable. But in substantive, measurable site features defined by the Regional Center Design Guidelines, CVS is better than Walgreens (and not just by a little).

We can continue the debate on Saturday's walkabout, as we dodge utility poles in the sidewalk.

I don't know. Still looks like 64 parking spaces at Walgreen's to me. (Maybe you should check an aerial.)

I'll grant you that CVS did a better job with their 16th Street sidewalk, hands down. The big question for me is why couldn't they have done the same along Meridian. Instead of shifting or widening the sidewalk up flush with the building, they install a landscape strip that further delineates the fraud that is the supposedly urban design achieved by constructing the building at the corner.

The Walgreen's sign is awful. In fact, it's larger than what was permitted by the North Meridian Corridor portion of the zoning ordinance at the time the site was developed. Go figure how that was approved.

CVS did do a decent job with the walkway from 16th & Scioto, but really, who should have to walk along an alley, past a dumpster, and across a drive-through lane to enter a building that's built on the corner? And, of course, we arrive back at the heart of the problem with CVS, that they backed the rear of a building up to the intersection of two arterial streets, one of them being the grandest of all the city has to offer.

Regional Center Design Guidelines? I'm pretty sure any objective reading of the said guidelines would not allow for approval of building without a front door, i.e., one that faces a street. Any street.

Sorry that I won't be able to meet up on Saturday to continue the discussion. Darn work!

By the way, what's with the fence in front of the old car lot south of Walgreen's? What a travesty! It's covered in weeds and blocking a good share of the sidewalk to where a wheelchair could clearly not pass between the parking meters and the fence supports.

[cwilson758]

Originally Posted by CorrND

I finally had a chance to sit down and really look at a route. I'm thinking about 4 main locations:

1. SE downtown: Allen Plaza, new restaurant nexus (Penn/Wash), Bank One operations site, Maxwell, 3Mass

2. IUPUI: Campus Center, Simon Cancer Center, Research III, Riley Hospital Simon Tower.

3. Canal: Fairbanks Hall, Cosmo, Cultural Trail North Corridor

4. SW downtown: JW Marriott, Convention Center

I'm thinking that we'll take the Red Line from 1 to 2, the People Mover from 2 to 3, walk down the canal for 3 to 4, then walk through downtown back to the start. I estimate around 2.5-3 miles of total walking, depending on exactly what route we take.

Any suggestions or comments?

Reminder to all interested in attending (doesn't matter if you voted on times): we'll be meeting at 9am on Saturday, August 22nd.

I may try to attend. This year I became single for the first time in 7 years, so I tend to go out on Friday's now, so well see how the head is feeling

[Harpua]

Originally Posted by idyllic indy

I don't know. Still looks like 64 parking spaces at Walgreen's to me. (Maybe you should check an aerial.)

I'll grant you that CVS did a better job with their 16th Street sidewalk, hands down. The big question for me is why couldn't they have done the same along Meridian. Instead of shifting or widening the sidewalk up flush with the building, they install a landscape strip that further delineates the fraud that is the supposedly urban design achieved by constructing the building at the corner.

The Walgreen's sign is awful. In fact, it's larger than what was permitted by the North Meridian Corridor portion of the zoning ordinance at the time the site was developed. Go figure how that was approved.

CVS did do a decent job with the walkway from 16th & Scioto, but really, who should have to walk along an alley, past a dumpster, and across a drive-through lane to enter a building that's built on the corner? And, of course, we arrive back at the heart of the problem with CVS, that they backed the rear of a building up to the intersection of two arterial streets, one of them being the grandest of all the city has to offer.

Regional Center Design Guidelines? I'm pretty sure any objective reading of the said guidelines would not allow for approval of building without a front door, i.e., one that faces a street. Any street.

Sorry that I won't be able to meet up on Saturday to continue the discussion. Darn work!

By the way, what's with the fence in front of the old car lot south of Walgreen's? What a travesty! It's covered in weeds and blocking a good share of the sidewalk to where a wheelchair could clearly not pass between the parking meters and the fence supports.

I was on staff when that CVS came through. Don't think for a second that we didn't fight like crazy for a pedestrian entrance at the corner. Everything just kept coming down to "security concerns" and the BZA or MDC or whatever bought it... hook, line, and sinker.

[mobyhead]

Originally Posted by Indy Rock

I'll be back to college that weekend. I would've loved to go though!

Second year in a row I have missed it. It turns out my wife and I are looking at houses Saturday. You guys have fun. Should be nice weather too.

[cailes]

Since Im a flickr junkie, I randomly search for Indianapolis related photos and I found this set pretty interesting.

I call this:
What people take pictures of, when they visit our city.

Looks like he is from Dallas
http://www.flickr.com/photos/scutter...7621891592705/

Enjoy

[CorrND]

Here's a google map of routes and locations for Saturday's tour:

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en...38581&t=h&z=15

We don't have to stick to this exactly, but it'll be a good jumping off point. The route as mapped is 3.1 miles of walking, plus Red Line (remember to bring $1.75 for the bus) and People Mover trips.

Skyscraper City Indy Meetup and Tour

Saturday, August 22nd at 9am
Meet at the outdoor tables at the downtown Dunkin' Donuts (NW Corner of Washington and Pennsylvania)

[cdc guy]

Originally Posted by idyllic indy

Regional Center Design Guidelines? I'm pretty sure any objective reading of the said guidelines would not allow for approval of building without a front door, i.e., one that faces a street. Any street.

The intention of the guidelines (as I have understood their evolution) is not to be prescriptive, as in "said guidelines would not allow..."

What I've been saying boils down to this: CVS does a whole lot better with the spirit and intention of the guidelines than Walgreens.

I concede your front door argument, but ask you this: is your front door right on the sidewalk/ROW line? My office is in the RC area, but the door itself does not face the street. It has a direct walkway, but handicapped access from the public way is very roundabout.

[cdc guy]

Originally Posted by CorrND

Here's a google map of routes and locations for Saturday's tour:

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en...38581&t=h&z=15

We don't have to stick to this exactly, but it'll be a good jumping off point. The route as mapped is 3.1 miles of walking, plus Red Line (remember to bring $1.75 for the bus) and People Mover trips.

Skyscraper City Indy Meetup and Tour

Saturday, August 22nd at 9am
Meet at the outdoor tables at the downtown Dunkin' Donuts (NW Corner of Washington and Pennsylvania)

Cool. Thanks for doing the planning. I'm looking forward to it.

[idyllic indy]

Originally Posted by Harpua

I was on staff when that CVS came through. Don't think for a second that we didn't fight like crazy for a pedestrian entrance at the corner. Everything just kept coming down to "security concerns" and the BZA or MDC or whatever bought it... hook, line, and sinker.

Hmmm? I recall watching the BZA hearing for this proposal, but I don't remember the planning staff championing an entrance on the corner. Did I miss that part?