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Old October 16th, 2014, 10:22 PM   #341
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Did you notice that on that map, there are 2 errors?

Look at the B1 stretch.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 12:33 AM   #342
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What kind of errors are you talking about?
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Old October 17th, 2014, 10:25 AM   #343
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Of the two Libia and S.Agnese/Annibaliano dots. They should be like Bologna, because the two platforms are one on top of the other, but they are as if they were one in front of the other.
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Old October 20th, 2014, 07:32 PM   #344
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This time's Jonio pictures are due to TomRoma!

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...ostcount=11730

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Originally Posted by TomRoma View Post
Agiornamento Jonio foto di ieri:
hanno iniziato a montare la facciata anche lato jonio


questo invece lo stato lato via scarpanto


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Old October 20th, 2014, 09:27 PM   #345
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Are there any Tramexternsoins in the future planned?
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Old October 20th, 2014, 09:41 PM   #346
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Yes.

7 new tram lines are planned to be set up before 2018.
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Old October 20th, 2014, 09:44 PM   #347
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Old October 21st, 2014, 01:30 AM   #348
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Most of them were already planned in the 1990s

http://www.tramroma.com/att_roma/proclami/prom_1997.htm
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Old October 22nd, 2014, 07:48 AM   #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by friedrichstrasse View Post
Most of them were already planned in the 1990s http://www.tramroma.com/att_roma/proclami/prom_1997.htm
Well, you know, history of Rome must be counted in millennia rather than decades...
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Old October 22nd, 2014, 07:06 PM   #350
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Is Roma still building the second trolley-bus line, the route 60?
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Old October 22nd, 2014, 07:21 PM   #351
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The second trolleybus line will be along Via Laurentina. The works are almost finished. Soon will begin the works for build the bridge for complete the installation of the trolley wires. Next year should open to the public



The right blue track is the trolleybus track under construction, the red one the further extension

At the moment the line 60 is an express bus line along Via Nomentana

Last edited by XIX; October 22nd, 2014 at 07:28 PM.
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Old October 23rd, 2014, 11:10 AM   #352
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New pictures from the building site of Jonio!







And this last (big) picture should be the final photo-collage with the whole top view of the station.




From http://www.metroxroma.it/2014/10/lin...-e-marzo-2015/
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Old November 1st, 2014, 07:59 PM   #353
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When will they open the first section of metro line C? It's hard to understand the Italian newswebsites. "Within a few days"? I'm in Rome until monday and it would be great to ride the line as on of the first passengers ever.

Is my expectation right that the Rome-Giardinetti railway/tramway will be closed after the opening of the C-metro? Today i saw there is a frequent busline (105) along the full tramway with modern articuled buses and that the track of the tramway and the rolling stock is in a poor, very outdated condition. Today around 2/3 of the people used the bus and only a few boarded the tram.
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Old November 2nd, 2014, 06:30 PM   #354
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The probable D-Day is the 9th of November.
It was supposed to open on 11th October but they epic failed. So they are kinda worried not to be able to open again and for this reason they are not so keen to advertise too much the official inauguration day...
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Old November 2nd, 2014, 08:10 PM   #355
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What was the reason for failing to open on October 11th? Or was that kept confidential?
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Old November 2nd, 2014, 08:23 PM   #356
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No, it's open and public.

MIT (department of transportation) didn't receive some papers and didn't run some tests on elevators and lifts.
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Old November 3rd, 2014, 07:51 PM   #357
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It was interesting to visit your city and the ATAC once again. Last time was in 2007. I didn't have the idea that since then, a lot has been changed.

As an outsider, the following things sticked out for me. I'm interested if you can follow my opinions:
- all public transport is very dirty. I got the idea that every vehicle is sweeped regularly but that's all. Why not soaping it? Everything is gray because it's dirty.
- some metros have graffiti. I know it's because the depots are not fenced 100%. But why not change that?
- Lot of staff is doing nothing. At some of the touristic stations like Colosseo, station staff only take pictures of themselves, making telephone calls and are not helping tourists.
- I got the idea that the working hours are very short. After driving a tram for 2 hours, the staff has a break already. Why changing at Maggiore? It costs another 2 minutes extra journey time
- There is a lot of spare time at terminal stations. Why does a tram have to wait 10 minutes on a terminal station? With same amount of trams and personell, you can get an higher frequency.
- Why is there still no good english translation of the Atac-website? On mobiles phones, the website isn't working at all.
- Signage is poor. No timetables at busstops or tramstops. LED-signs inside trams are broken all the time.
- Why is there a 105-busline running alongside the Giardinatti-railway? Shut down the Giardinatti-railway or use it a peak hours only.

- I look at current scheduls. Tramway 2 take 40 minutes for a return trip. Interval every 6 minutes. Needs 9 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 3, imagining that it wuld run the entire route between Thorwaldsen and Trastevere, needs 2u30 for a return trip. With 7 departures every hour, it needs 25 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 5 95 minutes, 10 departures every hour, 11 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 8 75 minutes, 14 departures every hour, 21 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 14 90 minutes, 9 departures every hour, 15 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 19 140 minutes, 6 departures every hour, 18 trams at maximum.

Let's sum up 9+25+11+21+15+18=99 trams. However there are around 150 trams. Why so many? Increase frequency (it's defenitely neccessary) or decrease the amount of spare trams.

- there is still very ancient rolling stock. As a tram enthusiast, i like the 1926 en 1945-stock. However, for a normal passenger its quit idiot that they still have to board such kinds of stock nowadays.
- traffic light management is poor. Is there actually any kind of system at all? Why does the tram have to wait at every intersection? Has ATAC ever heard of traffic light management? I've the idea that the journey time of every tramway could be cut in half with proper traffic light management.
- There are a lot of fare evadors/dodgers. Tramdrivers and busdrivers don't give a f*ck if you stamp your ticket. I understand a lot of people have season tickets, but not all of them. Metro and Lido-gatebarriers are easy to evade. You can enter with several persons at the same time. I haven't seen ony ticket inspector at all.

- Why do people have to change from Lido to Metro B and back all the time? It is the same stock, same voltage, both routes running alongside each other partly. I cannot imagine that all capacity is neccessary on the EUR Magliani - Laurentina part of metro B. Run direct trains Ostia-Rebibia, Piramide-Rebibia and Laurentina-Conca d'ore. Less trains, same capacity, more convenience for passengers, more efficiency.

Rome is a very interesting and beautiful city, but with a strange ATAC.
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Old November 3rd, 2014, 08:45 PM   #358
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A not so good, but acceptable cabride of the Giardinetti railway from yesterday. Second half is better. First half an other driver didn't allow me to film.
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Old November 4th, 2014, 09:24 AM   #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- There is a lot of spare time at terminal stations. Why does a tram have to wait 10 minutes on a terminal station? With same amount of trams and personell, you can get an higher frequency.
For more than a single reason. First of all, according to the law, every two hours of driving , drivers have to wait a little bit. Secondly, ATAC plans a line with a precise frequency, and drivers have to follow the timetables.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- Why is there still no good english translation of the Atac-website? On mobiles phones, the website isn't working at all.
True, I'm afraid. The website for mobile however is http://muovi.roma.it and not http://www.atac.roma.it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- Signage is poor. No timetables at busstops or tramstops. LED-signs inside trams are broken all the time.
LED-signs inside trams never worked. TBH, they never work on buses too, except for the brand-new Irisbus Citelis (the ones in dark red). I don't understand why they don'tactivate them. Real bad.

Timetables are not enforced here. Not at stops along the way, in fact. Drivers have it, but they can't really follow it, because of traffic or other problems on route.
Only nightbuses, and "esatta" lines (some line that run every hour or more) have timetables at stops.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- Why is there a 105-busline running alongside the Giardinatti-railway? Shut down the Giardinatti-railway or use it a peak hours only.
That part of the city is way overcrowded. All the 105 line, 511, 451 and Roma-Giardinetti cannot satisfy the demand. When Metro C will reach Lodi 105 will be heavily reduced.
Moreover, a trip from Giardinetti to Termini takes a lot less with the train that with 105.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- I look at current scheduls. Tramway 2 take 40 minutes for a return trip. Interval every 6 minutes. Needs 9 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 3, imagining that it wuld run the entire route between Thorwaldsen and Trastevere, needs 2u30 for a return trip. With 7 departures every hour, it needs 25 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 5 95 minutes, 10 departures every hour, 11 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 8 75 minutes, 14 departures every hour, 21 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 14 90 minutes, 9 departures every hour, 15 trams at maximum.
- Tramway 19 140 minutes, 6 departures every hour, 18 trams at maximum.

Let's sum up 9+25+11+21+15+18=99 trams. However there are around 150 trams. Why so many? Increase frequency (it's defenitely neccessary) or decrease the amount of spare trams.
The problem is that not all trams can go on each route. The new green ones cannot run 5, 14 or 19 lines, even if there is a lot of demand there (power supply problems on Via Prenestina). Old rolling stock, STANGA and SOCIMI, cannot run 8 and 2 lines, because they aren't bi-directional.
They are slowly upgrading the power grid on Via Prenestina so that Cityway rolling stock may run on 5, 14 and 19 lines. Those 3 are really busy lines, much more people than they can carry try to board on them exspecially at peak hours. They definately need to increase their frequency.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- there is still very ancient rolling stock. As a tram enthusiast, i like the 1926 en 1945-stock. However, for a normal passenger its quit idiot that they still have to board such kinds of stock nowadays.
Actually, for what I said just before, we need that old stock for tram lines. For the Roma - Giardinetti line, there is a plan to demolish it all and build a modern tramway instead. I don't see the need to change the stock now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- traffic light management is poor. Is there actually any kind of system at all? Why does the tram have to wait at every intersection? Has ATAC ever heard of traffic light management? I've the idea that the journey time of every tramway could be cut in half with proper traffic light management.
I'm crying for this. No, it seems that ATAC doesn't know it. Many tram lines or fast express bus lines (for example on Via Nomentana, where trolleybus 90 runs) may be easily fastened just by using the traffic light management.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- There are a lot of fare evadors/dodgers. Tramdrivers and busdrivers don't give a f*ck if you stamp your ticket. I understand a lot of people have season tickets, but not all of them. Metro and Lido-gatebarriers are easy to evade. You can enter with several persons at the same time. I haven't seen ony ticket inspector at all.
True. We have 90 inspectors on all the lines. There are plans to increase them to 350 in some months.
Ticket dodging rate is incredibily high: around 15% in metro and (according to me) more than 50% on buses and trams.
This is a really big problem. Many people just say "Public transport sucks, I don't pay it!" and in this way it can only become worse.

The plan is to "upgrade" the driver to inspector, and to allow people to board only from the front door showing the ticket to the driver. This will firstly enforced only on some lines with low frequentation and only at first station, and slowly increased on stops along the way and enlarged to other lines.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busfotodotnl View Post
- Why do people have to change from Lido to Metro B and back all the time? It is the same stock, same voltage, both routes running alongside each other partly. I cannot imagine that all capacity is neccessary on the EUR Magliani - Laurentina part of metro B. Run direct trains Ostia-Rebibia, Piramide-Rebibia and Laurentina-Conca d'ore. Less trains, same capacity, more convenience for passengers, more efficiency.
This is something that we, on SSC, more than once thought. Roma Lido and Metro B are different:

- Overhead wires are higher on Roma Lido line. Rolling stock have a box on top of them to make the pantograph higher.


- Platform are shorter on Roma - Lido line. Trains have a bar to enlarge them and to eliminate the gap between the train and the platform.
[IMG]http://i59.************/jicrwp.jpg[/IMG]

- Signals are different: on Metro B line they are replicated inside the train cab, on Roma Lido they aren't. Also the signalling system is different.

BTW, I really think that Roma-Lido should be upgraded to Metro B standards, because it needs much more frequency that today (7' on peak hours, 15' elsewhere). But to do that, they need to change the signalling system, that doesn't allow a frequency less than 7' (2'30" on B line).
Moreover, Roma Lido has a problem with power supply too: to increase the trains running they need to upgrade the electrical substations (is that a proper english name for "sottostazione elettrica"? I don't know, Google says that ) to allow more trains in the line, and same goes for B line.
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Old November 4th, 2014, 10:00 AM   #360
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Also Roma Lido's Train are a little bit higher. If I remember correctly new CAF S/300 train have some sort of ring on the bogie to increase the height.
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