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Old July 10th, 2010, 04:48 PM   #521
PrevaricationComplex
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theres alot of myths here regarding the mcs and how suitable it could be, weather it could or needs to be 'rectangularised'. if anyone can show me scale drawings of the mcg with a football pitch, and how to upload images from my pc rather than link a webpage it could be cleared up quite easily. thanks in advance.
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Old July 10th, 2010, 05:08 PM   #522
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more myths that can be cleared up;

financial rewards per host nation, in relation to both FIFA and host nation.

the importance of geographic spread, HOW this is done. more importantly WHY its done and its important to FIFA ($ obviously). its been stated eleswhere that they want the most people possible within an 1hrs drive from stadia. does anyone have a source to prove this? because i cant find one.
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Old July 10th, 2010, 05:13 PM   #523
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Just some (only 5) photo's of the Adelaide Oval as it is now. Taken at tonight's Canterbury Bulldogs vs Melbourne Storm game in front of 10,350 people (including a surprising amount of Melbourne fans.....). These shots show how the old Sir Edwin Smith Stand and the members area now looks while under re-construction. The photos show in an oval configuration just how far from the fence that the sideline and dead ball line is (for those who aren't familiar with the Adelaide Oval, the last photo show's the current Sir Donald Bradman Stand at the southern or City End of the ground).









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Old July 10th, 2010, 05:41 PM   #524
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thanks for the photos holden, good insight. however it is just a numbers game.

http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/tour...ts_en_8211.pdf

page 19/125 is most relevant re ovals. theres diagrammes too.

the guidelines want as many people as possible within a 90m radius of the centre spot. but more importantly none beyond 190m of furthest corner of the pitch. so on a diagramme, a quarter radial of 190m is drawn from each 'far' corner facing inwards, and the intersection from that is where a minimum of 80000 people need to be. theres a comparison on the pdf of the olympiastadion and the san siro. the san siro had most of the spectators within the 90m radium, olympiastadion had very few.



olympia stadion they tolerate. san siro they expect.

Quote:
"Pressure is often put on stadium developers to increase the field size or to include a running track. Occasionally, such requirements are unavoidable. Unfortunately, this will result in a much less successful facility than a football stadium that is specifically built around the football field’s dimensions.
Various attempts to provide a running track without destroying the stadium’s football ambience have been proposed and built, including retractable seating along the sidelines, an example of which can be found in the Stade de France in Paris. Most are very expensive to build and operate and/or have resulted in compromised sight-lines for one or both sports, even when the rake or angle of the seating has been made as steep as possible."


"Perhaps the largest cities of the world, with very large budgets and the objective of hosting the Olympic Games one day, might be capable of satisfying the needs of football and athletics. For most, however, surrounding a football field with a running track in a modern stadium should be avoided."
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Old July 10th, 2010, 08:44 PM   #525
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are people sure its 80,000?

i can find no statements to this effect. 60,000 is the only number mentioned with any tangible relation to minimum cap.

also 40,000 is only a recommendation when taking a long term view of an investment. they leave the door open to accept 30,000 +

what they seem concerned about most as a revenue stream anyway, is the vip/corporate hospitality. and how best to manage this. seems obvious enough since this where the real money is made (from stadia that is).

it seems more than likely that we've got our understanding of what capacities FIFA will accept wrong to some degree.

btw if any of you have a few hours to kill that a decent elmore leonard tome cant satisfy, i suggest having a browse through FIFA finacial records, the ones they chose to publish anyway.

$100+m U.S spent on 'other expenses'. the audacity
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Old July 23rd, 2010, 06:49 AM   #526
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FIFA have closed the file on their investigation into the Australian bid. Colour me shocked

http://sportal.com.au/football-news-...ffas-bid-95385
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Old September 14th, 2010, 11:35 AM   #527
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]
Melbourne - Sporting Capital of the World
Stolen from Dime

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Melbourne is a notable sporting location as the host city for the 1956 Summer Olympics games, the first Olympic Games ever held in Australia and the southern hemisphere, along with the 2006 Commonwealth Games. In recent years, the city has claimed the SportsBusiness title "World's Ultimate Sports City". Melbourne has also been dubbed the "Sporting Capital of the World". The city is home to the National Sports Museum, which until 2003 was located outside the members pavilion at the Melbourne Cricket Ground and reopened in 2008 in the Olympic Stand.

Australian rules football and cricket are the most popular sports in Melbourne and also the spiritual home of these two sports in Australia and both are mostly played in the same stadia in the city and its suburbs. The first ever official cricket Test match was played at the Melbourne Cricket Ground in March 1877 and the Melbourne Cricket Ground is the largest cricket ground in the world. The first Australian rules football matches were played in Melbourne in 1859 and the Australian Football League is headquartered at Docklands Stadium. Nine of its teams are based in the Melbourne metropolitan area and the five Melbourne AFL matches per week attract an average 40,000 people per game. Additionally, the city annually hosts the AFL Grand Final.

The city is also home to several professional franchises in national competitions including the Melbourne Storm (rugby league), who play in the NRL competition, Melbourne Victory (football/soccer) and also Melbourne Heart who play in the A-league, netball team Melbourne Vixens who play in the trans-Tasman trophy ANZ Championship. The Melbourne Tigers are Melbournes only team in the National Basketball League although there is talk of a second Melbourne team for the 2011/2012 season. The new rugby union Super 15 license was given to Melbourne to start a team at the beginning of the 2011 Super 15 season, the team most likely to represent Melbourne are the Melbourne Rebels.

Melbourne is home to the three major annual international sporting events in the Australian Open (tennis), Melbourne Cup (horse racing), and the Australian Grand Prix (Formula One). It was announced in November 2008 that the AOC that the city was considering potential bids for either the 2024 or 2028 Summer Olympics.
The MCG (Melbourne Cricket Ground) - 100,000
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/melbsbo...68145/sizes/l/
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/ppym1/343733118/sizes/l/

Etihad Stadium - 56,347
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/ecvpict...80729/sizes/l/
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/pics-or...41339/sizes/l/

Melbourne Rectangular Stadium - 31,500
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/5cheher...18957/sizes/l/
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rhondda...89709/sizes/l/

Rod Laver Arena - 16,820

image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/alec_be...82568/sizes/l/

Flemington Racecourse - 130,000
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/2183141...26190/sizes/o/

wiki

Melbourne Sports and Aquatic Centre - 4,000~9,000
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/royskea...01420/sizes/l/
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/justinr/430718673/sizes/l/

Albert Park
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/mdneale/307597364/sizes/l/
image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/djc5000...81875/sizes/l/

Note: List does not include all arenas and stadiums. There is many more in Melbourne.
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Old September 14th, 2010, 12:07 PM   #528
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What sort of light rail/train or other public transport infrastructure is there or at least plans in the works for each of the stadiums?
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Old September 14th, 2010, 12:55 PM   #529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slipperydog View Post
What sort of light rail/train or other public transport infrastructure is there or at least plans in the works for each of the stadiums?
Trams and trains for each venue. You have Jolimont and Richmond for all but Etihad and Albert Park and Etihad is serviced by many tram routes and Southern Cross station. No more needed. *This is Melbourne only
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Last edited by Will737; September 14th, 2010 at 02:47 PM.
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Old September 14th, 2010, 01:10 PM   #530
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slipperydog View Post
What sort of light rail/train or other public transport infrastructure is there or at least plans in the works for each of the stadiums?
My city is building a 25,000 seat (expandable to 40,000) stadium. It's also spending money getting light rail through the city (and by 2022, probably will be out to the train stations near the stadium). As well as that, the heavy rail line will most likely be extended further - hopefully to the Airport.

Not sure about other cities.
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Old September 14th, 2010, 03:32 PM   #531
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Sydney's main stadium (Stadium Australia) is in the olympic precinct with its own train station, ferry terminal as well as plenty of bus connections and parking.

The second (Sydney Football Stadium) is closest to Sydney central station for a 20min walk or short shuttle bus ride. Its pretty close to the city too so theres plenty of busses.

The proposed blacktown stadium (which I'm not sure would go ahead) is sort of in the middle of nowhere/western sydney, but theres a motorway straight to the city for busses. Also about 20min walk from a train station - average trip would be about an hour and a half from the city. So not in good shape currently - but theres no reason for people to get there yet, its just a paddock.
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Old September 14th, 2010, 03:47 PM   #532
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for sport, public transport is not an issue in Australia

nearly all the major stadium are either on tram or train lines, and most are in fairly close proximity to their respective CBD's
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Old September 14th, 2010, 03:47 PM   #533
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Adelaide is on the edge of the city,as is Melbourne,
Brisbane, Geelong
Perth are still deciding on the position of the new stadium-may be Subiaco,may be Burswood
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Old September 14th, 2010, 03:50 PM   #534
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T74 View Post
for sport, public transport is not an issue in Australia

nearly all the major stadium are either on tram or train lines, and most are in fairly close proximity to their respective CBD's
Folks had their priorities right 100 years ago as far as getting top shelf land for sport
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Old September 15th, 2010, 06:57 AM   #535
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Are there any plans to connect host cities by rail ?
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Old September 15th, 2010, 07:53 AM   #536
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qatar Son 333 View Post
Are there any plans to connect host cities by rail ?
Well Perth, Adelaide and Sydney are connected by rail via "The Indian Pacific" since 1970 but its a 65 hour trip each way. Adelaide and Melbourne have had "The Overland" since 1887. Sydney and Melbourne have had passenger rail link since 1962 and Sydney and Brisbane since 1932. There has been talk for decades about a High Speed Rail link from Brisbane to Melbourne via Sydney and Canberra. In our recent election one of the Party's (The Greens) who is in the winning coalition with the Labor Party wants the rail and it is a part of their policy for Australia (with it being payed for by a controversial mining tax). The 2 major Parties (Labor and Liberal) are both interested in High Speed Rail, like always it just comes down to the economics, Air is still far more feasible. Later this year a $20 million study will be undertaken on the most recent proposals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-sp...l_in_Australia

Like the USA, rail isn't that effective a solution for Australia because of the size of the Country. Air will be the main method of travel between cities for the international visitor.

Last edited by Walbanger; September 15th, 2010 at 08:29 AM.
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Old September 15th, 2010, 07:57 AM   #537
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^
Yes, high speed rail link

Facelift for MCG's Great Southern Stand
Quote:
Twenty years after its completion, the Great Southern Stand at the Melbourne Cricket Ground is getting a $55 million facelift.

Announcing the upgrade, Victorian Premier John Brumby said the renovation of seating, toilets, entrances and food outlets was intended to "maintain the Great Southern Stand at an absolutely first-rate level".

"The MCG is the icon, it’s the centrepiece of Australia's greatest sporting precinct and one we want to build into the greatest sporting precinct in the world," Brumby told SEN radio.

Advertisement: Story continues below
Porposed new sports bar in tthe Southern Stand. Photo: Cox Jackson architects

"I think the thing with stadiums is that you’ve got to keep investing in them, you’ve got to keep improving them.

"48% of the people who go to the G and watch footy are women, 25% are kids – you’ve got to have good facilities, quality facilities …"

Mr Brumby said the MCC considers the development 'stage one' of a "20-year rolling program to make sure that the Southern Stand is continually improved".


Architect's plans for the redevelopment of the MCG's Southern Stand.

AFL CEO Andrew Demetriou said the work, expected to begin in mid-2011, would not inconvenience patrons.

"These guys are pretty skilled at making sure there's little disruption," he said.

The work is expected to be completed by the start of the 2013 AFL season.


Click for more photos
Melbourne's 'G'
New entry to Southern Stand. Photo: Cox Jackson architects.

..The refurbishment will include upgrades to food and beverage areas, concourses and toilets, improved entry points, and updating function rooms and sports bars to provide improved viewing areas.

The government was forking out $30 million for the upgrade with the Melbourne Cricket Club contributing $25 million.

Mr Brumby admitted that he had been under pressure from AFL figures after funding the rectangular stadium now known as AAMI Park.

"There were obviously people in the footy world that thought we put a lot of money into the rectangular stadium, and we did," he said.

"And we did that because we’ve got growing interest in soccer and we’ve got growing interest in rugby and that is a magnificent stadium and we need to do that.

"But at the same time, we have provided significant funding to AFL, because its our homegrown code and we’ve got more kids playing that than any other sport.

"All of this helps to encourage young people participate in sport and play more sport, so its money well spent."

Meanwhile, State Emergency Service volunteers are being invited to Saturday's AFL preliminary final for free after their efforts to contain floodwaters across Victoria.

The AFL and the government will hand out 1000 tickets to SES volunteers in regional and metropolitan areas to see St Kilda clash with the Western Bulldogs.

Close to 80,000 spectators are expected to attend the game at the MCG
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Old September 15th, 2010, 08:32 AM   #538
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walbanger View Post
Like the USA, rail isn't that effective a solution for Australia because of the size of the Country. Air will be the main method of travel between cities for the international visitor.
I didn't really pose the rail question as a means of inter-city transportation, more so as a method of intra-city transport. For foreign visitors, especially Europeans, most are accustomed to rail for public transport to stadiums. Flights between cities during the World Cup are perfectly acceptable, you get this in almost every country outside of Europe (ex. inter-city transport in 2014 will be almost exclusively air). It is important that stadiums have rail accessibility because renting a car or taking taxis everywhere would be very difficult logistically, not to mention very expensive, for the international visitor.
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Old September 15th, 2010, 08:37 AM   #539
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^ ?
Sorry mate I was answering Qatar Son333's post, not yours.

As for Intra City rail public transport. The proposed venues for Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Perth and Adelaide already have excellent rail access. I don't have a clue about the smaller cities but pretty sure they don't have public rail networks

Last edited by Walbanger; September 15th, 2010 at 08:51 AM.
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Old September 15th, 2010, 02:24 PM   #540
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http://media.theage.com.au/sport/spo...l?from=newsbox

upgrade is happening regardless of any WC bid, and with my reserved seat in that section, I'm looking forward to the new bar in 3 years
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