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Old July 27th, 2015, 10:16 AM   #561
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My wife, her parents and I went to Uppsala yesterday. I took a quite extensive video showing Stockholm Centralstation, Uppsala Centralstation (which is really quite cool) and the journey leaving Stockholm Centralstation (until Solna station, so you get to see the new national stadium) and into Uppsala centrum (from the edge of Uppsala).
What did your in-laws think of our towns?


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I've always wondered why -- other than our hardy little toasters -- Sweden's never really sold their Rc series abroad.
Haven't thought about that. My impression is most European countries have produced their own locos and thus the export market has been small.
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Old July 27th, 2015, 11:05 AM   #562
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ASEA did export some Rc2 locomotives to Austria, where they were known as ÖBB Class 1043. In 2001, the engines were sold to Tågåkeriet i Bergslagen AB and returned to Sweden.
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Old July 27th, 2015, 11:24 AM   #563
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What did your in-laws think of our towns?
They really liked Uppsala - said it was a nice, quiet and green city. Stockholm is the city they've been least keen on so far, possibly because they were spoilt with Vienna (which was more "impressive" and with better infrastructure than Stockholm has). They don't like most of the tunnelbana (jerky and hard to stand for older people), but really like the rock stations a lot - they've taken a lot of pictures of them!

One comment they have made is that Europeans don't take any care of what they have. They're positively shocked that a nice station or building might have graffiti all over it (as we saw at Wien Mitte and at Uppsala Centralstation to name two stations) whereas this would be better respected in China by comparison.
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Old July 27th, 2015, 01:02 PM   #564
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ASEA did export some Rc2 locomotives to Austria, where they were known as ÖBB Class 1043. In 2001, the engines were sold to Tågåkeriet i Bergslagen AB and returned to Sweden.
Not only to Austria, but also to USA, Norway and Iran.
Both the EMD AEM-7 and the ALP-44 in the US are based on the RC locomotive.
In Norway they are called NSB El 16, and they have a different front to be better to cope with deep snow.
And the Iranian RAI R-C-4 is more or less identical with the original RC design.

The sum of these exports adds up to 133 units, which is about 25% of all locomotives in the RC family.
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Old July 28th, 2015, 04:43 AM   #565
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Not only to Austria, but also to USA, Norway and Iran.
Both the EMD AEM-7 and the ALP-44 in the US are based on the RC locomotive.
In Norway they are called NSB El 16, and they have a different front to be better to cope with deep snow.
And the Iranian RAI R-C-4 is more or less identical with the original RC design.

The sum of these exports adds up to 133 units, which is about 25% of all locomotives in the RC family.
The point being that -- despite the fact the Rc family has the proven track record it has -- ASEA never was able to really market it heavily in Continental Europe. 133 Rc exports, most of them outside the European market, versus how many Eurosprinters and Traxx's? Heck, those northern Swedish ore trains are being hauled with Bomby products nowadays.

ASEA has what has to be one of the most successful electric motor designs over time, ever, in their possession -- and they never did as much with it as they could have.
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Old July 28th, 2015, 08:57 AM   #566
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Originally Posted by hammersklavier View Post
-- ASEA never was able to really market it heavily in Continental Europe. 133 Rc exports, most of them outside the European market, versus how many Eurosprinters and Traxx's?
Maybe it had to to with that back then when all railways were 100% nationalized, rolling stock was provided by domestic companies in countries were they had such an industry like in Germany, France, Italy, UK.

So ASEA was mainly able to export the Rc-series to smaller countries and developing countries without their own locomotive manufacturing.

The domestic railway industry in Sweden was able to provide all the necessary rolling stock demanded by the swedish state railways until the 1980's when the Fiat made Y1 was introduced.

Last edited by NordikNerd; July 28th, 2015 at 09:09 AM.
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Old July 28th, 2015, 09:22 AM   #567
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Maybe it had to to with that back then when all railways were 100% nationalized, rolling stock was provided by domestic companies in countries were they had such an industry like in Germany, France, Italy, UK.

So ASEA was mainly able to export the Rc-series to smaller countries and developing countries without their own locomotive manufacturing.

The domestic railway industry in Sweden was able to provide all the necessary rolling stock demanded by the swedish state railways until the 1980's when the Fiat made Y1 was introduced.
I'm not really entirely buying that claim. The Eurosprinter and Traxx series are the ones that achieved the most success in the European market -- even Alstom's Prima is largely limited to France.

What I notice is that it seems like, back in the 70's and 80's, ASEA had a really aggressive marketing department and was rapidly building new export markets for itself and its main electric loco product (i.e. the Rc4), but when it merged with that Swiss company and formed ABB in the early 90s it pretty much just left the whole market.

Which is, coincidentally, when the first Eurosprinter and Traxx models were introduced. It's a shame. And it also means that (if indeed ASEA did leave the loco market with the ABB merger) when those Rc4's are replaced -- which has to be soon, even the youngest units are nearing the end of their design lives -- then they're probably gonna be replaced with more lookalike Vectrons or ... does Bombardier have a Traxx replacement?
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Old July 28th, 2015, 10:28 AM   #568
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Originally Posted by loefet View Post
Not only to Austria, but also to USA, Norway and Iran.
And Yugoslavia, if I'm not mistaken.

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Originally Posted by hammersklavier View Post
The point being that -- despite the fact the Rc family has the proven track record it has -- ASEA never was able to really market it heavily in Continental Europe. 133 Rc exports, most of them outside the European market, versus how many Eurosprinters and Traxx's? Heck, those northern Swedish ore trains are being hauled with Bomby products nowadays.
ASEA merged with ABB, which then sold of it's rolling stock activities to Adtranz, which then got absorbed by Bombardier.
There is probably a lot of Rc DNA in the Traxx's.
I visited Bombardier's "power lab" in Zürich, which is where they design and test locomotive traction components. A lot of the power conversion components are however still manufactured in Sweden. So in a way the Traxx success is a little bit a Swedisch success as well...
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Old July 28th, 2015, 10:33 AM   #569
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Originally Posted by hammersklavier View Post
they're probably gonna be replaced with more lookalike Vectrons or ... does Bombardier have a Traxx replacement?
Bombardier has the Traxx 3
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Old July 28th, 2015, 11:29 AM   #570
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And Yugoslavia, if I'm not mistaken.
That would be the RB model.
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Old August 5th, 2015, 04:51 PM   #571
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Bird on a wire





According to a swedish railway forum a dove caused damage to the catenary at Stockholm Central station today, resulting in delayed trains. The Veolia train "snälltåget" was more than 2,5 hours late, and it had still not arrived at 14.20 when I left the station.



A regional X12 train from Sala heading for Linköping.

A regional X12 train from Linköping heading for Sala.


Information display about an arriving train


There has been a debate going on lately about poor quality of the railway tracks and that the swedish railway network is in need of urgent reparations.


Squealing tracks at Stångebro.

Last edited by NordikNerd; August 9th, 2015 at 12:27 PM.
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Old August 5th, 2015, 10:47 PM   #572
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The worst railway infrastructure in developed world. On the other hand, this is what the conservative (old-school) approach towards the infrastructure development and construction in general leads to.
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Old August 6th, 2015, 02:08 AM   #573
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The worst railway infrastructure in developed world. On the other hand, this is what the conservative (old-school) approach towards the infrastructure development and construction in general leads to.
I wasn't aware the United States had stopped being part of the developed world...?
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Old August 6th, 2015, 01:58 PM   #574
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Trains at Stockholm Central:

Tracks by Times3yes, on Flickr

Stockholm Central by Times3yes, on Flickr
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Old August 6th, 2015, 02:09 PM   #575
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The worst railway infrastructure in developed world. On the other hand, this is what the conservative (old-school) approach towards the infrastructure development and construction in general leads to.
I have noticed that the railway tracks squeak even more today than they did a few years ago, it's really bad close to Linköping central station, and this is the main line Stockholm-Malmö. Not to mention the unelectrified sideline to Kalmar, where the speedlimit is 30km/h at some sections.


Snälltåget by Transdev. An odd train that consists of the Taurus-loco, old SJ 1960's passenger coaches,
a former NSB restaurant-waggon and a former DB passengerwaggon in the end.


A former DB-passenger coach (or DSB possibly ?)
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Old August 7th, 2015, 05:35 AM   #576
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That German equipment is noticeably smaller than the Swedish stock!

I wonder if anybody's ever coupled Swedish, German, and British coaches together to show how much smaller the equipment gets?
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Old August 7th, 2015, 09:14 AM   #577
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That German equipment is noticeably smaller than the Swedish stock!

I wonder if anybody's ever coupled Swedish, German, and British coaches together to show how much smaller the equipment gets?
Yes. The swedish coaches have a higher roof. This is a former DSB coach btw, not a DB, although it's very similar to the german ones. The danish passenger coaches are more adapted to fit in the international continental european trains.

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Old August 7th, 2015, 09:39 AM   #578
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I wonder if anybody's ever coupled Swedish, German, and British coaches together to show how much smaller the equipment gets?
This would be considered an obscene kind of pornography by the British.
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Old August 7th, 2015, 10:09 PM   #579
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Yes. The swedish coaches have a higher roof. This is a former DSB coach btw, not a DB, although it's very similar to the german ones. The danish passenger coaches are more adapted to fit in the international continental european trains.

It isn't just the roofline. The carbody appears narrower, enough so it's noticeable to the eye.

Also w/r/t the squealing: I usually hear that either when trains have to negotiate tight curves or on freight trains, where I suspect it means the trucks' bearings need to be re-lubed. The squealing in that video sounds like the latter kind, and I've never heard of it being attributed to the track before.
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Old August 7th, 2015, 11:36 PM   #580
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That German equipment is noticeably smaller than the Swedish stock!

I wonder if anybody's ever coupled Swedish, German, and British coaches together to show how much smaller the equipment gets?
Meanwhile on the other end of the spectrum we have a tourist train with a Soviet loco hauling mainly Polish carriages with one russian/soviet loading gauge carriage

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