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Old March 14th, 2019, 09:27 PM   #22941
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Olivilo View Post
You come from a country that doesn't use the CFA franc, and you feel you are entitled to tell people from countries who use it what they should or not should not do. That's funny. To me what you're doing is a form of meddling in other people's national affairs, exactly what you're reproaching France.

Well I also met a number from Ghana who think they are British, who try to speak with the queen's accent, who believe that London is the best city in the world and who buy real estate there instead of investing their money in Ghana. And the Kenyans still have their currency called "shilling" like in Victorian England, and they still drive on the left side of the road like Mama England. Now who is the most colonized in their heads, tell me.
Lies. people from nigeria and ghana and liberia dont even refer to themselves as anglophone unless it's response to to CIV and the like diving the world tht way. their identity isnt tied so closely to britain. it's their nation or their ethnicity. driving on the left side of the road and using the shilling means they identify as british. that just stupid

the truth is the problem exists to the degree it does in the former french colonies by design not that ghanians are superior. this was policy towards africa from france. if ghana had been colonized by france the same problem may exist. that refuse to admit even the most obvious
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Old March 14th, 2019, 09:43 PM   #22942
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Originally Posted by Thienha10 View Post
With 30 years of +7% grownth the GDP figures should increase at least 8 times . How much is CIV gdp in 1950???
If we go back all the way to 1950, then the Ivorian economy has been multiplied by between 20 and 22 (which means in 2018 the Ivorian economy was 20 to 22 times larger than in 1950). The Ghanaian economy has been multiplied by between 12 and 13 (i.e. in 2018 the Ghanaian economy was 12 to 13 times larger than in 1950).

The population of Côte d'Ivoire was only 2.6 million in 1950 (Ghana was 5.0 million). Côte d'Ivoire attracted lots of African migrants (most of them from Burkina Faso and Mali), so that today its population is 24.9 million (Ghana 29.5 million). So Côte d'Ivoire's population has been multiplied by 9.5 while its economy was multiplied by 20 to 22. Ghana's population has been multiplied by 6 while its economy was multiplied by 12 to 13.

Côte d'Ivoire has had the 3rd fastest growing population in Africa since 1950.

Population growth between 1950 and 2018, UN figures:
1- Mayotte: multiplied by 17.2
2- Djibouti: multiplied by 15.7
3- Côte d'Ivoire: multiplied by 9.5
4- Niger: multiplied by 8.7
5- Uganda: multiplied by 8.6

#1, 2, and 3 is due to immigration, #4 and 5 is due to very high fertility rates.

The least growing African countries since 1950 in terms of population growth have been Mauritius, Seychelles, Lesotho, Cabo Verde, and Tunisia. Their populations were multiplied by between 2.6 (Mauritius) and 3.2 (Tunisia).
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Old March 14th, 2019, 11:35 PM   #22943
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Originally Posted by Olivilo View Post
If we go back all the way to 1950, then the Ivorian economy has been multiplied by between 20 and 22 (which means in 2018 the Ivorian economy was 20 to 22 times larger than in 1950). The Ghanaian economy has been multiplied by between 12 and 13 (i.e. in 2018 the Ghanaian economy was 12 to 13 times larger than in 1950).

The population of Côte d'Ivoire was only 2.6 million in 1950 (Ghana was 5.0 million). Côte d'Ivoire attracted lots of African migrants (most of them from Burkina Faso and Mali), so that today its population is 24.9 million (Ghana 29.5 million). So Côte d'Ivoire's population has been multiplied by 9.5 while its economy was multiplied by 20 to 22. Ghana's population has been multiplied by 6 while its economy was multiplied by 12 to 13.

Côte d'Ivoire has had the 3rd fastest growing population in Africa since 1950.

Population growth between 1950 and 2018, UN figures:
1- Mayotte: multiplied by 17.2
2- Djibouti: multiplied by 15.7
3- Côte d'Ivoire: multiplied by 9.5
4- Niger: multiplied by 8.7
5- Uganda: multiplied by 8.6

#1, 2, and 3 is due to immigration, #4 and 5 is due to very high fertility rates.

The least growing African countries since 1950 in terms of population growth have been Mauritius, Seychelles, Lesotho, Cabo Verde, and Tunisia. Their populations were multiplied by between 2.6 (Mauritius) and 3.2 (Tunisia).
you didnt answer his question. for purposes of this discussion why does the gdp in 1950 when it was a colony mtter anyway
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Old March 15th, 2019, 12:38 AM   #22944
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Kenya: Demand for cement drops to four-year low
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This comes at a time when analysts have projected a price correction in the housing sector after an extended period of aggressive building led to over-supply of both residential and commercial units.

Knight Frank noted that the oversupply was particularly pronounced in the high-end housing residential market which has put pressure on prices and rents.

“Prime residential prices fell by 4.5 per cent in 2018, compared to a 0.9 per cent drop in 2017, as the segment turned into a buyers’ market,” said Knight Frank in its Market Update report covering the second half of last year. The report also noted that rents in the top-end of the market dropped by 1.3 per cent during the period under review.

“Sustained demand from expatriates and middle to high-income earners, who are keen on location and quality of houses, helped reduce the decline in high-end residential rents.”
They prefer economic stagnation to catering to the poor, malls and high end villas/apartments is the only thing African countries have shown to be able of doing so far
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Old March 15th, 2019, 01:49 AM   #22945
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Olivilo View Post
And this is for Ghana in comparison:

- 1950s: between +4% and +5% per year

- 1960s: +2.26% per year

- 1970s: +1.24% per year

- 1980s: +1.87%per year

- 1990s: +4.27% per year

- 2000s: +5.36% per year

- 2010-2012: +10.38% per year

- 2013-2018: +5.01% per year



Since independence in 1960 until 2018:

- Ghana: +3.58% per year on average during those 58 years

- Côte d'Ivoire: +4.09% per year on average during those 58 years



The economy of Côte d'Ivoire was multiplied by 10.2 since independence (inflation deducted), whereas the economy of Ghana was multiplied by 7.7 (inflation deducted).


Ghana has never had strong broadbased growth and CIV’s manufacturing sector is still more developed.

Despite Nkrumah spending all our money in the 60s, look how much little our GDP grew.

If CIV had even managed to grow at 5% since the 80s it would be a solid middle income nation by now like Thailand.

One thing about CIV though, too much of the economy is in the hands of a minority- the Lebanese. This doesnt bode well for it in the medium or long term. For much of the 60s and 70s- Ivorians seemed just content with farming or civil service jobs.

Growth will always plateau when you have such a small minority running your economy
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:01 AM   #22946
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyumba View Post
Kenya: Demand for cement drops to four-year low


They prefer economic stagnation to catering to the poor, malls and high end villas/apartments is the only thing African countries have shown to be able of doing so far


Market correction in the property sector is a good thing, very few units in Kenya are bought using mortgages, so Im not that concerned about a domino effect.Most Kenyans either build their own houses or buy cash.

Nairobi and Mombasa high end housing is almost as expensive as some of the most exclusive addresses around the world and in my view that was due for a correction.

In terms of affordable housing, thousands of units have currently broken ground or in the pipeline, you can follow this thread in the Kenyan forum for more

Kenya affordable housing program

As for your sentiments about African businessmen hedging their bets heavily on real estate, cant say I disagree, but probably challenge you to look at it as an opportunity to start a business in Rwanda that fills a gap you think needs to be filled, thats how great businesses start.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:12 AM   #22947
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Originally Posted by Drillz1 View Post
Central African nation has been seeking assistance since 2017. Congo owes creditors including Glencore at least $9.14 billion



https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...bailout-sought


Ah- in debt to out Chinese friends

Popcorn....
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:17 AM   #22948
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Olivilo View Post
You come from a country that doesn't use the CFA franc, and you feel you are entitled to tell people from countries who use it what they should or not should not do. That's funny. To me what you're doing is a form of meddling in other people's national affairs, exactly what you're reproaching France.



Well I also met a number from Ghana who think they are British, who try to speak with the queen's accent, who believe that London is the best city in the world and who buy real estate there instead of investing their money in Ghana. And the Kenyans still have their currency called "shilling" like in Victorian England, and they still drive on the left side of the road like Mama England. Now who is the most colonized in their heads, tell me.


Lol. Ghanaians who think they are British? Maybe those who were BORN there as they kind of are. But a Ghanaian who grew up in Ghana...never. The rich elite in Accra and Lagos will even eat in street markets with their hands. Kenyans are more Westernised than us though I know in CIV they are having croissants and coffee for breakfast.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:26 AM   #22949
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenyan_yungin View Post
Market correction in the property sector is a good thing, very few units in Kenya are bought using mortgages, so Im not that concerned about a domino effect.Most Kenyans either build their own houses or buy cash.

Nairobi and Mombasa high end housing is almost as expensive as some of the most exclusive addresses around the world and in my view that was due for a correction.
The latecomers in the high end property market wouldn't have wasted their money if they thought about housing their poor citizens. I've read in the Kenyan forum that now many luxury condos owners are struggling to find buyers.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:30 AM   #22950
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Originally Posted by popa1980 View Post
Ah- in debt to out Chinese friends

Popcorn....
Somehow you skipped glencore. Surprise
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:35 AM   #22951
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The latecomers in the high end property market wouldn't have wasted their money
I wouldn't say they wasted their money, property is not ice cream, it wont melt.

Someone who can afford to buy a house for $ 3 million can afford to wait for the prices to rise again and they probably have multiple streams of income in different industries.

But for an upcoming businessmen, say a young person like you starting out in Rwanda or most of us here, we can look out to fill the gaps we see in the market.Basically, look at it as an opportunity.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:37 AM   #22952
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I have to say for me Nigeria has been the biggest disappointment this decade if I were to compare expectations/hopes vs. reality. While there seem to be a few bright spots (Dangote's LNG & fertilizer plant investments, Chinese-backed rail investments), the overall condition of Nigeria's economy is horrid. I wonder how this country manages to barely function day in and day out given the issues that persist that have obvious remedies staring its policymakers right in the face.
The nation leaders are just too corrupt to make any progress happens and if it did happen it is less noticeable due to the meagerness of what it entails for the development and to meet the needs of the people in relationship to size. I once read an article somewhere that states the nation is being controlled by some group of Nigerians, mainly addressed as godfathers, who aren't very smart. They are baked in uncivilized ideas and willing to do things in ways that are comparable to those of oligarchs or mafia.

There are human resources, I believe, that needs to be tapped into yet nothing is done to quickly take the opportunity and educate the citizenry. Investing in the future and building modern infrastructure is very important and expedient. I also believe the Nigerian leaders don't know the best asset they have is the young teeming population that need decent education.

Beside those they have gradually squandered the revenue from oil for their selfish gains. They are the results of what we are seeing today in the poorly performing economic, social unrest, bad education plans. Even the policy makers aren't doing anything to make the economy works, from information that can be gathered online.

Nigeria is not only a sleeping African giant but the one in coma. It would take an organized minds with dedication to wake it up.

That is my personal view as a follower of things happening to that nation's economy.

Last edited by friendsofthecity; March 15th, 2019 at 02:46 AM.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 02:43 AM   #22953
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African Business and Economy News

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Originally Posted by ekema View Post
Somehow you skipped glencore. Surprise


No i read Glencore. There is PLENTY about Glencore's shady dealings in the Western media which is supposedly to be biased towards exposing Chinese endeavours in Africa. Funny when this press talks about Western companies then it isnt biased against them. Only if its China.

Problem is there are people who will criticise one and not the other

Last edited by popa1980; March 15th, 2019 at 03:17 AM.
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Old March 15th, 2019, 03:36 AM   #22954
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Good move... way too little trade and cooperation between SA and Egypt:

Egypt seeks increased bilateral trade and investment with South Africa

Egyptian Ambassador to South Africa Sherif Eissa has called for more bilateral trade and investment between his country and South Africa, as well as closer political cooperation. He was addressing the South African Chamber of Commerce and Industry and Federation of Egyptian Industries (FEI) Trade and Investment Forum in Johannesburg on Thursday.

“We have big economies, we can work together,” he pointed out. “Why should we see such a small volume of trade between our two countries? …. We have never seen Egyptian investment in South Africa.” (And South African investment in Egypt was minor.)

“Egypt is moving forward, sometimes with difficulty.” He expressed the hope that this would result in a bright outcome for the people of Egypt and, indeed, also for all of Africa. “We’re working for all of Africa, not just for Egypt.”

“Egypt is building twenty new, fourth generation cities. Twenty!” he highlighted. “Seven are almost completed.” One of these cities was a new administrative capital (still unnamed) for the country, located between the Nile and the Suez Canal, some 45 km east of the present capital, Cairo.

The Suez Canal has already been upgraded, increasing its capacity by almost 100%. And the country was planning to become an energy hub, following major natural gas discoveries in Egyptian waters in the Mediterranean Sea in recent years.

But South African companies had hardly been involved in these and other major Egyptian programmes. “We have the potential; we need to have the will,” he affirmed. “Let’s urge the businessmen in Egypt, and in South Africa – this is an opportunity.”

“We have similar economies, similar services …. There is competition …. But there is constructive cooperation and destructive competition,” stated Eissa. “We need to focus on constructive competition …. We should cooperate together.”

He said that the FEI delegation was probably the biggest Egyptian trade mission to visit South Africa. “We are here today to gather business to business.”

http://www.engineeringnews.co.za/art...14/rep_id:4136
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Old March 15th, 2019, 04:14 AM   #22955
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Originally Posted by friendsofthecity View Post
The nation leaders are just too corrupt to make any progress happens and if it did happen it is less noticeable due to the meagerness of what it entails for the development and to meet the needs of the people in relationship to size. I once read an article somewhere that states the nation is being controlled by some group of Nigerians, mainly addressed as godfathers, who aren't very smart. They are baked in uncivilized ideas and willing to do things in ways that are comparable to those of oligarchs or mafia.

There are human resources, I believe, that needs to be tapped into yet nothing is done to quickly take the opportunity and educate the citizenry. Investing in the future and building modern infrastructure is very important and expedient. I also believe the Nigerian leaders don't know the best asset they have is the young teeming population that need decent education.

Beside those they have gradually squandered the revenue from oil for their selfish gains. They are the results of what we are seeing today in the poorly performing economic, social unrest, bad education plans. Even the policy makers aren't doing anything to make the economy works, from information that can be gathered online.

Nigeria is not only a sleeping African giant but the one in coma. It would take an organized minds with dedication to wake it up.

That is my personal view as a follower of things happening to that nation's economy.
correct. It need revolution but may get something worse
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Old March 15th, 2019, 09:11 AM   #22956
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you didnt answer his question. for purposes of this discussion why does the gdp in 1950 when it was a colony mtter anyway


Why doesnt it?

Im confused
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Old March 15th, 2019, 10:59 AM   #22957
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Originally Posted by Olivilo View Post
You come from a country that doesn't use the CFA franc, and you feel you are entitled to tell people from countries who use it what they should or not should not do. That's funny. To me what you're doing is a form of meddling in other people's national affairs, exactly what you're reproaching France.

Well I also met a number from Ghana who think they are British, who try to speak with the queen's accent, who believe that London is the best city in the world and who buy real estate there instead of investing their money in Ghana. And the Kenyans still have their currency called "shilling" like in Victorian England, and they still drive on the left side of the road like Mama England. Now who is the most colonized in their heads, tell me.

You just switched from making credible sound points to making points that are 90% sound, 10%points.

The CFA franc works well for the countries that implement it. In fact, possible quick solution to Zimbabwe's financial woes would be adopting a similar thing with the South African rand. It does insulate a country from rampant inflation and the galloping currency devaluations. One can actually keep a 5yr fixed deposit and expect his/her savings value to not just get wiped out

Thing is the respective countries lack a complete say on the currency in circulation. The government can't for instance tactically devalue their currency to boost exports like the Japanese do. Then the financial regulators don't really know how to run a currency. And this is a big risk since they'll be entirely devastated in the event of a big shock like falling out with the other CFA franc members or France goes to war

In my opinion, the larger economies should introduce a new currency, peg it to the franc while operating in similar policies then they gradually beef it up and increase its autonomy. The weaker economies are quite better of with the franc
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Old March 15th, 2019, 12:20 PM   #22958
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Why doesnt it?

Im confused
Because it wasn’t even independent yet. If we’re comparing how well the countries did to other africa states we should focus on when they had control of their countries not when it was a colony
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Old March 15th, 2019, 12:24 PM   #22959
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You just switched from making credible sound points to making points that are 90% sound, 10%points.

The CFA franc works well for the countries that implement it. In fact, possible quick solution to Zimbabwe's financial woes would be adopting a similar thing with the South African rand. It does insulate a country from rampant inflation and the galloping currency devaluations. One can actually keep a 5yr fixed deposit and expect his/her savings value to not just get wiped out

Thing is the respective countries lack a complete say on the currency in circulation. The government can't for instance tactically devalue their currency to boost exports like the Japanese do. Then the financial regulators don't really know how to run a currency. And this is a big risk since they'll be entirely devastated in the event of a big shock like falling out with the other CFA franc members or France goes to war

In my opinion, the larger economies should introduce a new currency, peg it to the franc while operating in similar policies then they gradually beef it up and increase its autonomy. The weaker economies are quite better of with the franc
You’re taking about an extreme situation in Zimbabwe firstly. None of the cfa countries are in that boat. And even so Zimbabwe won’t have its monetary policy dictates from S.A. a peg is one thing to arrest a desperate situation. But colonisation by a foreign power as you see with France is different

Will Zimbabwe move it’s reserves to South Africa ? Will it have the currency unilaterally devalued. Will it suffer retaliation if it unpegged
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Old March 15th, 2019, 05:17 PM   #22960
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Originally Posted by Afro Circus View Post
You just switched from making credible sound points to making points that are 90% sound, 10%points.

The CFA franc works well for the countries that implement it. In fact, possible quick solution to Zimbabwe's financial woes would be adopting a similar thing with the South African rand. It does insulate a country from rampant inflation and the galloping currency devaluations. One can actually keep a 5yr fixed deposit and expect his/her savings value to not just get wiped out

Thing is the respective countries lack a complete say on the currency in circulation. The government can't for instance tactically devalue their currency to boost exports like the Japanese do. Then the financial regulators don't really know how to run a currency. And this is a big risk since they'll be entirely devastated in the event of a big shock like falling out with the other CFA franc members or France goes to war

In my opinion, the larger economies should introduce a new currency, peg it to the franc while operating in similar policies then they gradually beef it up and increase its autonomy. The weaker economies are quite better of with the franc
How the CFA Franc Currency work well for African Countries that implemented it ? Is the Euro Currency working well for Greece ?

Adopting a colonial currency with its mechanisms won't help Zimbabwe...
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