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Old May 14th, 2009, 10:47 PM   #17161
Get Smart
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I agree. My purchases were in the Marina and JLT - two projects where I believe the master developer, which is linked to the government/royal family had to approve the contracts of the individual sub-developers. So there's no way the visa clauses could have found their way into the contracts without the powers that be agreeing it.

As for other countries, I've been toying with going to Canada. Anyone in good health and of good character can go to live there, which after time can be converted into citizenship, without a job, if they either have certain qualifying skills or are prepared either to set up a business there that will employ one Canadian and have a turnover of (I believe) $300k/yr after a couple of years or is willing to invest a sum of $400k (or maybe less?) with the government for five years.

Such have been the delays in real estate construction in Dubai that some of us have invested that kind of money for that sort of time already. And I know what I consider a safer place to put my money, given a choice between the government of one of the most financially prudent, asset-rich and democratic nations of the world and a dodgy developer in UAE...
Mistermark, stop being a baby and the stupid lame excuses about democracy and all that non sense. You wanted to make a quick buck and lost out big time, and the rot statred in US and UK, not the UAE. If you are so passionate about asset rich democratic country, then why didnt you move to Canada in the 1st place, and even if you did you would still be bitching and whining about the value loss of your property in Canada. Loosers and lame excusers like you make me sick. Why dont you emigrate to Pakistan, because they are getting a lot of free money from america
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Old May 15th, 2009, 01:21 AM   #17162
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European investors have mothballed plans to invest in Dubai's bombed-out property in favour of more familiar and mature markets, prolonging the emirate's maiden bust until at least 2011.
Prices in the emirate's once-booming real estate sector will continue to slump over the next year, with demand for property waning as expat professionals lose their jobs, while more Dubai contractors will bid for projects elsewhere.
Once a magnet for capital from European property investors, the emirate's appeal -- famed for its iconic palm tree-shaped islands -- is fading fast as they scramble to seize better real estate deals closer to home and elsewhere in the Gulf.
Analysts are already predicting the more stable Doha and Saudi Arabia property markets to recover faster than Dubai, which is experiencing its first growing pangs.
"The consensus opinion is that the Dubai market has further to fall and this very sentiment is itself putting off investors who do not wish to catch a falling knife," said Craig Plumb, head of research at Jones Lang LaSalle in the United Arab Emirates.
A UBS report last month said Dubai house prices could fall up to 70 percent from a fourth-quarter peak. A Reuters poll in March showed prices were likely to fall more than 40 percent in 2009 and 2010 before recovering in 2011.
"Dubai is not one for us. I much prefer long-term established locations with underlying intrinsic attractions or clear, sustainable competitive advantages," said Bill Hughes, managing director, Legal & General Property.
By contrast, the battered UK housing market is showing early signs of revival, with an uptick in investment demand seen in Britain long before Dubai.
Property prices in Dubai, dubbed as the world's biggest construction site, soared sharply after the emirate opened its real estate sector to foreign investors in 2002, granting them freehold ownership rights at many developments.
From start-2007 to mid-2008, prices rallied almost 80 percent, Morgan Stanley estimates showed.
The bubble burst spectacularly late in third-quarter 2008, leaving the region laden with half-built projects.
"The extreme boom-bust characteristics of the market are not compatible with the needs of most institutional investors, which are Aberdeen's core client base," said Andrew Smith, chief investment officer at Aberdeen Property Investors.
The financial market turmoil has caused significant injury to demand in Dubai's property market as thousands of jobless expat professionals are forced to leave the emirate.
UBS said Dubai's population was likely to fall 10 percent in the coming two years as a result of foreign worker job cuts, with residential vacancy rates reaching up to 30 percent in 2010 due to an expected oversupply.
CONTRACTORS LOOK ELSEWHERE
"International capital and indeed that from the Gulf region is increasingly looking for distressed assets in more mature markets, with central London being seen as the pick of the bunch," Plumb said.
Several Dubai-based contractors are also seeking opportunities further afield as work dries up and competition for new projects intensifies.
Dubai contractor Arabtec, the largest listed construction firm in the UAE, was this week awarded a 1.6 billion dirham ($435.6 million) contract in Abu Dhabi. It also recently started work on its first project in Saudi Arabia and is scouring North Africa for work.
More than half of the construction projects in the UAE, worth $582 billion, have been put on hold, Dubai-based market research firm Proleads said in February.
While abandoned buildings and empty luxury homes provide a stark reminder of Dubai's dramatic property bust, the small number of investors with cash to spend on real estate will be keeping their powder dry.
"In the short term there is a lot of confusion among overseas investors," said Stuart Law, chief executive of UK-based Assetz, a specialist real estate investment firm.
"I wouldn't buy there myself for holiday home purposes as there's nothing going on. South of France is for me," he said. (Editing by Andrew Macdonald) ($1=3.673 dirhams)
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Old May 15th, 2009, 10:04 AM   #17163
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Originally Posted by Get Smart View Post
Millions of your country folks especially from Here would like the same facilities too, but instead of living in grime and poverty
You have no clue what democracy means ! For you surely means nothing but for those millions of Indian means a lot! Get smart mate!
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Old May 15th, 2009, 10:05 AM   #17164
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I don't think the majority of Indians care about ur so called democracy.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 10:10 AM   #17165
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I don't think the majority of Indians care about ur so called democracy.

I am sure you are right, every single man and woman in the world dreaming to have your life style in Dubai!
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Old May 15th, 2009, 10:16 AM   #17166
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I don't think the majority of Indians care about ur so called democracy.
The 100 million of them voting in India right now might disagree.

How many citizens have the right to a meaningful vote in Dubai?
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Old May 15th, 2009, 10:21 AM   #17167
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In India if they got to choose between democracy or Dubai life style they would choose Dubai any day.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 01:01 PM   #17168
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Originally Posted by smussuw View Post


In India if they got to choose between democracy or Dubai life style they would choose Dubai any day.
That might be jumping to conclusions. Indians have slowly started to realize what the ground realities in the so called dreamland is. Poor poeple with freedom are still happy people, it doesnt take a porsche and a luxury condo to make them smile. Dubai is no longer what it used to be, with all the good came a lot more bad
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Old May 15th, 2009, 01:06 PM   #17169
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If it was approved the parliament will restrict alcohol consumption to hotel accommodation rooms and private homes only and ban bars and pubs.
There's no law yet to ban anything in Bahrain. There's only a circular from the tourism authority to 1 and 2 star hotels to close their bars and stop all entertainment activity in their hotels, and even this is being challenged in the courts. Residents in 1,2 star hotels can still consume alcohol bought from specific outlets in Manama in their rooms

Last edited by Adel; May 15th, 2009 at 01:21 PM.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 01:33 PM   #17170
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"This is our Dubai, whats yours?" Ad Campaign launched to target UK and Ireland

15/MAY/2009

"This is our Dubai, whats yours?" Ad Campaign launched to target UK and Ireland

Braving the global recession, Dubai has launched a massive advertising and marketing campaign in the UK and Ireland, revealed officials of the Dubai Department of Tourism and Commerce Marketing (DTCM)Dubai Department of Tourism and Commerce Marketing (DTCM).

The intention is to increase tourism traffic to Dubai during the Dubai Summer Surprises period from June 11 to August 14. Tourism is one of Dubai's most important sectors. It contributes directly towards 19 per cent of the emirate's gross domestic product.

However, industry experts believe that combined with the retail activity that Dubai encourages by means of various festivals and special promotions, this contributing figure could be as high as 30 per cent.

"We are constantly devising special advertising campaigns specific to the region and with a global approach. This campaign in the UK and Ireland is specific to that region, while we are working on an all-new global campaign to be launched very soon," said Eyad Abdul Rehman, a senior official at DTCM.

DTCM is very busy in organising everything and will be announcing the new global campaign sometime next week," said Rehman. He added that the department is finalising the finer details of the campaign and already in discussions with other involved parties including Emirates airline.

Dubai has been consistently increasing its dependence on retail and developing this sector with multi-million dollar investments in infrastructure and hotels in every category. Dubai's intention is to attract 10 million visitors by 2010 and increase the number to 15 million by 2015, which will be twice as many as there were in 2007.

Officials did not share the cost of the campaign, but considering it will be covering all the media platforms including print, electronic and outdoors, industry experts define it as a "multi-million dollar campaign".

Dubai has also been affected by the global economic recession, but figures according to the Dubai Tourism Board convey that the emirate is being resilient to the global gloom.

The first quarter of 2009 actually saw an increase of five per cent in tourism flow when compared to the same period last year. Hotels have recorded decline in occupancy and are offering discounts on room rates, but Khalid bin Sulayem, Director of the Dubai Tourism Board, stated during the recently concluded Arabian Travel Market that "the tourism industry is healthy and strong".

The UK remained the top source market for Dubai tourism industry in the first quarter of the year, followed by Iran, India, the United States, Saudi Arabia, Germany, Russia, Pakistan, France and Kuwait - same as the first quarter of 2008.

The campaign specifically aimed at the UK and Ireland markets has been created by London-based agencies Initiative and IM London (formerly Independent Marketing). The campaign, which is to be predominantly in print and digital media, sees an increase of 40 per cent on last year's advertising spend and runs alongside the existing public relations campaign that is managed by The Communication Group plc, reported UK media.

The campaign makes an emotional approach with the slogan "This is our Dubai, what's yours?" and the identification of distinct target market segments including couples, active men, pampered women and premium families. The campaign is to last 12 months.

"This is a regional campaign for the UK and Ireland, but in addition to our regional efforts, we also devise unified global campaigns and in the weeks to come we will be disclosing details of our new international campaign," said Rehman of DTCM.

article source: http://www.tigerzilla.com/properties...d-ireland.html

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Old May 15th, 2009, 02:13 PM   #17171
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In India if they got to choose between democracy or Dubai life style they would choose Dubai any day.
India was there, is there and will be there, dubai life stile not sure....
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Old May 15th, 2009, 02:16 PM   #17172
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bbc will have a episode on sunday around 6 p.m., on " Are the doom bashers rite about dubai's gloory days being over ". Hopefully we will have a positive report, with cooler, optimistic minds. It could be Fast Track, but not sure, just cought a glimpse of it.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 02:42 PM   #17173
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u urself had very negative views about Dubai, what made u change ur mind?
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Old May 15th, 2009, 02:45 PM   #17174
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I never had negative views of Dubai, where do you get that from ????????
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Old May 15th, 2009, 02:45 PM   #17175
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bbc will have a episode on sunday around 6 p.m., on " Are the doom bashers rite about dubai's gloory days being over ". Hopefully we will have a positive report, with cooler, optimistic minds. It could be Fast Track, but not sure, just cought a glimpse of it.
Is this on BBC world in UAE?
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Old May 15th, 2009, 02:51 PM   #17176
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Im in Europe now, and thats where I saw it, could be in middle east aswell, dont see why not.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 03:08 PM   #17177
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HT

Will get round to answering all your remarks in full, with simple explanations.
https://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=35877694&postcount=16211

234Sale,

I have been patiently waiting for your words of wisdom as to why Dubai is so well placed to weather the storm and the UK is finished.

What’s wrong ? have you had a change of heart, or just realised that your bullish support of the Emirate is misplaced. I guess you are just too busy to talk now I suppose. Particularly now that the factual information makes your statements look so ridiculous.

Blinkered Investors in Dubai may not want to read this post as it won’t fit into the dream. Anyone wishing for an independent analysis from someone who loves Dubai and will be a part time resident in the near future may find it of interest.

I think anyone who hasn’t got their head in the sand can now clearly see that Dubai is falling down big time. Falling capital values are bad enough, but when rents start falling at scary levels too, that’s when all the clever money leaves the building, (site).

I have just go back from a brief business trip to Dubai, Doha and Kuwait and trust me when I say that institutional money is leaving Dubai quicker than a Buggati Veyron accelerating down Sheikh Zayed Road.

Speaking with fairly well connected locals in the UAE here’s what is happening.

Abu Dhabi has always been bitter about the success of Dubai as it is the capital, but many people across the world haven’t even heard of AD but most have heard of Dubai. While Dubai has been growing and succeeding as a property developers dream on the back of high regional oil profits, excess liquidity, promised visas offering a safe haven, and cheap Dollars/Dirhams. Abu Dhabi has been watching in amazement how the marketing machine of Dubai has been reeling in the cash from the worlds rich (and not so rich).

As big brother Abu Dhabi has had more than just a sibling rivalry against little brother Dubai, it has cringed at the way Dubai has behaved in order to reap the rewards of expat cash.

Now that little brother Dubai has had a fall, big brother Abu Dhabi has come to pick up the pieces, but not without conditions. Visas are just the begining of Abu Dhabi pulling in the reigns on Dubai. Project cancellations (a good thing), is also happening widely across Dubai. Tourism projects, Hotels and everything Dubai needs to survive is what Abu Dhabi does not want. It was mentioned to me that alcohol being sold freely in Hotels is something frowned on by Abu Dhabi and could easily be stopped at the wave of a law making finger.

People who remain bullish on Dubai keep saying it will soon get back to normal, once the Dollar falls, once oil prices get above $100, it will all get back to normal. Once the banks are recapitalised, once credit gets flowing again, things will get back to normal.

Well just think about this for a moment.

THIS IS NORMAL.

The sate of the market as you see it now is NORMAL, for Dubai. Speculation is over, cheap credit is over, the lies have been exposed and the vision was a dream. This is reality.

The values that you see in Dubai reflect what things are actually worth. 2008 values were inflated beyond belief. People buying property at AED 4000 psf and more because “you have Burj Dubai views” was INSANE. A tall building and a fountain are not sound fundamentals for valuing a property.

Base prices in Dubai are around AED 1,000 psf in decent areas. Add 20% for a great location/building and facilities and maybe 25% for a great view, (I was wrong on this issue before, as I did not realise how important views are in Dubai).

Areas that will survive in Dubai are Palm Jumeirah, Dubai Marina, JLT for me that’s about it. These are the areas that Ex-pats will want to live due to Beaches, Hotels (bars), Restaurants, Malls and entertainment, good transport links. Without ex-pats Dubai does not exist. Emirati’s do not have the skills, knowledge, desire, or need to make anything happen on their own. I mean no personal offence to Emirati’s on this forum I am just stating the facts as I see them, and quoting your fellow countrymen. “we don’t need it”. It being ‘New Dubai’.

We all have strengths and weaknesses, and if we are to improve ourselves we must first acknowledge our weaknesses before striving to improve them.

With population shrinking and supply increasing there will be increasing oversupply in Dubai for at least 5 years, probably 10. While there is this level of oversupply prices will not rise exponentially and will do well to hold at current levels. Inflation is the only thing that will improve capital values in the short term. Thankfully 10%-12% inflation is acceptable in Asia so this may be a blessing to investors based in low inflation economies.

The existing demographic that drives demand will all be able to upgrade and move up the housing ladder at no cost in the next year or so. I have said this time and time again and been told I was wrong. Whoever is left in Dubai after the summer will be able to re-asses where they want to live. Those living in Studios paying 100k will now be able to look at a 1 bed, those living in a 1 bed paying 130k will now be able to afford a 2 bed. Those in a 2 bed paying 160k now get a 3 bed (2 bed with office/spare room) and so on, and so on. Everyone who is a tenant will have more choice and more spending power. Now look at the ratio of Studios - 1 beds – 2 beds – 3 beds in prime areas. Everyone steps up the ladder and what’s left at the bottom of the pile is lots of empty broom cupboards.

The only way to change the trajectory of this dynamic is.

Reduce supply
Increase demand

It is as simple as that, nothing more, nothing less. Until this happens capital values and rental yields will fall or at best hold. The problem is because of the way the Dubai property market is funded (stage payment from investors into Escrow accounts), anything that has started construction is under pressure to complete to be profitable to the developer therefore inevitably increasing supply.

If every project in Dubai where piling has been completed was built until completion and the rest of the space was landscaped it would take at least 3/4 years to finish. I would hate to imagine how many units of commercial, residential, office and retail space that would feed into the supply chain.

Now count the population of Dubai that don’t live in labour camps or maids quarters. Take one away from the other, and your left with a massive gap to fill.

This is the issue that is not being addressed, and I am now of the opinion that it is beyond the scope of being addressed by Dubai PLC’s CEO. This is what is known in business as a hostile takeover bid, closely followed by asset stripping, and then leave the dead wood to rot.

The closer your investment is to Abu Dhabi in my view the better it will fare in the coming years.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 03:12 PM   #17178
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I never had negative views of Dubai, where do you get that from ????????
maybe I mistook u with someone else
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Old May 15th, 2009, 04:04 PM   #17179
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So what's your view of JLT in the long haul High Times, especially if your not hurting for money, you like to enjoy the beach's, and food there ????? Who know's maybe even part of my retirement in a few decades from now.
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Old May 15th, 2009, 05:35 PM   #17180
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VAT plans put on hold

By Saifur Rahman, Business Editor
Published: May 14, 2009, 23:00


Dubai: The UAE appears to have abandoned plans to implement value-added tax (VAT) for the time being, a top official said, adding that the worst for Dubai is over.

The government is going to enact a new Investment Law and revise the Companies Law in the next six months. The Investment Law will change the country's foreign investment regime and allow more than 49 per cent foreign ownership in companies in certain sectors outside free zone areas.

"The government is currently working on a number of laws and regulations that will reduce procedures and lower licensing and business registration costs and make Dubai a more competitive place to work and live in," Hamad Bu Amim, Director-General of Dubai Chamber of Commerce and Industry, told Gulf News in an exclusive interview.

"The worst for us is over. So plans like VAT are definitely off the government's agenda, as the government is currently working on a comprehensive set of rules and regulations that will make our economy more competitive and ease doing business," he said.

The UAE Government had planned to introduce VAT in phases from later this year or early 2010. The tax was to start at three per cent and replace the five per cent import duty.

The plan, in line with a Gulf-wide implementation, had met with resistance, especially in view of the current economic situation.

The six Gulf states created a Customs Union in 2003 and a Common Market in 2008, in line with creating a Monetary Union by 2010 - a deadline currently in doubt.

"The government is working on a new Investment Law, which could be announced in the second half of the year, and looking at reducing the number of licensing and business registration procedures by a third from 21," Bu Amim said.

Currently, it takes about two years and 50 procedures to enforce a contract. The UAE ranks 144 among 178 economies in business competitiveness.

The government is also revising the Commercial Companies Law and the Commercial Agencies Law, and re-introducing the Bankruptcy Law and bringing them in line with international best practices.

The Bankruptcy Law, which is expected to suggest ways to protect businesses from creditors during difficult economic periods, will help businesses to continue instead of facing legal proceedings.

The UAE, especially Dubai, witnessed a boom for five years that was fuelled by real estate, construction sector and high oil prices, till things began to change late last year.

A massive capital outflow then impacted the country's economy, eliminating speculators from the market, which is currently in a clean-up mode.

The moves, Bu Amim said, come in line with the UAE strategy to streamline processes to boost government's performance and investor confidence.

http://www.gulfnews.com/business/Economy/10313759.html
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