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Old September 21st, 2019, 11:02 PM   #3441
Kijanamwafrika
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That direct flights saving KQ was a farce.It would have helped a little to increase revenues but was not going to bring down costs.One thing people do not like to admit is that KQ pilots are overpaid increasing the proportion of salaries paid to revenue generated which is not sustainable.Second the fuel costs are high in proportion to tickets sales and too many flight cancellations.Even the best manager in the world if his hands are tied in bringing down costs like salaries or changing economic situation to increase ticket sales will fail

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Old September 21st, 2019, 11:15 PM   #3442
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I think the problem is that the airline business is really not a local business. It has great exposure to the first worldís risks and thatís where it operates, yet it is based in a low income economy. So the pilots and their engineers think they as in the same market with American and Dubai pilots whose incomes are based on the national income levels and standards of those countries, which is totally non-comparable to Kenyaís income levels. This scenario ends up being so weird because Kenyans who went to school with the same pilots but ended up in different careers make much less than kenyan pilots who spent less time in school and make incomes comparable to first world markets. The airline industry is really weird because itís neither domestic nor is it really global, and itís exposed to both local and global business risks simultaneously. Iím wondering now how pilots for the Ethiopian Airlines are paid and whether Ethiopian airlines experiences the same pilot-related pay problems as our own KQ. Ethiopian is fully government-owned and run, meaning their pilots would be civil servants, who typically make way less than competitive market rates being paid to kenyan and other international airlines pilots. Are the Ethiopian airlines pilots just more patriotic than our kenyan pilots?
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Old September 22nd, 2019, 02:19 AM   #3443
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I think one of the reasons is just like you said, they are Civil servants. Two no Unions meddling in the management of the airline. Three no politicians meddling either! By the way ET has a robust Airline training program. They train quite a few African Cabin Crew members. ET Academy

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Old September 22nd, 2019, 07:32 AM   #3444
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So we brought in a doctor Sebastian Mikosz. Apparently he had experience and had turned around another airline that was ailing. He came in assessed the situation, diagnosed the cancer and prescribed some treatment.

Some one did not like the medicine.

So now we are back in bed, sick trying to find another doctor who will tell us, yes you have cancer. By then the cancer will have spread to too many vital organs. Diagnosis.. grim..only a few more months to live....
The pilots will happily move to Emirates and other Middle East carriers and the rest of KQ staff will be back in the streets fighting with everyone else to sell Mitumba, Nyoyo, Githeri, and my favorite machome na masambe... life goes on.
You've diagnosed some of our collective sickness correctly .Same conclusion the Israeli general /ambassador said about the failure of the huge Galana Kulalu irrigation project.He said Kenya's system of cartels ruins Kenya's dynamism a lot.
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Old September 24th, 2019, 11:39 AM   #3445
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I have never seen a situation where employees dictates how a company is run. KALPA has behaved like a management arm of KQ. Its unpalatable that pilots continue to frustrate any attempts to resuscitate the airline by blocking recruitment of pilots to cover current deficit...The same pilots earn salaries like those of astronauts. Its a pity.
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Old September 27th, 2019, 04:14 PM   #3446
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https://biznakenya.com/kq-pilots-sal...-updated-2019/

KQ Pilots Salary: Pilots at Kenya Airways are some of the best paid in the region. The pilotsí salaries have been on an upward trend despite the national carrier continuously returning billions of losses every year.

Senior KQ staff in the rank of captain earned an average monthly salary of Sh1.6 million ($16,000), double what pilots of Ethiopian Airlines earn per month.

About half of Kenya Airwaysí payroll is dished out to its pilots ó who form the minority of the workforce. An official document by the national carrier showed that although pilots accounted for 13 per cent of the airlineís total workforce, they took home the equivalent of 45 per cent of the overall payout to employees.
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Old September 27th, 2019, 04:36 PM   #3447
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Greed is what drives Kenya Airways Pilots. Nothing else. How can it be that Ethiopian Airlines pays half what KQ pays and they are the best ran and most profitable airline in Africa? How do they retain their pilots? Very few people in the US make $16,000 a month. Those are top of the middle class or high income people. That's outrageous to say the least. I don't think a pilot's training is demanding of that kind of reward. There's something wrong with the management of KQ, how did the salaries get that high up? What do they pay their engineers there? More?
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Old September 27th, 2019, 06:17 PM   #3448
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KQ will go down like Nakumatt unless the costs are reined in or the government keeps pumping in money to keep up with the costs because it will not come from KQ revenues

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Old September 28th, 2019, 02:46 AM   #3449
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I actually think making this thing public is the wrong decision. It should have been liquidated like Thomas Cook, then restarted afresh with a new team after a year or two in the cold.
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Old September 28th, 2019, 07:02 AM   #3450
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That’s around $44 dollars an hour, $533 dollars a day in a developing country? That’s to say the least outrageous.

I praise KQ pilots some of the most professionals around but they’re sucking the company dry. KQ needs to figure out a way to make pilots more money without draining its coffers like offering them stock options or good 401ks where that money is somehow reinvested into the company.
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Old September 28th, 2019, 05:21 PM   #3451
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Originally Posted by abckris View Post
Greed is what drives Kenya Airways Pilots. Nothing else. How can it be that Ethiopian Airlines pays half what KQ pays and they are the best ran and most profitable airline in Africa? How do they retain their pilots? Very few people in the US make $16,000 a month. Those are top of the middle class or high income people. That's outrageous to say the least. I don't think a pilot's training is demanding of that kind of reward. There's something wrong with the management of KQ, how did the salaries get that high up? What do they pay their engineers there? More?
I think ethiopian(govt) train most of their pilots ...and Ethiopians generally have strong nationalism(patriotism) ..so they remain loyal to their country and goverment..they are like indebt
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Old September 28th, 2019, 06:24 PM   #3452
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Whatever they do in Ethiopian airlines thatís what KQ needs to learn. And Iíll say again that nationalizing KQ is not a solution. Dah!! Thatís where we came from to here today. Donít we learn? Whatís the point of living mistakes youíve made before!
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Old September 28th, 2019, 06:45 PM   #3453
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I think ethiopian(govt) train most of their pilots ...and Ethiopians generally have strong nationalism(patriotism) ..so they remain loyal to their country and goverment..they are like indebt
I stand to be corrected but most civil servants or anyone working for government run organizations earn far less in Ethiopia than what they would earn in Kenya. I guess it stems from the old communist days where government restricts income levels.
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Old September 28th, 2019, 06:51 PM   #3454
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Whatever they do in Ethiopian airlines thatís what KQ needs to learn. And Iíll say again that nationalizing KQ is not a solution. Dah!! Thatís where we came from to here today. Donít we learn? Whatís the point of living mistakes youíve made before!
That's a contradiction. Ethiopia is nationalized.

Some vital strategic entities should not be run on a profit making basis. Sometimes tunadanganywa.

E.g Farming in Europe is heavily subsidized. But you will never hear of it.
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Old September 28th, 2019, 11:25 PM   #3455
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That's a contradiction. Ethiopia is nationalized.

Some vital strategic entities should not be run on a profit making basis. Sometimes tunadanganywa.

E.g Farming in Europe is heavily subsidized. But you will never hear of it.
Subsidy for a company which is paying pilots about three times the average salary of a worker in the United States in a developing country?That would be a travesty
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Old September 29th, 2019, 05:28 AM   #3456
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Whatever they do in Ethiopian airlines thatís what KQ needs to learn. And Iíll say again that nationalizing KQ is not a solution. Dah!! Thatís where we came from to here today. Donít we learn? Whatís the point of living mistakes youíve made before!
Ethiopian Airlines employees, who are government employed aren't allowed to form or join labor unions whereby they can't go on strike to demand a pay raise. In Kenya the labor laws allows employees to do this. Their greedy union bosses always keep a sharp eye on the stock prices and revenue earnings and promptly order their members to go on strike to demand pay increases not caring that investors haven't enjoyed the benefits of their investments.
When the current KQ CEO mentioned that KQ pilots are the highest paid pilots in Africa, their union bosses mentioned that the Middle East carriers pay more. They literally used pilots in the oil rich monarchies of the Gulf region as a backstop to the criticisms.

I said before and I'll say it again, don't nationalize KQ and let market dynamics dictate its survival. If it's doomed to collapse, let it be and lets see where these greedy union members find a similar high paying job inside Africa.
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Old September 29th, 2019, 09:54 AM   #3457
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Subsidy for a company which is paying pilots about three times the average salary of a worker in the United States in a developing country?That would be a travesty
Precisely. Hence the idea to nationalize it so that all who work in it fall under the Civil Service. This way the union can be tamed.

As a private entity listed on the stock exchange it cannot be subsidized.

It should not be allowed to shut down because of a few greedy pilots. The bigger objective is to ensure it continues to provide the strategic advantage it brings to our country.
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Old September 29th, 2019, 10:09 AM   #3458
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Precisely. Hence the idea to nationalize it so that all who work in it fall under the Civil Service. This way the union can be tamed.

As a private entity listed on the stock exchange it cannot be subsidized.

It should not be allowed to shut down because of a few greedy pilots. The bigger objective is to ensure it continues to provide the strategic advantage it brings to our country.
Well if it would serve the purpose of reducing salaries it would be good but given how high the salaries of some civil servants is and how high the recurrent expenditure is in this country it is not a guarantee and add corruption in government on top of that it is a double whammy.I agree though on the strategic importance of the airline and it would be a shame if it went down

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Old September 29th, 2019, 09:16 PM   #3459
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If nationalization was to happen, does that mean the pilots now become part of SRC guidelines? These pilots may be jumping from the frying pan into the fire... it would mean they earn more than the president who base salary is 1.2 million thus rationalization may have to happen.
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Old September 30th, 2019, 10:50 AM   #3460
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I got shocked when i learnt that pilots who are 13% of total workforce in KQ, consumes a massive 60% of the total wage bill. The same pilots keep on issuing strike threats, fail to appear for duty leading to cancellation of the flights another cost on the KQ, constant demands to change the management despite having a new board and management. If these pilots are not saboteurs, then tell me what they are..
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