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Old December 19th, 2006, 08:50 PM   #101
kamilo
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It's Colombia not Columbia. Yes even in English!!!!

Colombia would have to build all the stadiums necessary to host the WC if it gets it. im almost sure FIFA is going to give Brasil the 2014 WC.
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Old December 19th, 2006, 09:06 PM   #102
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If you're going to be like that Brasil is spelt Brazil in English!
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Old December 19th, 2006, 09:19 PM   #103
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Azteca is the biggest stadium (soccer) in the world?
What's capacity?
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Old December 19th, 2006, 09:56 PM   #104
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Quote:
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Azteca is the biggest stadium (soccer) in the world?
What's capacity?
actually LP heres a list and it surprized me that azteca is not the world's largest soccer stadium. A stadium in calcutta india actually is the largest.
Maracana has gone down to just 77,743 with the placement of seats. All the
Football(soccer) Stadia are in bold print. With the removal of terracing standing room Maracana I would think fits Fifa Standards it might be questionable in regards to roof over the entire crowd area. The Berlin Olympic Stadium certainly solved that with a fabric roof for this years Fifa WC.What other modifications had to be made to Berlin olympic stadium I am not sure of but that stadium is atleast 14 years older then maracana.

As to columbia they have stadia about the age of most brazillian stadia but nothing much above 40,000.

Indianapolis Speedway 250 000 1909 all-seater
Horse-Racing use Tokyo Tokyo Racecourse 223 000 1933 13 750
Shanghai Shanghai Int'l Circuit 200 000 2004 all-seater
Daytona Beach Daytona Int'l Speedway 168 000 1959 all-seater
Concord Lowe's Motor Speedway 167 000 1959 all-seater
Chiba Nakayama Racecourse 165 676 1990 15 944
Bristol Bristol Motor Speedway 160 000 1961 all-seater
Istanbul Istanbul Park 155 000 2005 35 000
Fort Worth Texas Motor Speedway 154 861 1997 all-seater
Pyöngyang Rungnado May Day Stadium 150 000 1989 all-seater Nürburg Nürburgring 150 000 1927 all-seater
Talladega Talladega Superspeedway 143 000 1969 all-seater
Dover Dover Int'l Speedway 140 000 1969 all-seater
Las Vegas Las Vegas Motor Speedway 140 000 1996 all-seater Hanshin Racecourse 139 877 1991 12 603
Monza Autodromo di Monza 137 000 1922 77 000
Brooklyn Michigan Int'l Speedway 136 373 1968 all-seater
Corby Rockingham Speedway 130 000 2001 all-seater
Melbourne Flemington Racecourse 130 000 1927 -
Silverstone Silverstone Circuit 125 000 1948 60 000
Hampton Atlanta Motor Speedway 124 000 1997 all-seater
Calcutta Saltlake Stadium 120 000 1984 all-seater
Kyoto Kyoto Racecourse 120 000 1999 28 000
Hockenheimring 120 000 1932 all-seater
Klettwitz EuroSpeedway Lausitz 120 000 2000 25 000
Cheste Circuit Ricardo Tormo 120 000 2000 60 000
Louisville Churchill Downs 120 000 1895 48 500
Mexico City Estadio Azteca 114 465 1966 all-seater
Ann Arbor Michigan Stadium 107 501 1927 all-seater
University Park Beaver Stadium 107 282 1960 all-seater
Richmond Int'l Raceway 105 000 1946 all-seater
Knoxville Neyland Stadium 104 079 1921 all-seater
Rio de Janeiro Jornalista Mário Filho 103 045 1950 77 743
Columbus Ohio Stadium 101 568 1922 all-seater
Kuala Lumpur National Stadium Bukit Jalil 100 200 1998 all-seater
New Delhi Jawaharlal Nehru Stadium 100 000 1982 all-seater
Jakarta Bung Karno Stadium 100 000 1962 all-seater
Le Mans Circuit Bugatti 100 000 1965 all-seater
Le Castellet Circuit Paul Ricard 100 000 1970 -
Assen TT Circuit Assen 100 000 1955 60 000
Tehran Azadi Stadium 100 000 1971 all-seater
Montréal Circuit Gilles Villeneuve 100 000 1978 -
Melbourne Cricket Ground 100 000 1853 all-seater
San Isidro Hipódromo de San Isidro
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Old December 20th, 2006, 12:12 AM   #105
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I have a feeling that FIFA will delay awarding brazil the world cup till 2018 and reach some agreement after the bid is presented.
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Old December 20th, 2006, 12:54 AM   #106
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I have a feeling that FIFA will delay awarding brazil the world cup till 2018 and reach some agreement after the bid is presented.

Just asking on a friendly basis Mo Rush whats your theory??? Perhaps Fifa would want to go back to the States?? or have Rio Push towards the summer olympics in 2016???

My Theory is that they are and have been working towards both hosting the 2014 Fifa WC and hosting the Olympics in 2016 or perhaps 2020.

The olympic bid may be dropped if the wc 2014 goes to brazil.

When I look at the stadia mix for Germany 2006 there are renovated stadia that were as old as the 1920's along with new construction of course.

No Stadia was above 73,000 and Maracana fits that. The Stadia for Germany
2006 where between 40,000 to 60,000. Brazil at this time have more Stadia in that capacity and actually larger stadia then germany.

It is of course to have these at fifa standards. Brazil is certainly in building mode over 7 years before the event and that could be a big advantage over COLOMBIA . Renovations to Brazil's older stadia with the capacity may surfice.
With Germany 4 of the 12 venues renovated stadia that were originally built per world war two. 7 of the 12 were built in the 2000's and one lone stadium was originally built in the 1970's . With a recently renovated Maracana in 2002. and three stadia under construction over 7 years ahead of 2014 Brazil has a very good shot considering what south africa is encountering right now.

I was actually surprized that football in germany for the most part was not in stadia of 60,000 plus in a big way.

If Brazil was to host both Fifa WC and the Summer Games in 2014 and 2016 respectively it would be one hell of a coming out party. ONe could very easily lead to the other and be very successful .
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Old December 20th, 2006, 01:12 PM   #107
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If Brazil was to host both Fifa WC and the Summer Games in 2014 and 2016 respectively it would be one hell of a coming out party.
Brazil is gay??
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Old December 20th, 2006, 01:17 PM   #108
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Brazil is gay??


HA HA HA


What I mean is showing to the world it is as good as the rest of the industrialized world.
Considering Brazil is one of the few places to be going oil and gas independ in the next couple of years with such a large population they seem to be a little further thinking then most places. For decades they have been cutting edge for architecture.
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Old December 21st, 2006, 02:30 AM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3SPIRES View Post
If you're going to be like that Brasil is spelt Brazil in English!
but Brazil is spelt Brazil in english.

Colombia is spelt COLOMBIA in english. Spelling ColUmbia in english is wrong...




as for Brazil, around April/May we will already have the final project for the stadium Grêmio hired Amsterdan Arena Advisory to project. It should be similar to Amsterdam Arena or maybe to the Porto Stadium or Benfica Stadium.

Construction should start in end of 2007 and be finished around 2010, 4 years before the World Cup.

If Grêmio does that, several other brazilian clubs may follow and build their own brand new private stadiums. Many clubs in fact always dreamt of a private stadium, but they postponed their dreams since they already played in huge municipal or state stadiums.

Considering that Maracanã supposedly will fit FIFA standarts to World Cup... that the João Havelange stadium also fits FIFA standarts... that Arena da Baixada finishes its 4th side (they are building it now, finally bought the terrain from the school next to them), and that Grêmio builds its stadium, its already 4 stadiums. Inter, which recently beat Barcelona, also intends on reforming their stadium to fit World Cup standarts. They already are reforming, slowly but inexorably... they will start this year the construction of a modern cover similar to the one in the Olympic Stadium of Berlin, to protect the entire audience from the weather.
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 12:06 PM   #110
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2014 Cup a distant dream for Brazil, Colombia

By Brian Homewood

Rio de Janeiro - The last train to Sao Paulo trundled out of Rio de Janeiro's Central station several years ago and it could be an even longer wait for the next one.

While tens of thousands of fans who went to this year's World Cup in Germany were whisked around the country by high-speed trains which streaked through a sleek, modern rail network with clockwork reliabilty, Brazil, candidates to host the 2014 finals, abandoned its passenger trains years ago.

The alternatives are bone-crunching bus and car journeys of hundreds of kilometres over pot-holed highways, some of them stalked by gun-toting bandits, or the uncertainties of a chaotic air transport system.

The last few weeks have seen hundreds of delays and cancellations
Brazilian air transport has been in crisis after the country's worst air crash on September 29 in which 154 people died.

The last few weeks have seen hundreds of delays and cancellations after a work-to-rule by air traffic controllers, who are widely reported to be underpaid, overworked and dependent upon unreliable obsolete equipment.

Yet a good transport network is one of the key criteria for successfully staging a World Cup.

The lack of it is one of the many stumbling blocks facing Brazil and, to a lesser extent, rivals Colombia, the only two nations to formally express their interest to Fifa in staging the 2014 World Cup before the December 18 deadline.

The tournament is due to be staged in South America under Fifa's new rotation system which will begin in South Africa in 2010.

'They know they won't win'
Fifa, however, has already said it will look elsewhere if the South American Confederation cannot produce a bid which meets its rigid criteria.

Until this week, the Brazilian Football Confederation (CBF) believed that it would have a clear shot at the tournament.

Three years ago, the federations of the South American countries voted unanimously to back Brazil as their only candidate.

But the Colombian FA broke ranks this week under pressure from President Alvaro Uribe, who wanted the country to launch its own bid.

The Brazilian media immediately dismissed the Colombian bid.

"They know they won't win, but at the least they will put the country on display," sneered the Rio de Janeiro-based daily newspaper - Globo in an editorial.

In fact, there seems little to choose between the two, apart from Brazil's incomparable tradition on the field and the fact that it has already hosted one World Cup back in 1950.

Both are multi-racial nations of stunning natural beauty whose inhabitants are known to like a good party but where a reputation for violence puts off foreign visitors.

Brazil's security problems are largely urban, highlighted recently when two of the country's top judges were car-jacked by eight armed bandits on the main road from Rio de Janeiro airport to the city centre.

Colombia has seen a sharp drop in urban crime in four years under President Uribe but parts of the countryside are still controlled by guerilla groups, who have fuelled a 42-year civil conflict.

Both countries' previous attempts to host the event ended in embarrasing and early withdrawals.

Colombia were awarded the 1986 World Cup but pulled out two years before it was due to be staged because of economic problems. The tournament was instead held in Mexico.

Brazil were candidates to stage the 2006 World Cup but withdrew three days before the final vote decided in Germany's favour in July 2000.

The campaign never captured the public's imagination and attracted vociferous opposition from Pele, who described it as a waste of money.

Colombia and Brazil would have to invest lavishly in new stadiums. The Metropolitano stadium in Barranquilla is the only Colombian arena which comes near to World Cup level while Curitiba's Arena da Baixada is the only Brazilian stadium which would have any chance of passing the test today.

The world famous Maracana, like many of the gigantic stadiums built around Brazil between 1950 and 1980, is now crumbling and many believe it should be pulled down.

Both countries are confident they can drum up the necessary investments but neither has yet to announce concrete plans about how they intend to bring their infrastructure upto scratch.

So far, the respective discourses have been limited to words of optimism.

"We can do it, we can provide the necessary investments and the country has to start thinking about big projects," Colombia Vice-President Francisco Santos said this week. "Countries need to have dreams, they need great achievements."

Brazil President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva was similarly upbeat.

"Football is the greatest passion in the country and it deserves to host the World Cup," he said recently.

"I will give all the backing necessary to (CBF president) Ricardo Teixeira so that, 64 years on, we can hold the World Cup in Brazil."

Reuters

Published on the Web by IOL on 2006-12-22 06:55:36
© Independent Online 2005. All rights reserved. IOL publishes this article in good faith but is not liable for any loss or damage caused by reliance on the information it contains.
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 08:57 PM   #111
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Any replies/answers from Brazilian or Colombian members? The source is Reuters so you would think it is reliable.

Quote:
Brazil, candidates to host the 2014 finals, abandoned its passenger trains years ago.
I can't believe a WC can go to a country which doesn't have a rail network in place.
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 10:19 PM   #112
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Any replies/answers from Brazilian or Colombian members? The source is Reuters so you would think it is reliable.



I can't believe a WC can go to a country which doesn't have a rail network in place.
Even though the U.S. does have a rail network it is slow enough and the distances were great enough that I doubt many people used it. South Africa's network leaves a lot to be desired. As long as there are good enoough bus/air routes I would think that should be good enough especially when talking about large countries such as the U.S., China, or Brasil.
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 10:33 PM   #113
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But at least the US, China and S. Sfrica do have a rail network to fall back on. From the sounds of it Brazil does not.

The next question is what condition is Brazils road's like? I know Germany 2006 spent a fortune on road improvements prior to the 2006 WC. and I bet they were of a better standard then Brazils roads are (I'm guessing). So will they budget a small fortune on these improvements along with the stadiums?
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Old December 22nd, 2006, 11:41 PM   #114
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Quote:
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But at least the US, China and S. Sfrica do have a rail network to fall back on. From the sounds of it Brazil does not.

The next question is what condition is Brazils road's like? I know Germany 2006 spent a fortune on road improvements prior to the 2006 WC. and I bet they were of a better standard then Brazils roads are (I'm guessing). So will they budget a small fortune on these improvements along with the stadiums?
I think thats a huge issue!

Our roads are not good enough, the best ones are in São Paulo.
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Old December 23rd, 2006, 01:47 AM   #115
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I think that given the state of the infrastructure in each country that the more influencial members may opt for a situation where the distances between venues are not that great. Anyone with a cursory knowledge of geography would know what that would mean.

Yet, both are very much doable. It's a question of creativity, will, transparency and a solid commitment to attract new investments.
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Old December 23rd, 2006, 01:54 AM   #116
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I think that given the state of the infrastructure in each country that the more influencial members may opt for a situation where the distances between venues are not that great. Anyone with a cursory knowledge of geography would know what that would mean.

Yet, both are very much doable. It's a question of creativity, will, transparency and a solid commitment to attract new investments.
Yes, I agree!

There are plans of 2 high speed train lines in Brazil.

One linking Rio and São Paulo, and another one linking São Paulo and Campinas (a 1 million ppl city in São Paulo state).

If Brazil hosts the cup, Im sure that more projects will come!
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Old December 23rd, 2006, 05:43 AM   #117
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But at least the US, China and S. Sfrica do have a rail network to fall back on. From the sounds of it Brazil does not.
Ever taken a train in the US?

The Seatle-LA train is always 15-20 hours late. Im not talking once in awhile, Im saying ALWAYS 15-20 hours late. You cant even buy a ticket for part of the journey, since the train is never on time (such as San Fran to LA)

New York to Chicago is a cool 17 hour ride.

People in the US fly, as in Brazil. A rail network is not required
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Old December 23rd, 2006, 06:01 AM   #118
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I think thats a huge issue!

Our roads are not good enough, the best ones are in São Paulo.
What is the main road from Rio to Petrópolis? On my visit to Brasil we drove in a bad rain storm at night with crazy buses and trucks leaving no room to spare. I was worried I was going to fall right off the dark cliffs.
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Old December 23rd, 2006, 02:22 PM   #119
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I know Germany 2006 spent a fortune on road improvements prior to the 2006 WC.
I thought that pretty much everything about Germany was spot on with the exception of the roads... During the finals there was still a hell of a lot of roadworks going on, and many of the freeways were doing to 1 1/2 lanes and a bit of shoulder (scary when the inside lane is filled with trucks and everyone is trying to do 150mph in the remaining few feet!).

Saw some monster tailbacks (luckilly they were usually in the opposite direction to what we were travelling).
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Old December 23rd, 2006, 06:22 PM   #120
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To me the debate about transportation infrastructure with regards to the Fifa world cup may be important to Fifa but you are not going to get a train system in any of the americas as good as europe or asia. I dont know what the case is in south africa but the distances and population density in canada would have the world cup in a much worse situation then brazil . winnepeg to toronto is a journey I would not want to take by train as far as the length.


In north america you have two highspeed corridors for rail traffic.
washington to boston and windsor to quebec city. High speed is a relative term compared to europe with the TVG and Eurostar trains.

If Fifa is sincere about football in the americas they have to adapt to the infrastructure that is in brazil , columbia and the rest of the americas. It is not to say bring your standards down so low it is to say your standards may be a little high for the americas to reach.

The thing is they either want to expand out of europe and hold on to interest in south america or they dont . It is as simple as that.

Some I think that south afirca could probably use the rate or construction for stadiums Brazil is on and Brazil could probably use South Africas rail system now in this quest to hos the world cup.

That is no slap to south africa MO rush. Brazil Certainly doesnt have everything in place stadium wise but they are certainly moving forward.

As to Maracana falling apart. I was actually there last november and It is not as bad as one would have a editorialist lead you to believe. in 2002 they completed a renovation there and I am sure they would renovate again for the world cup.
Considering the ammount of pre world war 2 stadia in germany for the world cup in 2006 brazil is not in that type of situation .

It is the will of Fifa to take apples for apple and oranges for oranges. Then they will have to restrict the hosting duties to europe and asia because coming to africa, south america and north america are really a compromise compared to germany, france ,italy , great britian , south korea, japan and in the near future china.

To me how can you call it a world championship for a game played globally when you cant you past your european nose paying lip service along the way.

There has to be compromise on both sides or the game become meaningless in the americas. At least the Fifa Brand of the Game.
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