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Old August 5th, 2007, 12:43 AM   #81
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No we don't.
yes we do
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Old August 5th, 2007, 04:40 AM   #82
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why?
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Old August 5th, 2007, 05:12 AM   #83
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Toyota Park: Home of the Chicago Fire:



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Old August 5th, 2007, 05:24 AM   #84
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After seeing a game in Hamburg, having a terrace full of supporters is definately a cool thing. But that was a Bundesliga game with an HSV crowd of 50,000. Here in the MLS most teams would have half empty terraces at this point. Toronto could put a small terrace in the open end, but I can't think of anywhere else that would really benefit from terracing. As for roofs, high translucent roofs would be beneficial for many stadiums, but they aren't super cheap and not really necessary for most clubs now.
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Old August 5th, 2007, 09:46 AM   #85
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I've heard that Toronto is already looking to expand BMO Field. BMO Field just opened this year, but demand has far outstripped what studies indicated was needed. Toronto FC games are sold out the entire season. It wouldn't surprise me if Toronto FC could sustain a stadium with a capacity of 40,000. At this size, it would be great to be able to watch an Argonauts game there as well.
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Old August 5th, 2007, 10:53 AM   #86
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I can't see standing being embraced particularly fondly in America. Maybe to some extent in the expat communities but even then I doubt it.
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Old August 5th, 2007, 04:21 PM   #87
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Some college basketball teams are starting to add standing areas for the extra hard core students. Which I would like to see more of especially considering many student sections don't sit down during games (even at many mid-major programs sitting down is for half-time and maybe non-conference), and demand at a lot of schools outstrips ticket supply.
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Old August 5th, 2007, 04:56 PM   #88
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I've heard that Toronto is already looking to expand BMO Field. BMO Field just opened this year, but demand has far outstripped what studies indicated was needed. Toronto FC games are sold out the entire season. It wouldn't surprise me if Toronto FC could sustain a stadium with a capacity of 40,000. At this size, it would be great to be able to watch an Argonauts game there as well.
Three reasons why this will never happen:

1. It's called a Soccer-Specific-Stadium for a reason.

2. It is the National Soccer Stadium so CFL or any sport probably won't be allowed.

3. The Canadian Football field is too big to fit in BMO Field.
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Old August 8th, 2007, 02:12 AM   #89
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Choco:

I realize that it is soccer-specific, but does it mean that they will turn down other sports without any consideration? Won't it hinge on how much cash it generates, how little disruption there is to the main tenant, and how many times the facility is being used. I realize that Toronto FC comes first.

You are probably right about the Canadian Football field being too big. It is narrower, but about 15 yards longer than a soccer pitch. You may be right about the likelihood of the Argonauts ever playing there. It's too bad, that team desperately needs a better venue. The oldest gridiron team in the world deserves better.
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Old August 8th, 2007, 03:58 AM   #90
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I can't see standing being embraced particularly fondly in America. Maybe to some extent in the expat communities but even then I doubt it.
At many universities its tradition for students to stand throughout the game.
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Old August 8th, 2007, 05:57 AM   #91
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A significant portion of Toronto FC fans stand. It's only the traditional Canadian sports fan who is more interested in their hot dog than supporting the team, who find standing bizarre. They might as well watch from home as far as I'm concerned.

My eyes glaze over just glancing at them.
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Old August 9th, 2007, 06:08 AM   #92
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Three reasons why this will never happen:

1. It's called a Soccer-Specific-Stadium for a reason.

2. It is the National Soccer Stadium so CFL or any sport probably won't be allowed.

3. The Canadian Football field is too big to fit in BMO Field.
The Canadian national rugby team is going to use it too
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Old August 9th, 2007, 09:33 AM   #93
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Seattle Expansion?

Cheeky article about the strong possibility of an expansion team in Seattle.

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/st...451128&cc=5901


It says they will "start out at Qwest field", so maybe that means they would eventually hope for their own soccer specific stadium?

Qwest field:


I've mentioned it a few times on the Seattle thread that there is also Memorial Stadium in the Seattle Center which is where the Sounders of the old NASL used to play, and where the USL Sounders played briefly until they moved to Qwest field as well. It holds 17,000 people, which wouldn't be bad for a soccer specific stadium, but only has field dimensions for American Football.

Memorial Stadium:
http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium...memorial.shtml
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Old August 9th, 2007, 10:46 PM   #94
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I can't see standing being embraced particularly fondly in America. Maybe to some extent in the expat communities but even then I doubt it.
Why would you say that? Here in Buffalo we spend more time standing then sitting for Bills games, same goes for many NFL teams. Our old NHL arena had lots of standing room only seats, most college football and basketball stadiums do.

Is it just your own ignorance in assuming Americans are fat and lazy?
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Old August 10th, 2007, 12:42 AM   #95
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Why would you say that? Here in Buffalo we spend more time standing then sitting for Bills games, same goes for many NFL teams. Our old NHL arena had lots of standing room only seats, most college football and basketball stadiums do.

Is it just your own ignorance in assuming Americans are fat and lazy?
While the older teams have fans like that, a lot of NFL teams have made it so their hardcore fans (the ones who see the game as a sporting event and not an entertainment event) can't attend a game anymore by jacking up ticket prices so high. So you do see a lot of the "sitting on hands" attitude at NFL games. Buffalo, Green Bay, Chicago, Cleveland, Pittsburgh and Philadelphia are exceptions.

At college games (in all sports) they do stand for the duration though.
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Old August 10th, 2007, 12:46 AM   #96
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Is it just your own ignorance in assuming Americans are fat and lazy?
I think your response to his comment is abit of a stretch. Besides, Americans are not lazy.

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Old August 12th, 2007, 10:09 AM   #97
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Quote:
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Why would you say that? Here in Buffalo we spend more time standing then sitting for Bills games, same goes for many NFL teams. Our old NHL arena had lots of standing room only seats, most college football and basketball stadiums do.

Is it just your own ignorance in assuming Americans are fat and lazy?
Yes, it's partly due to the stereotype. Whether you like it or not, all stereotypes are rooted in some essential truth. The chief reason they become inaccurate is when they become dated - when the reality changes but the image remains.

I'd like to think it's more of a considered position than being arrived at by pure ignorance. I wasn't aware of (but I'm not surprised by) the stronger tendency for standing in college sport, but as we can all agree, this is a sector of the sports market where the fans are generally acknowledged to be more vociferous and motivated.

I was also sure that certain sections of the 'mainstream' sports fans (NFL/MLB/NBA) will have their cases which do not conform to the stereotype. You have to ask though if this is proof that my contention is fundamentally wrong as a result of these examples or if they are merely exceptions that prove the rule?

I am grateful to those who have already voiced their opinions that on balance seem to agree that US sport has more than its fair share of under-committed fans. Let's not make this personal, though. The same has been true, although thankfully to a far lesser extent, at my team (Manchester United) for many years - well before the arrival of the Glazers. I am well aware of both the benefits and the dangers of upscaling the team's support.

Also, you have to be careful here in your haste to imply that I am some sort of anti-American - you wouldn't be more wrong.

The point was specifically about the MLS, not wider American sport. While to some extent their two characteristics will overlap, the nature of soccer [sic] as a sport looking to breakthrough into the mainstream means that the teams' evolving identities is more disposed to the 'entertainment' fan. Even after 13 years, teams are only just beginning to acquire a history - something for the 'genuine' fan to feel part of, even proud of. The ever-present need for commercialism (like the transition of the NY/NJ MetroStars to the NY Red Bulls) hardly helps this 'fan' culture but is to be expected in a developing sport in the super-competitive US sports market.

This is precisely why it can be surmised that MLS franchises must get their fans where they can, whatever one thinks of their merits as fans. Of course, it doesn't rule out the possibility of attracting a hardcore fan culture, but I'm just saying that it makes the probability more remote. As many have also said, it also counts that those fans seen as less 'genuine' also tend to be the most profitable. As Al Gore may say, this is an inconvenient truth.

The biggest unknown quantity (to me) is the influence and characteristics of the ex-pat support, where it could be argued that the culture is closer to the hardcore than the corporate type of fan. That's why I felt it was worth mentioning.

I'd love to see the MLS with a large and vibrant fanbase. If that happens, it may be concluded that the sport has finally 'broken through' and this may be what's required for the sport to dislodge one of the three mainstream sports. As most people would agree though, the chances of this happening are very small.

The one thing I would say that on reflection was wrong was a presumption that 'standing' equated to the old-fashioned 'British' terrace model (in which the location of the spectator is/was basically a free-for-all), where I'm sure that where it does happen the the US, it more closely resembles the more organised German model, where positions are identified and notified in the same way that seating locations are. Even so, I wait to be convinced that it is right for the market. Arguably of greater equivalence is the provision of 'beachers' seating.

Of course, you can disagree with this position but please don't accuse me of not having commented without giving the subject any consideration or reasoning.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 11:27 PM   #98
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Im late to this thread, but whats the point of standing during a game?
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Old August 14th, 2007, 04:27 PM   #99
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Personally, I like peace and quiet during a soccer game. Relaxing back in a seat in a half empty section, just watching the action. Not just because I'm too lazy to stand up and scream and wave flags the entire game, it's just the environment that I feel fits the game here. Not a knock on the sport in any way.

The MLS is not some superpower Euro league. Until it is, and can compete with the world, I don't think it makes sense for fans to try and imitate the rowdy crowds of other places. Not to say that no one should cheer and be festive, but I don't want stadiums built arround terracing and the idea of going crazy.
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Old August 14th, 2007, 11:53 PM   #100
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I think these rowdy types would get annoying. I am spending good money to go to a game. I dont feel like having to stand up and scream endlessly because some loud punk kids in front of me are doing it all game.

I also like to sit in the nosebleeds during a baseball game. Less cramped and more relaxing.
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