Huntingdon Industrial Estate redevelopment | Shoreditch | 10 fl | Pre-planning - SkyscraperCity
 

forums map | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > European Forums > UK & Ireland Architecture Forums > Projects and Construction > London Metro Area

London Metro Area London Calling...


Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old February 18th, 2013, 09:27 AM   #1
DarJoLe
Registered User
 
DarJoLe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London
Posts: 21,433
Likes (Received): 10508

Huntingdon Industrial Estate redevelopment | Shoreditch | 10 fl | Pre-planning

New plans for Shoreditch tower unveiled
18 February 2013 | By Andrea Klettner

Robin Partington has unveiled his design for a 14-storey building on a prominent site in Shoreditch, east London.


Tower at dusk

Partington’s scheme is a ‘warehouse-style’ development including retail units on the ground floor and a mix of affordable and private housing. The building, which will have a brick facade, steps up from Bethnal Green Road. It will be built to Code for Sustainable Homes level 4.

The mixed-use scheme for developer Londonewcastle replaces a 25-storey tower drawn up by Amanda Levete, which was dropped following a lack of support from the local authority.

Taken from Amanda Levete ousted on Shoreditch tower, 15 November 2012:
Now Partington has been brought on board to come up with a smaller scheme which the developer says is “more of a kind of modern warehouse”. “We initially went to Partington for a bulking and massing exercise and then felt we had the beginnings of an exciting building,” said a spokesman for Londonewcastle. He admitted that Partington was not hired for his “signature architecture” but rather his ability to realise the developer’s ambitions. “The facade of the building will be brick-led and definitely won’t be as tall as the last one,” he added.


Street view

Meanwhile, Peter Barber Architects has revised its plans for the nearby Fleet Street Hill site. As well as affordable housing the development now includes homes for private sale, commercial units and spaces for start-ups.

A planning application is due to be submitted later this year.
__________________

Officer Dibble liked this post

Last edited by DarJoLe; February 18th, 2013 at 09:37 AM.
DarJoLe no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old February 18th, 2013, 09:31 AM   #2
DarJoLe
Registered User
 
DarJoLe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London
Posts: 21,433
Likes (Received): 10508

The superior previous proposal, by Amanda Levete, declared 'alien' and 'did not preserve or enhance the character and setting of the Redchurch Street Conservation Area', 'can’t take it seriously', 'significantly too high' and that there was 'no further need for landmark architecture in this locality'. The locals galvanised a campaign to 'Ditch The Block' attracting more than 1,000 letters from residents when they were submitted for planning in March, the majority in opposition.









__________________

Officer Dibble, Union Man liked this post

Last edited by DarJoLe; February 18th, 2013 at 09:40 AM.
DarJoLe no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 18th, 2013, 11:05 AM   #3
.Adam
Registered User
 
.Adam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: London
Posts: 3,137
Likes (Received): 894

Such a shame the original design was dropped, I can see a lot of new developments here copying the 'meat packing district' style of warehouses with restaurants below.
.Adam no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old February 18th, 2013, 12:30 PM   #4
i_like_concrete
cockney sparrow
 
i_like_concrete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: London
Posts: 4,444
Likes (Received): 187

The new proposal is alright, but completely at odds with the new identity of Shoreditch. Why try and make a sop to what the area once was? It's not industrial anymore, it's creative, so why is the architecture not allowed to follow suit?
i_like_concrete no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 18th, 2013, 03:26 PM   #5
El_Greco
Épater la Bourgeoisie
 
El_Greco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: London/Taipei
Posts: 19,520
Likes (Received): 10353

Unexciting, dull and over-bearing.
__________________
My Travels : Barcelona|Edinburgh|Glasgow|London|Madrid|New York|Paris|Taipei|Vilnius

Last edited by El_Greco; February 18th, 2013 at 03:37 PM.
El_Greco no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 18th, 2013, 08:11 PM   #6
martinohsk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 167
Likes (Received): 228

Much of the appeal of Shoreditch lies in the fact that the creative industries and nightlife for which it is now famous developed and thrived within the erstwhile warehouses and tenement buildings that fill the area. That's what gives it its unique character.

I think the description of the Amanda Levete design as 'alien' is entirely appropriate. In my opinion it's attention-seeking and much too futuristic for the location. One only has to look at the second image in DarJoLe's post to imagine that it's simply been parachuted into the neighbourhood. I would like to see this type of iconic/signature building confined to the other side of Bishopsgate/Great Eastern St.

On the other hand I really like the new design. Some may find it unexciting but I think it has distinction and understated class. For really bland unexciting designs I would suggest the new residential developments around Aldgate are far more deserving of criticism.
martinohsk no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 18th, 2013, 08:25 PM   #7
DarJoLe
Registered User
 
DarJoLe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London
Posts: 21,433
Likes (Received): 10508

I'm not sure what the major difference is between this side and other side of Bishopsgate/Great Eastern St that warrants blandification on this one and not on the other. Too futuristic for its location? How is that even a negative?

Apart from the setbacks and the obvious one level roof terraced apartments this is just another atypical London vernacular brick residential that are being littered across London. It's not anything bold or standout, but then if that's the brief who is to argue. An obvious product of a developer buckling confidence and backing down to the level of the local NIMBYs. If you have the balls to propose an Amanda Levete tower in the first place don't lose them when the going gets tough.
DarJoLe no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 19th, 2013, 06:50 AM   #8
martinohsk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 167
Likes (Received): 228

Well because it's not in harmony with its surroundings, which already has a fairly well-defined identity. The area to the west of Bishopsgate/Great Eastern St on the other hand is largely made up of low-grade non-descript office buildings and provides a blank canvas which together with the pipeline developments such as Principal Place and The Stage would more readily (both physically and aesthetically) join the City cluster.

I'm not advocating blandness in Shoreditch, just designs that don't shout out so much for attention and are more in keeping with the surroundings. The Amanda Levete tower is innovative and exciting, but I agree with the person who said, possibly in another forum, that it would be better somewhere like the Oxford St/TCR corner.

Last edited by martinohsk; February 19th, 2013 at 06:57 AM.
martinohsk no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 19th, 2013, 11:04 AM   #9
i_like_concrete
cockney sparrow
 
i_like_concrete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: London
Posts: 4,444
Likes (Received): 187

Quote:
Originally Posted by martinohsk View Post
Much of the appeal of Shoreditch lies in the fact that the creative industries and nightlife for which it is now famous developed and thrived within the erstwhile warehouses and tenement buildings that fill the area. That's what gives it its unique character.
It is not particularly unique to see former industrial areas used as hubs of creativity, it continues to happen elsewhere in East London and in other cities. The big difference now though, is that whilst the industrial aesthetic was a main part in the evolution of these hubs, what mattered more was the low cost, central location and huge spaces available for aspiring artists and other creatives. Shoreditch is now prohibitively expensive for those starting out, that scene has moved to areas like Hackney wick and Bow, and the future of the area is no longer about the use of cheap former industrial space, it's about catering to the needs of an international creative market, the people who consume art and culture, not those who produce it (witness the boom in high end brands moving into the area).

To compete with areas around the world Shoreditch can't become conservative, that is the antithesis of what has made it what it is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by martinohsk View Post
Well because it's not in harmony with its surroundings, which already has a fairly well-defined identity. The area to the west of Bishopsgate/Great Eastern St on the other hand is largely made up of low-grade non-descript office buildings and provides a blank canvas which together with the pipeline developments such as Principal Place and The Stage would more readily (both physically and aesthetically) join the City cluster.
The building this is replacing is a non-descript low end warehouse.

Shoreditch has never been a particularly harmonious environment, sited where it is it has always been a clash of cultures, a clash of ideas, a clash of buildings and uses. The Levete design celebrated that, played on it and made a bold statement about what the area has become, it was honest, it wasn't pandering to what conservative minded people wish the area still was or had become instead.

Quote:
I'm not advocating blandness in Shoreditch, just designs that don't shout out so much for attention and are more in keeping with the surroundings. The Amanda Levete tower is innovative and exciting, but I agree with the person who said, possibly in another forum, that it would be better somewhere like the Oxford St/TCR corner.
Everything about Shoreditch shouts out for attention! Have you ever been in any of the galleries? Gone to any of the bars? Talked to any of the people? The identity of that area is one of attention grabbing in your face-ness.
__________________

DodgyEye liked this post
i_like_concrete no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 19th, 2013, 04:59 PM   #10
potto
Registered User
 
potto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London
Posts: 18,600
Likes (Received): 12128

uh gentrification = home owner conservatism.

I have no idea why they seem to get the final say in such a mixed bustling areas that thrives on visitors and change.

They got their conservation zone!
potto no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 19th, 2013, 08:27 PM   #11
SkyScraperRaper
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,065
Likes (Received): 135

I don't get it. An interesting, creative, eye catching design like this is not accepted but other bland, harsh, tower blocks on stilts are being built here, there and everywhere.

This building would fit in fine in Shoreditch, Shoreditch needs sprucing up.
SkyScraperRaper no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 19th, 2013, 08:59 PM   #12
bioshock
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 112
Likes (Received): 3

If nothing else the render for the brick building gives a much more honest representation of a finished product. In my opinion the tower proposal would not look half as good without the impossible perspective, seemingly glowingly gemstone materials and extremely rare lighting conditions that so many renders present these days.
bioshock no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 19th, 2013, 09:53 PM   #13
spindrift
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,826
Likes (Received): 747

There was a hell of a lot of local opposition to the original plan, a lot of properties would have been deprived of light.
spindrift está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old February 20th, 2013, 12:49 PM   #14
potto
Registered User
 
potto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London
Posts: 18,600
Likes (Received): 12128

Maybe they should have waited before submitting...

http://lawcommission.justice.gov.uk/...s-to-light.htm

The project

Quote:
This project investigates whether the law by which rights to light are acquired and enforced provides an appropriate balance between the important interests of landowners and the need to facilitate the appropriate development of land. It considers the interrelationship of rights to light with the planning system, and examines whether the remedies available to the courts are reasonable, sufficient and proportionate.
potto no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 20th, 2013, 01:12 PM   #15
ill tonkso
Portsmouths Finest, Maybe
 
ill tonkso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: St. Neots
Posts: 16,907
Likes (Received): 2541

I like what is being built. It looks solid and maintains that classic 'wedding cake' stepped look. It also provides a lot of roof garden space on different levels, which should look quite dynamic.
ill tonkso no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 20th, 2013, 09:35 PM   #16
delores
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,594
Likes (Received): 811

I like it too, it works well with the area which needs more of this density and style of architecture. I like Amanda Levete's work but for me she is all about objects and icon's.
delores está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old February 21st, 2013, 12:00 AM   #17
TheLimboKing
Registered User
 
TheLimboKing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 123
Likes (Received): 44



ditto...why does everything have to be so showy...this isn't Dubai, it's east London. Let us work with the context, not just put two fingers up to it. That Levete tower, though I will say a very talented architect, would never look like that in real life. I agree with it looking "alien".

The proposal isn't the most amazing thing I've ever seen but I still like it.
TheLimboKing no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 21st, 2013, 12:09 AM   #18
DarJoLe
Registered User
 
DarJoLe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London
Posts: 21,433
Likes (Received): 10508

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLimboKing View Post
ditto...why does everything have to be so showy...this isn't Dubai, it's east London. Let us work with the context, not just put two fingers up to it.
Hang on a minute here, would that thinking apply to the historical central core of the City before, say, Lloyds, or the Gherkin, were built? Working with the context is exactly what the post-modernism rash of the 1980s resulted in, and it was only the pioneers and break-outs of that era that really sustained any longevity.

'Working with the context'; the context of what? That this is a former industrial area full of warehouses therefore buildings should be industrial warehouse style, or that the current area is now a hotbed of creativity, pioneering agencies and youthful trend setting, therefore its buildings should be a product of that? When we talk about the 'context' of an area, why is it assumed we only mean the architectural context? Why isn't the notion of changing use and demographics of an area taken into account when deciding preference for building aesthetics? Why not look beyond simply the structure and its suitability against its neighbours and consider the wider picture of what this area is intending to become and what message this back tracking on a proposal sends out to the wider architectural and global community about a pioneering and imaginative design by a new upcoming architect in the heart of creative London.
__________________

.Adam liked this post

Last edited by DarJoLe; February 21st, 2013 at 12:56 AM.
DarJoLe no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 21st, 2013, 10:29 AM   #19
TheLimboKing
Registered User
 
TheLimboKing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 123
Likes (Received): 44

By context I most certainly mean more than the architectural. I always consider social, historical, and economic context when looking at buildings suitability. The absolute thing I detest is trend-setting architecture, just what the mindset of this area is all about. Look down the road at Fashion St by Buckley Gray Yeoman, a building that pays homage to the East End's industrial past but is still contemporary and striking, a reflection of the area today, not just a bunch of trend setting, “cool” architecture.




As for the City, I would argue that Lloyds works considerably better than the Gherkin from a context point of view as it’s footprint and ground level treatment fits into the uneven medieval pattern of the are It feels like a piece of the city. The Gherkin seems just plonked into the space, with nothing interrupting its immediate surroundings. However nice the Gherkin is, it does not site true to the City’s landscape.


That’s what I merely meant, and I think the same holds true with Levete’s Tower.



...I just realised who Amanda Levete actually is, of Future Systems, hardly up and coming. This does honestly explains a lot. Surprise that I was a big fan of their work.

Last edited by TheLimboKing; February 21st, 2013 at 10:37 AM.
TheLimboKing no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 21st, 2013, 03:36 PM   #20
potto
Registered User
 
potto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: London
Posts: 18,600
Likes (Received): 12128

Aren’t you merely falling into the same trap as the local Nimby group? You show me a juxtaposition and talk about context and Levete shows a juxtaposition and the complaints roll in. Guess which one is taller?

Then you talk of architectural quality with a photo example of a very individual set piece that you admire that seems to have some personality, then surely the individual expression seen with the Levete’s Tower is of more value than the commercial architecture now seen all over London expressed in the new proposal?

What if we stuck the Levete tower part on top of the first 2 levels of the new proposals? Would the small niche rebellion then somehow be contained?

The issue of “context” here is so blown out of proportion it is ridiculous and absurd. The far larger and more real issue is that the corrupt bureaucracy has purposefully ruined the progress of an interesting British architect going it alone and swapped it gleefully for a far more commercial affair.

The complaints about the Levete’s Tower are nothing to do with streetscape and certainly not to do with architectural quality. The plot is no different to the current design or even the existing building, both are equal to the space they take and both follow the same street pattern.

The complaints are purely yet again based on irrational perceptions of height and the self importance of the home owner who think they are guardians of the marketing blurb that they bought into. This local Nimby group is well known to be particularly adverse to vertigo from their actions against previous and future proposals around here and have influence in the media and with the planning dept far greater than the normal consultation process would find which a small non-corporate architectural firm with an interesting personal signature was not able to stand up to. This is not democracy or even a vaguely valuable intervention for London or the UK architectural scene.

The only campaign of theirs that made any sense and had intrinsic value was saving the physically real and widely used Light bar from demolition. This will now soon be joined in an exciting juxtaposition with the city cluster expansion rather than its dismal wrong-end-of-the-street current situation. Yet they are still not happy! I guess they need something to do now the instantly marketable term ‘conservation area’ has consumed vast swathes of the area! It is just like the desperation for continued purpose found in the self-interested Bermondsey Action Group blabbing on about non-issues such as context over bits of dilapidated land of no value to anyone.

The height hysteria is rendered even more illogical seeing as there is a taller building literally across the road that is instantly forgettable and the whole Bishopsgate goods yard next door will be a far taller cluster, with a few more far taller towers appearing down the road around the Light bar. None of which are likely to have the personality of the Levete’s Tower because they will be designed by much larger firms.

Why not consider the height to be merely a function of the contemporary needs of our city, just as the warehouses were before and value the expression of the architect as in the building you posted the photo of? Why is it just considered some aloof alien concept of an individual architect or the evil forces of capitalism when the only people against it have one eye on increasing the value of their own property?

Now fast forward 5 years the Levete’s Tower would merely form part of a step down from the enlarged City cluster. Not so alien or wildly out of context now.

It is this vibrant context of use that actually draws people here and has made it what it is and what the current home owners reap financial benefit from, the aesthetic context merely provides a supporting role, at one time being semi-derelict and cheap, you could argue the soviet era architecture of Berlin does the same there, the Soviet and Victorian both now adding a charm to the practicality and luckily for the estate agents a marketable value added extra.

It is ridiculous to suggest that this overall feel is somehow singularly put in danger by the Levete tower.

I would go further and put it that the Levete’s Tower would have no actual impact on the perceived aesthetic context of the area whatsoever because the skyline is not actually part of the areas intrinsic character and is certainly not memorable. How many stories is the Tea Building and how many stories is the Tesco garage or the large Crown Plaze Shorditich? The Levete’s Tower can only add an exciting moment of visual interest and juxtaposition, a backdrop to the existing urban grain which would be transient as you explored the area further.

It could be considered that it would become a landmark due to its height and style, maybe even become a signature of the architect but I’m not convinced by the term iconic here, that would require extra cultural value that is difficult to predict. Anyway nothing wrong with a local landmark even if it is solely for orientation purposes or ends up in a childs drawing at school, certainly an odd thing to define as a negative or that a city must somehow be kept to an imaginary strict quota of landmarks and icons, when in reality it is just the whims and fancies of the people that dictate this accolade.

There needs to be a space in a city for experimentation and expression, which is ironic because that is exactly what drove the success of this area after it was forgotten! Where do we allow our architects to express themselves outside of the heavily commercial areas with their restricted pallete?

Do we restrict this to the confined financial centre as you suggest with your example of the gherkin? This would be a disaster for British architecture just as the ill-judged “intervention” from Prince Charles was just a couple of decades ago. If we don’t help our architects then they will just go abroad to work or disappear into the depths of larger firms and as happened too many times the UK will be an architectural backwater full of second rate interpretations and no personality.
__________________

DarJoLe, randolph liked this post

Last edited by potto; February 21st, 2013 at 05:22 PM.
potto no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion | NSW | Skyscraper Guide / Lists / Diagrams / Models / Photos CULWULLA New South Wales 1605 July 18th, 2019 05:08 AM
Edinburgh | Development Summary 2018 Kenspeckle Edinburgh 10 May 4th, 2018 02:08 PM
DEVELOPMENT SUMMARY - Sunderland and Durham Forum PROJECTS Listing Newcastle Historian Sunderland and Durham 0 March 2nd, 2010 03:41 PM
DEVELOPMENT SUMMARY - Newcastle Metro Area Forum: Projects Listing newcastlepubs Newcastle Metro Area 0 February 7th, 2010 06:32 PM
DEVELOPMENT SUMMARY - Teesside Forum PROJECTS Listing Newcastle Historian Teesside 0 October 14th, 2009 09:54 PM


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:41 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us