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Old June 26th, 2017, 01:48 PM   #261
5portsF4n
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My UK bid 12 venues

Celtic Park
St James Park
Elland Road renovated
Old Trafford
New Everton stadium
Villa Park
Hillsborough renovated
Wembley Stadium
New White Hart Lane
St marys expanded
Principality stadium
King power expanded
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Old June 26th, 2017, 02:08 PM   #262
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not really. by same merits bernabeu and camp nou would have no chance either.
this rules might have an impact for few stadiums, anfield for an example. but there are enough of them where a lot can be done

this way or another, world cup will come to europe in 2030, and from todays point of view england runs the table, and brexit, no matter how bad/good, has absolutely nothing to do with the world cup.
On Bernabeu you're right, but have you ever been to Camp Nou? They already have the two-step ticket check that is in place at this year's Confederations Cup. First you enter the area around the stadium through turnstiles, where the sponsor tents etc. would be for the world cup. Then you enter the stadium itself through another row of turnstiles.

However, the urban setting of most other Spanish stadiums is similar to England. Many of them are located in the middle of neigbourhoods without a lot of room around. So I don't think that will be the decisive factor in determining 2030's host.
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Old June 26th, 2017, 02:48 PM   #263
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Originally Posted by Rover030 View Post
On Bernabeu you're right, but have you ever been to Camp Nou? They already have the two-step ticket check that is in place at this year's Confederations Cup. First you enter the area around the stadium through turnstiles, where the sponsor tents etc. would be for the world cup. Then you enter the stadium itself through another row of turnstiles.

However, the urban setting of most other Spanish stadiums is similar to England. Many of them are located in the middle of neigbourhoods without a lot of room around. So I don't think that will be the decisive factor in determining 2030's host.
last time in 2012 (might have been 2013) for celtic game. I do not know what big could change there, there is some space around but it is still in the urban area that can't be compared to stadiums with parking lots etc
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Old June 26th, 2017, 06:03 PM   #264
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So when I point out it's not true FIFA had security concerns about England the goalposts are moved and we get onto vague hypotheticals about people in front of panels and the example of a stadium which has had 15 million people through its turnstiles with no issues. Somehow, I'm not feeling worried! We can pretty much do that for any country if that's where the bar is being set. A good number of LA's proposed Olympic venues have a similar urbanity.

None of what anyone has said makes the statement that England won't ever host again any less silly. If we're ruling out England we can pretty much rule out anywhere that doesn't choose to surround its stadiums with acres of car parks. If we actually reach that point - and we haven't, the city centre Millennium Stadium in Cardiff hosted the Champions League Final only last month - then the terrorists will have won.
C'mon Rob, that's two separate posts. I agree that the UK is likely to host major events in the future. But it will be because they keep on modernizing not because they stay exactly the same.

I just said that when you are talking about an event 13 years in the future it's hard to speak definitively about the security status of the venue. Of course, this applies to any country where there are significant security issues. Paris is spending hundreds of millions on changes at the Eiffel Tower (where some Olympic events will be staged) and as noted in another post Camp Nou seems to have very modern standards. Other facilities may require large enough changes that it is better to find alternative facilities.
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Old June 26th, 2017, 08:02 PM   #265
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Yes, that's fair enough.
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Old June 28th, 2017, 10:36 AM   #266
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Pan European World Cup?
20 stadia
1.Bernabeu
2.Camp Nou
3.Wembley
4.One of Emirates, Stamford Bridge and White Hart Lane
5.Old Trafford
6.San Mames
7.Stade de France
8. Lyon
9.Berlin
10.Allianz Munich
11.Rome
12.San Siro
13. Amsterdam
14.Brussels
15.Warsaw
16.Kyiev
17.Glasgow
18.Dublin
19.Scandinavian venue?
20. One more French venue
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Old June 28th, 2017, 07:10 PM   #267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HDI 0.548 View Post
Pan European World Cup?
20 stadia
1.Bernabeu
...
20. Sydney Olympic Stadium
We're invited to everything pan european these days
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Old June 30th, 2017, 12:21 AM   #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HDI 0.548 View Post
Pan European World Cup?
20 stadia
1.Bernabeu
2.Camp Nou
3.Wembley
4.One of Emirates, Stamford Bridge and White Hart Lane
5.Old Trafford
6.San Mames
7.Stade de France
8. Lyon
9.Berlin
10.Allianz Munich
11.Rome
12.San Siro
13. Amsterdam
14.Brussels
15.Warsaw
16.Kyiev
17.Glasgow
18.Dublin
19.Scandinavian venue?
20. One more French venue
A pan-European world cup is a great idea but not feasible. The EURO 2020 pan-European tournament is feasible because most of the fan who would attend the games are Europeans, and Europeans are wealthier than, say, the average Latin American or African.
Not many fans from Ghana or Chile can afford to fly to London to watch a game, then next day fly to Warsaw, Barcelona, Munich etc to follow their national team. The hotel bill, alone, not to talk of the flight tickets would be too prohibitive.

For that reason, I'd stick with a single country or a group of contiguous countries (2-3) hosting the tournament. A British bid, Spain/Portugal bid, Netherlands/Belgium bid, Sweden/Norway/Denmark, or Italy/France bid would be more viable in that regard.
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Old June 30th, 2017, 11:22 AM   #269
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Originally Posted by CFCman View Post
A pan-European world cup is a great idea but not feasible. The EURO 2020 pan-European tournament is feasible because most of the fan who would attend the games are Europeans, and Europeans are wealthier than, say, the average Latin American or African.
Not many fans from Ghana or Chile can afford to fly to London to watch a game, then next day fly to Warsaw, Barcelona, Munich etc to follow their national team. The hotel bill, alone, not to talk of the flight tickets would be too prohibitive.

For that reason, I'd stick with a single country or a group of contiguous countries (2-3) hosting the tournament. A British bid, Spain/Portugal bid, Netherlands/Belgium bid, Sweden/Norway/Denmark, or Italy/France bid would be more viable in that regard.
Considering that flights are really cheap in Europe, cheaper than in the US for instance (old article, but it has only gotten cheaper), this is is just as much an argument against a pan-European world cup, as against for instance a North American world cup. In a pan-European World Cup, travel distances would probably be a bit longer than in Brazil, but comparable to North America and China.
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Old June 30th, 2017, 01:26 PM   #270
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^ his point still stands though: even if for a fan from a developed country it's feasible to fly, say, from Barcelona to Amsterdam to Warsaw to Milan then London just like that, for a fan from Ghana or Paraguay it would be better if all the travel would be confined to one country or one not too large region.

That said, there are countries with very expensive train tickets, and I think the UK is one of them, right? I'm not ruling out that flying by lowcost around Europe might be cheaper than travelling by train around the UK.
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Old June 30th, 2017, 09:47 PM   #271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexandru.mircea View Post
....
That said, there are countries with very expensive train tickets, and I think the UK is one of them, right? I'm not ruling out that flying by lowcost around Europe might be cheaper than travelling by train around the UK.
"Man flies from Newcastle to London via Spain because it’s cheaper than the train" (If you book 3-6 months before it is a lot cheaper)

Read more: http://metro.co.uk/2017/06/27/man-fl...#ixzz4lW6qVpd7


Wouldn't it be cheaper to fly around Europe than the USA as mentioned ?
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Old June 30th, 2017, 10:53 PM   #272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fish.01 View Post
"Man flies from Newcastle to London via Spain because itÂ’s cheaper than the train" (If you book 3-6 months before it is a lot cheaper)

Read more: http://metro.co.uk/2017/06/27/man-fl...#ixzz4lW6qVpd7


Wouldn't it be cheaper to fly around Europe than the USA as mentioned ?
But you spend 24 hours doing it and luggage has to be added. If you figure your time is worth 50 an hour, that's over 1000. If your time is worthless, then go for it.
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Old July 1st, 2017, 08:53 AM   #273
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But you spend 24 hours doing it and luggage has to be added. If you figure your time is worth 50 an hour, that's over 1000. If your time is worthless, then go for it.
ha ha...I guess he was sun deprived and felt like drinking a cocktail on the beach was worth his time.

I did the exact same trip a few weeks ago and paid £14.80 by booking ahead

It does make the point though that internal european flights can be very cheap, certainly competitive with flying around the USA.
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Old July 1st, 2017, 05:02 PM   #274
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ha ha...I guess he was sun deprived and felt like drinking a cocktail on the beach was worth his time.

I did the exact same trip a few weeks ago and paid £14.80 by booking ahead

It does make the point though that internal european flights can be very cheap, certainly competitive with flying around the USA.
Yes, I don't really argue with your point. But it varies: I can fly anywhere within California for $59 including two pieces of luggage and take-offs at prime times (pretty much any time). It's hard to compare that to cheaper flights in Europe at midnight or 7AM, with no luggage and landing at Bufflestein Airport which is just a two hour bus ride to civilization.

Also, not every flight is London to Mallorca. If you really have PAN-European games you are flying Madrid to Moscow or Istanbul to the Ruhr (assuming top 10 metros are selected). Can't get L 18 flights between those cities.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 08:37 AM   #275
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South American South Cone 2030
(Uruguay, Argentina, Chile, Paraguay and south of Brazil)

Bids
1) Montevideo, Uruguay - Estadio Centenario - 80k
2) Montevideo, Uruguay - Estadio Campeón del Siglo - 45k
3) Buenos Aires, Argentina - River Plate Stadium - 80k
4) Buenos Aires, Argentina - Estadio José Amalfitani - 50k
5) Avellaneda, Argentina - Estadio Libertadores de América - 50k
6) La Plata, Argentina - Ciudad de la Plata Stadium - 50k
7) Córdoba, Argentina - Estadio Mario A. Kempes - 60k
8) Mar del Plata, Argentina - Estadio José Minella - 40k
9) Rosario, Argentina - Estadio Gigante de Arroyito - 50k
10) Santa Fe, Argentina - Estadio Brigadier Estanislao López - 40k
11) Mendoza, Argentina - Estadio Malvinas Argentinas - 40k
12) San Juan, Argentina - Estadio Bicentenario - 40k
13) Santiago, Chile - Estadio Nacional - 60k
14) Santiago Chile - Estadio Monumental Colo Colo - 70k
15) Concepción, Chile - Estadio Ester Roa - 40k
16) Asunción, Paraguay - Estadio Defensores del Chaco - 45k
17) Asunción, Paraguay - Estadio General Pablo Rojas - 50k
18) Porto Alegre, Río Grande do Sul (Brazil) - Arena do Gremio - 60k
19) Porto Alegre, Río Grande do Sul (Brazil) - Estadio Beira Río - 51k
20) Curitiba, Paraná (Brazil) - Arena da Baixada - 42k
Really?

Argentina, Uruguay and Brasil is better than.

Change the Chile and Paraguai stadiums for south brazilian and capital stadiums.

Arena Corinthians, Arena Palmeiras, Mineirão, Maracanã, Engenhão, Mané Garrincha, Morumbi, Orlando Scarpelli, Arena Conda...
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Old July 8th, 2017, 06:02 PM   #276
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Really?

Argentina, Uruguay and Brasil is better than.

Change the Chile and Paraguai stadiums for south brazilian and capital stadiums.

Arena Corinthians, Arena Palmeiras, Mineirão, Maracanã, Engenhão, Mané Garrincha, Morumbi, Orlando Scarpelli, Arena Conda...
I think the point is that Brazil can host its own tournament if it wants. This is primarily for other countries or regions that aren't as large.
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Old July 16th, 2017, 02:21 PM   #277
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I would be happy to see a Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay hosted event.

Uruguay
El Centenario. I would not include the stadia of Nacional or Peñarol.

Brasil
Porto Alegre, Río Grande do Sul (Brazil) - Arena do Gremio - 60k
Porto Alegre, Río Grande do Sul (Brazil) - Estadio Beira Río - 51k
Curitiba, Paraná (Brazil) - Arena da Baixada - 42k
Sao Paulo, probably using the Corinthians Arena again.
Rio, Maracana.... you can't leave it off for a semi final.
Belo Horizonte

Then six from Argentina
Rosario
Mendoza
Cordoba
La Plata
Buenos Aires Capital- el Monumental... Refurbished -80K
Avellaneda, Argentina - Estadio Libertadores de América - 50k

The final in Uruguay. The opening game in Buenos Aires and a semi final... with a semi final and 3rd place match in Brasil.

It would be the best world cup and would reduce the staging costs and the infrastructure spending where the biggest populations are.
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Old July 17th, 2017, 04:06 AM   #278
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^ even if that were to be considered its too soon as Brazil jsut hosted it. They would gain more traction with less Brazilian grounds being used.
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Old July 19th, 2017, 08:01 PM   #279
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I know Africa cannot get the 2030 WC but it would be a good idea to have a North African or East African WC. These regions have social similarities (Arabic in the former and Swahili in the latter)
North Africa (20 venues)
Algiers
Oran
Constantine
Setif
***
Tunis
Sfax
Sousse
Monastir
***
Rabat
Casablanca
Fez
Tangier
***
Cairo
Alexandria
Port Said
Asyut (To spread it out)
***
Tripoli
Benghazi
One in Mauritania
One in Sudan (Khartoum)
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Old July 19th, 2017, 09:04 PM   #280
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I know Africa cannot get the 2030 WC but it would be a good idea to have a North African or East African WC. These regions have social similarities (Arabic in the former and Swahili in the latter)
North Africa (20 venues)
Algiers
Oran
Constantine
Setif
***
Tunis
Sfax
Sousse
Monastir
***
Rabat
Casablanca
Fez
Tangier
***
Cairo
Alexandria
Port Said
Asyut (To spread it out)
***
Tripoli
Benghazi
One in Mauritania
One in Sudan (Khartoum)
Maybe should add Israel?
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