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Old July 14th, 2015, 11:22 PM   #781
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Nope, it`s weird. As you say, we`re getting HS2 first and yet it feels like we`re struggling to keep up with other cities.


The residential towers thing has me baffled too. They`re starting to churn them out in Manchester and threatening to do the same in Leeds. What`s the highest residential Brum has proposed? 23 storeys or something?

I noticed the Snow Hill Masterplan said that the high rise office blocks would all be 15 storeys. Why? What`s wrong with some 20 storey blocks? Snow Hill 1+2 are about 15 storeys each. Snow Hill 3 will be about 15 storeys. Post and Mail will be about 15 storeys.

The new proposal off Holloway Head and at Zone 11 Park Central have all been reduced in height!!

I`ve also noticed they tend to knock down the taller tower blocks in the city and keep the 10-12 storey blocks for refurbishment.

Now, I`m a fan of mid-rise buildings and I don`t just want to build higher for the sake of it but you would think there would be some 25+/30+ storeys residential in the mix somewhere.

I`m struggling to see where we will build some talls in the future.
Couldn't have said it better. I simply do not see us getting anything tall for years if not a decade the way it's going by which time without doubt we will behind several other cities in the skyline rankings. It's all very odd but it seems the demand and desire is not there in brum to build big end of story. We really don't seem to show we are anywhere as big as we thought we were. Ambition is far higher in the plans proposed elsewhere no point kidding ourselves.

Congrats to manc and Leeds and even Liverpool on all there new 35 to 40 story 100 Mtr plus projects.
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Old July 14th, 2015, 11:52 PM   #782
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Who really cares anymore? We're seeing some great plans without height. Birmingham is booming just not in height. Still have the tallest office tower outside London going up shortly.

Birmingham is building density and a street scape that will create an urban fabric quite special I think. Pretty exciting times
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Old July 14th, 2015, 11:59 PM   #783
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There could be a number of big developments being drawn up by architects that we haven't yet seen.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 12:06 AM   #784
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There could be a number of big developments being drawn up by architects that we haven't yet seen.
Same could be said for the other cities. We can only go by what's seen so far and it's clear to me Brum is struggling a little.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 12:35 AM   #785
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lt is also worth keeping a realistic eye on the past. Cities mentioned (especially Manc') are masters of failed projects especially ones than ambitiously boast rising above 40 floors.Of present buildings under construction/site preparation in the city 3 are 28 storeys and one is 31but the tallest being 19 but an office block at spinningfields,so Brum' could see a tall office being built that may not have a life-changing floor count,but rises 80-90-100m (l know that Natwest tower site and Snow hill are in progress and could well prompt more). As long as a city has a fair amount of development (not necessarily buildings with many floors) going on then it surely bodes well with future plans when talls will be built.And Brum' is far from stagnant at present.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 12:38 AM   #786
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How is it struggling? Did London struggle? Did Paris struggle? Did Rome struggle?

Latest reports indicate that greater Birmingham has the most on going development in the regions and has the largest pipeline.

We'll see some rather large plans released over the next 18 months. It's not a sprint remember. It's a marathon. Birmingham is building fron the ground up and very well I think.

The core linking Colmore with broad Street, 5 ways Centenary Square and new street has got too many plans to mention and the creation of well over 5,000,000m sqft of space.

Pretty special if you ask me.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 01:21 AM   #787
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It's only been in the last few days that Leeds has seen a couple of proposals revealed (along with Cardiff). Leeds has had very few highrise proposals in recent years.

I haven't seen many realistic proposals for Liverpool in recent years either. Nor Glasgow, Sheffield, Portsmouth, Newcastle, Bristol, etc...

As for Manchester, it built far more highrises than any other city in the last boom and looks to do the same this time too. Perhaps highrise living is more trendy and desirable up there. People I know round here would much rather live in a house than an apartment. Sadly watching houses go up isn't as interesting as watching tall apartment blocks go up.

Bear in mind the West Midland's population has increased more than Greater Manchester's in recent years, so these extra people have got to be living somewhere. If it's not in apartments then it has to be in houses.

Whilst Brum may not have many tall residential proposals at the moment, as mentioned by others, we have both the largest office proposal (Snowhill) and tallest office proposal (Colmore Row).
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Old July 15th, 2015, 01:37 AM   #788
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I'm going to have to take you to task over your signature, VDB. The period from 1910ish onwards was when we actually saw the beginnings of a welfare state. Change 1915 to 1815.

#historybantz
"The beginnings of" - as in, it was only really pensions and free school meals at that point

The main point of my signature is that we had a welfare "golden era" in the '50s and now we've reverted back in time.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 03:58 AM   #789
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It's only been in the last few days that Leeds has seen a couple of proposals revealed (along with Cardiff). Leeds has had very few highrise proposals in recent years.

I haven't seen many realistic proposals for Liverpool in recent years either. Nor Glasgow, Sheffield, Portsmouth, Newcastle, Bristol, etc...

As for Manchester, it built far more highrises than any other city in the last boom and looks to do the same this time too. Perhaps highrise living is more trendy and desirable up there. People I know round here would much rather live in a house than an apartment. Sadly watching houses go up isn't as interesting as watching tall apartment blocks go up.

Bear in mind the West Midland's population has increased more than Greater Manchester's in recent years, so these extra people have got to be living somewhere. If it's not in apartments then it has to be in houses.

Whilst Brum may not have many tall residential proposals at the moment, as mentioned by others, we have both the largest office proposal (Snowhill) and tallest office proposal (Colmore Row).
Yup, Leeds lagged behind for ages when Birmingham and Manchester were building (at a very slow pace) during the recession, a good five years of nothing (bar Trinity & arena). It's only literally within the last year or so we've seen a boom in office/retail and now residential. Within the last 6 months we've seen a bunch of new schemes (see below) so the boom is about to hit Birmingham, Leeds went retail then office then residential in that order so maybe once the office developments start the residential will follow.

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Old July 15th, 2015, 05:19 AM   #790
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Who really cares anymore? We're seeing some great plans without height. Birmingham is booming just not in height. Still have the tallest office tower outside London going up shortly.

Birmingham is building density and a street scape that will create an urban fabric quite special I think. Pretty exciting times
Exactly. I can´t wait in 5 years to take the tram from the Jewellery quarter right up to Five Ways.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 08:10 AM   #791
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Yup, Leeds lagged behind for ages when Birmingham and Manchester were building (at a very slow pace) during the recession, a good five years of nothing (bar Trinity & arena). It's only literally within the last year or so we've seen a boom in office/retail and now residential. Within the last 6 months we've seen a bunch of new schemes (see below) so the boom is about to hit Birmingham, Leeds went retail then office then residential in that order so maybe once the office developments start the residential will follow.

Interesting points but don't get whu brum is slower in this trend and seeing the 'boom' than others unless the recession hit and left us later than other areas ?...
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Old July 15th, 2015, 09:29 AM   #792
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Just to add a quick point Birmingham has one of the youngest populations at the moment in 10-20 years these people will all be wanting their own places to live, apartments and inner city living appeal to those of a younger age generally so I can see there being a raft of proposals in the future


I wouldn't say we're falling behind we just haven't got anything of major height
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Old July 15th, 2015, 09:41 AM   #793
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I suppose whether you think Birmingham is lagging behind is how you measure the success of a development.

If you measure the success on building heights alone, then Birmingham ha been lagging behind Manchester, Leeds and Liverpool for a while... all 3 have had a larger number of buildings above 100m built in the last 10-15 years than Birmingham.

Manchester embraced the building boom like no other city, and in many regards it has paid off with regard to them reinventing their city centre. Leeds in contrast has had an awful lot of stalled development and I would argue had the biggest 'bust' of all the major cities with regard to stalled projects. Liverpool and Birmingham somewhere in the middle... with a relatively high level of developments implements but then a lot stalled during the boom and bust.

Manchester's pace continues, but they have the momentum they had before the bust, helped a lot by the BBC and their brand. But I don't see the likes of Leeds and Liverpool to be in a better state that Birmingham, and yes I'm based, but I also live in Leeds, Birmingham is in a much better position...

yes an investor has bought a site in Leeds that had permission for towers up to 40 storeys, but the application expired years ago. there is no proof to say that they will build anything like that, and with market conditions as they are, I suspect they wont...

to my mind, people need context. Birmingham is currently completing a £600m over-haul of their main station and is about to open a tram line running through its city centre - Leeds can only dream of both.....

Add to that we have officially started work on 2 of the largest city centre regeneration scheme in the country (Paradise and Arena Central) , the later having approval for a 28 storey resi 90m tower which is pretty big, plus the likes of the largest office block outside London (3 snowhill)) and I believe the tallest (103 colmore row) approved and about to be built speculatively, then I certainly don't think Birmingham is lagging behind... infact once these scheme are underway, these along with New Street and the metro, I personally believe we're on the cusp of something big in Birmingham!!!
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Old July 15th, 2015, 12:47 PM   #794
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The residential towers thing has me baffled too. They`re starting to churn them out in Manchester and threatening to do the same in Leeds. What`s the highest residential Brum has proposed? 23 storeys or something?
so you're complaining that Birmingham isn't going to resemble Mega City 1?
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Old July 15th, 2015, 01:34 PM   #795
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I suppose whether you think Birmingham is lagging behind is how you measure the success of a development.

If you measure the success on building heights alone, then Birmingham ha been lagging behind Manchester, Leeds and Liverpool for a while... all 3 have had a larger number of buildings above 100m built in the last 10-15 years than Birmingham.

Manchester embraced the building boom like no other city, and in many regards it has paid off with regard to them reinventing their city centre. Leeds in contrast has had an awful lot of stalled development and I would argue had the biggest 'bust' of all the major cities with regard to stalled projects. Liverpool and Birmingham somewhere in the middle... with a relatively high level of developments implements but then a lot stalled during the boom and bust.

Manchester's pace continues, but they have the momentum they had before the bust, helped a lot by the BBC and their brand. But I don't see the likes of Leeds and Liverpool to be in a better state that Birmingham, and yes I'm based, but I also live in Leeds, Birmingham is in a much better position...

yes an investor has bought a site in Leeds that had permission for towers up to 40 storeys, but the application expired years ago. there is no proof to say that they will build anything like that, and with market conditions as they are, I suspect they wont...

to my mind, people need context. Birmingham is currently completing a £600m over-haul of their main station and is about to open a tram line running through its city centre - Leeds can only dream of both.....

Add to that we have officially started work on 2 of the largest city centre regeneration scheme in the country (Paradise and Arena Central) , the later having approval for a 28 storey resi 90m tower which is pretty big, plus the likes of the largest office block outside London (3 snowhill)) and I believe the tallest (103 colmore row) approved and about to be built speculatively, then I certainly don't think Birmingham is lagging behind... infact once these scheme are underway, these along with New Street and the metro, I personally believe we're on the cusp of something big in Birmingham!!!



Yep. I was having a good moan and feel much better now!!


The mist has cleared.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 02:07 PM   #796
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Yep. I was having a good moan and feel much better now!!


The mist has cleared.
Ditto to sone extent as I'd forgotten how much we have got lined up...just give us a couple more iconic talls and im really happy 😁
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Old July 15th, 2015, 03:08 PM   #797
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Great post Woody!
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Old July 15th, 2015, 05:16 PM   #798
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I reckon when we start seeing above ground works at arena central, Snowhill, natwest tower coming down and the likes of Pershore Street and regal breaking ground the concensus might change
change. Alot of prep work is being undertaken in brum at the moment. Alot of demolition and soon we will have things rising throughout the city probably unrivalled in the last 25 years.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 05:42 PM   #799
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I reckon when we start seeing above ground works at arena central, Snowhill, natwest tower coming down and the likes of Pershore Street and regal breaking ground the concensus might change
change. Alot of prep work is being undertaken in brum at the moment. Alot of demolition and soon we will have things rising throughout the city probably unrivalled in the last 25 years.
Do agree.Living in a big city like B,ham is fine.Lived in st Austell for a while and ill tell you they have a lot to moan about.Nothing is ever built there at all.
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Old July 15th, 2015, 08:26 PM   #800
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Nothing a couple of 200m+ towers can't sort out.
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