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Old May 25th, 2019, 07:23 PM   #41
fountainkopf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy55 View Post
Call me sceptical but I find it unlikely that a guy in his garage/shed has really made a huge breakthrough in this tech when there are many enterprises with vastly larger resources who don’t seem to think it’s a thing. If it really worked then they would be copying this idea and pumping resource into it to commercialize it.
Luckily they don't know my idea.

I understand you 100%.

All I hear is that Darreus types were tested in the 1980s and not very practical...etc.

First electrical windturbine was made in 1887 by James Blyth. It was a giromill type like MCDonnell Aircraft did in 1978.

All I did was that I ironed out all the bugs in it...and blended it with ANEW design...with my innovation.
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Last edited by fountainkopf; May 25th, 2019 at 09:02 PM.
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Old May 26th, 2019, 10:41 AM   #42
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nv7-YM4wno8

This might be the glue to understand the 61% efficiency claims of the ANEW company.

Who flies R/C gliders ?
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Old June 3rd, 2019, 02:48 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyll.Ing. View Post
Oh come on. I highly suspect that you Googled "Fluid mechanics" for the first time an hour ago and now try to pass off as knowledgeable by listing the first fancy-sounding term you came across in the text. Your complete failure to communicate any sort of knowledge in the field shows you have no idea what you are talking about, making your incessant posting about those "revolutionary" ideas amount to little more than spam.

Your claim is that this turbine can exceed the Betz limit of efficiency. I and everyone else in this thread think this is impossible, and asked how this effect could possibly be achieved. Nothing you have posted since has done anything whatsoever to back up your claim.

You pretend that the graphs you've posted back your statement, when they clearly don't. You pretend that studies show you are right, but refuse to link to them, presumably because they expressly say you're wrong if they exist at all. You pretend that other sources back you up, but refuse to provide them. And now you pretend you know fluid dynamics too, but refuse to elaborate other than listing one term and saying "it has something to do with this". And then you start throwing off personal attacks too.

The request from me is simple. Explain how Betz's limit can be exceeded. How was Betz wrong? If you know only a quarter of what you pretend to do, you could at least give a rudimentary explanation. Or link to any sources that can. Your complete refusal to do either of those things - or use proper punctuation, for that matter - suggests a clear lack of ability. I'm tired of your constant bullshittery, present your case properly or GTFO.
Here is some evidence that I found;

It is very interesting to read your opinion. We have build wind turbine that is vertical axis. We are now observing power efficiency in wind tunnel. However we measure much higher then 59 % - we are close to 80 - 85 %. If there is someone that has great understanding of other then Betz law explanation I would like to share video of our design and initial data. Please contact me in direct way - [email protected]

Please note that the Betz Limit has already been broken and see my technical note titled "Wind Energy Conversion Efficiency Limit", Wind Engineering, vol. 30, No. 5, 2006, Multi-Science Publishing Co, UK.


The momentum analysis of Sharpe [3] is considered further. It is shown that the maximum wind energy conversion efficiency limit, or the Betz limit of 59.3%, deduced from conventional actuator disc theory is the limiting stationary maximum value as wind turbine rotor speed approaches infinity and rotor outlet swirl approaches zero. Theoretically, solution of the governing equations indicates 100% conversion efficiency could be possible with suitable wind turbine design and without wake limitations for all tip-speed ratios. Analogous to the thermodynamics laws for heat engines and similar to a Pelton wheel with hydro power, the wind turbine efficiency is not limited by the laws of fluid mechanics but by physical constraints only. Low tip-speed ratio would have greater prospects in achieving higher conversion efficiency in practice. Though the set of equations derived in the present technical note has assumed uniform bound circulation along the blade span, the same approach can be used for determination of optimum conditions for other blade designs or using other assumptions.


Bill Wolf:

Betzís Law is applicable to non-shrouded, transverse-flow turbines having a flow velocity through the turbine equal to the average of the incoming and exiting flow velocities. The assumption regarding the average flow velocities is part of the proof, so it is incorrect to apply Betzís Law to applications where this initial assumption is not the case. Also, the theoretical efficiency of 50.26 percent is the result of theoretically removing 88.89 percent of the energy from the two-thirds of the incoming flow that passes through the turbine and removing zero energy from the remaining one-third of the incoming flow that passes around the turbine. According, the theoretical efficiency of the turbine is dependent on what is defined to be the power of the incoming flow. If the power of the incoming flow is defined in terms of the cross-sectional area of the flow that eventually passes through the turbine, then the maximum theoretical efficiency is 88.89 percent. However, if incoming power is defined in terms of a cross-sectional area equal to the cross-sectional area of the turbine, as in the case of Betzís Law, then the maximum theoretical efficiency is 50.26 percent.


http://www.bg.pg.gda.pl/pmr/pdf/PMRes_2013_2.pdf

This above and attachments are from polish institute in Gdansk !
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Old June 4th, 2019, 07:25 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyll.Ing. View Post
59.3 at the very best, for reasons you should understand by now.

Also, isn't that peak efficiency attained at very low wind speeds? Isn't it better to extract 45 % of the wind energy at 10 m/s than 58 % of the energy at 4 m/s?

Do you understand by now why 59.3 % is not valid on cycloturbines ?
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Old June 4th, 2019, 07:54 AM   #45
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This seems way more substantial than all the other crud you've come up with. Actual arguments. Well done. Makes me wonder why you didn't start with those, but oh well, I got what I asked for in the end.

Looking at it closer, it seems like the derivation of Betz holds up in practice, as the calculated efficiency is very dependent on what is defined as the cross-section area of the turbine (do you measure the incoming area of air as big as the turbine, or only the air that hits the turbine?), which might have been the reason for some misunderstandings. It appears that the people at ANEW have gone for the latter model, which explains their high numbers. As such, they haven't really exceeded the Betz limit, they have just drawn a smaller control volume, where the air that goes around the turbine isn't counted as wasted. Using the control volume definition in Betz' law, their given numbers must be reduced by a third or so.

Now it remains to be seen whether this can be put into practice.

Last edited by Kyll.Ing.; June 4th, 2019 at 08:11 AM.
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Old June 4th, 2019, 08:43 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyll.Ing. View Post
This seems way more substantial than all the other crud you've come up with. Actual arguments. Well done. Makes me wonder why you didn't start with those, but oh well, I got what I asked for in the end.

Looking at it closer, it seems like the derivation of Betz holds up in practice, as the calculated efficiency is very dependent on what is defined as the cross-section area of the turbine (do you measure the incoming area of air as big as the turbine, or only the air that hits the turbine?), which might have been the reason for some misunderstandings. It appears that the people at ANEW have gone for the latter model, which explains their high numbers. As such, they haven't really exceeded the Betz limit, they have just drawn a smaller control volume, where the air that goes around the turbine isn't counted as wasted. Using the control volume definition in Betz' law, their given numbers must be reduced by a third or so.

Now it remains to be seen whether this can be put into practice.
Yes I have to be sure I don't fail on my third and bigger cycloturbine test model. Just the tools for a 20 KW generator costs 10 000 €s.

Professor Tadeusz Koronowich claims 80% efficiency is possible in theory. Anything less is sorta failure.
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Old June 11th, 2019, 07:29 AM   #47
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I have to start testing mine again...as I have tuned the system a bit.
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Old June 11th, 2019, 08:21 PM   #48
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I was able to clock 101 m/s speed for the wing in 10 m/s wind.

Not bad...unofficial TSR world record for a vawt ?
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