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Old July 8th, 2009, 11:24 AM   #61
L2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dilaz89 View Post
Light rail has the potential to make almost the entire route an activity corridor where you have mixed-use, high density along the whole route.
Why do you keep spouting the same dribble over and over? I suspect you actually know it's a load of shit but are re-posting it to bait me.

What is there in "light rail" that instantly attracts things to make it an activity corridor, that busways don't have?

I could point you to numerous tram routes in Melbourne that service little more than detached housing, even some with segregation from normal cars. Has the super-dooper light rail failed to work this time?

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Old July 8th, 2009, 11:59 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L2 View Post
Why do you keep spouting the same dribble over and over? I suspect you actually know it's a load of shit but are re-posting it to bait me.

What is there in "light rail" that instantly attracts things to make it an activity corridor, that busways don't have?

I could point you to numerous tram routes in Melbourne that service little more than detached housing, even some with segregation from normal cars. Has the super-dooper light rail failed to work this time?
Learn to read BG, he explicitly said "where you have mixed-use, high density along the whole route." - not that it attracts it, but it makes it better in a way you can't do with busways.
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Old July 8th, 2009, 12:06 PM   #63
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You should learn to read, James. None of youse can give me an actual REASON why it's so - it's just that "light rail does it differently" like that song.

How long until school holidays are over I hope?
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Old July 8th, 2009, 01:13 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L2 View Post
You should learn to read, James. None of youse can give me an actual REASON why it's so - it's just that "light rail does it differently" like that song.

How long until school holidays are over I hope?
its the image Mr L2, and Im all for it. If buses can attract that huge % of Australians that dont or wont use PT, then all would be good, but they dont, buses are boring, and trams fit in more nicely with urban streetscapes. This from a pure economist view is utter wank rubbish, the problem is its true
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Old July 8th, 2009, 01:15 PM   #65
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(part of) Interview a couple of days ago

http://www.mediastatements.wa.gov.au...&admin=Barnett

[Caller] from Ellenbrook, good morning. [greetings not transcribed]

[CALLER]

I just want to make a note on... Ellenbrook. Iím just... a bit quite concerned actually... previously we had a state election, a local member of... who is now the Member of Parliament had promised a rail line. I hope the public... in the Swan Valley and also the State has a... feasible [sic] study that they can actually see on money that is going to be spent when this rail line does commence, at the same time Iíd... like to see it not commence at the expense of hospitals, more public services, ambulances, hospitals, nurses, doctors... and a feasible [sic] study... over a long period of time to actually see if itís really warranted for the amount of people that are living out there now, compared to back in... 1995 where they expected a certain amount of people to live out there. That hasnít happened, now thatís stretched out to 2016, but Iíd like to honestly get... the State and also yourself Mr Premier to sit down and really think really long and hard at the expense of putting hospitals in jeopardy, other activities or... or sporting grounds to be built... than having a rail line.

I know that a lot of people probably disagree on this, but my... I live in Ellenbrook and Iím very proud to live there and to live in the Swan Valley, but not at the expense of having to pay taxes for a rail line that may take another say three or four years.


COLIN BARNETT

[Caller]... very responsible position youíre taking... look, in terms of that area we have committed, along with the Federal Government to a new Swan Health Campus which I would agree with you is... probably the highest priority in that north... I guess in the Midland... north east corridor area... so weíll be pushing ahead with that as quickly as possible. In terms of the metropolitan rail system, the next project will be extending the northern line... through to Brighton. It doesnít look very far when you look on a map, but itíll cost $250million to do that. So any rail extension is very expensive.


What I and the Liberal Party undertook during the election campaign was to do preliminary design and feasibility work on an Ellenbrook rail line. I said that any construction would be in a second term of government, if we get a second term.


So we are... we are... we acknowledge that that is the next logical major line to be built to our metropolitan rail system, but we will do the work carefully as you have suggested.
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Old July 8th, 2009, 01:46 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastadl View Post
its the image Mr L2, and Im all for it. If buses can attract that huge % of Australians that dont or wont use PT, then all would be good, but they dont, buses are boring, and trams fit in more nicely with urban streetscapes. This from a pure economist view is utter wank rubbish, the problem is its true
For a light rail network to be more attractive then any current bus system it would have to;
  • Along a significant pootion of its route, be seperated from the road network and run unrestricted like heavy rail
  • Run at regular intervals whereby passengers do not have to rely on timetables as they do now (ie; be of the same frequency as heavy rail lines currently in operation)
  • Have far less stops (ie; only stopping at district centres and other major centres where heavy rail currently cannot access) than buses reducing travel times.
  • Prioritised lanes and traffic lines when induced within regular road reserves
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Old July 8th, 2009, 03:08 PM   #67
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Hrmm

Well the Freeway is underutilised during off-peak - shall we close a few lanes?
I wonder if that has some merit..
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Old July 8th, 2009, 03:53 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BartBart View Post
(part of) Interview a couple of days ago

COLIN BARNETT

[Caller]... very responsible position you’re taking... look, in terms of that area we have committed, along with the Federal Government to a new Swan Health Campus which I would agree with you is... probably the highest priority in that north... I guess in the Midland... north east corridor area... so we’ll be pushing ahead with that as quickly as possible. In terms of the metropolitan rail system, the next project will be extending the northern line... through to Brighton. It doesn’t look very far when you look on a map, but it’ll cost $250million to do that. So any rail extension is very expensive.


What I and the Liberal Party undertook during the election campaign was to do preliminary design and feasibility work on an Ellenbrook rail line. I said that any construction would be in a second term of government, if we get a second term.


So we are... we are... we acknowledge that that is the next logical major line to be built to our metropolitan rail system, but we will do the work carefully as you have suggested.
So they are going to expand the rail to Butler, good on them, i thought they had scrapped it and decided to go against Labor's plans to do so.

Barney is saying "if we get a second term" .... is pretty keen to say that, he must think they are not doing so well to deserve a 2nd term...
I mean regardless of the party, a state leader should be thinking they are going to do well even if they think they won't... otherwise they are letting people indirectly think they are weak. (even if they may be), what im trying to get at is, he should be hoping that he is in for a 2nd term even if he doesn't think he will be.

Anyway Bart, were you the caller? for asking such a good question if u were.... it really exposed Premier Barnett (his plans anyway)
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Old July 8th, 2009, 03:59 PM   #69
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well extending freeways is expensive too

$170m for mitchell freeway 4km

and $551m for Roe 8

but, of course, rail is optional
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Old July 8th, 2009, 04:06 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronaugi1 View Post
For a light rail network to be more attractive then any current bus system it would have to;
  • Along a significant pootion of its route, be seperated from the road network and run unrestricted like heavy rail
  • Run at regular intervals whereby passengers do not have to rely on timetables as they do now (ie; be of the same frequency as heavy rail lines currently in operation)
  • Have far less stops (ie; only stopping at district centres and other major centres where heavy rail currently cannot access) than buses reducing travel times.
  • Prioritised lanes and traffic lines when induced within regular road reserves
But the thing is, you can achieve exactly the same thing with buses. Prioritised lanes and signals and high frequencies. Throw in an in your face bus stop and brightly coloured buses, and people will use them. CAT buses anyone?
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Old July 8th, 2009, 04:43 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by Skyline Art View Post
So they are going to expand the rail to Butler, good on them, i thought they had scrapped it and decided to go against Labor's plans to do so.

Barney is saying "if we get a second term" .... is pretty keen to say that, he must think they are not doing so well to deserve a 2nd term...
I mean regardless of the party, a state leader should be thinking they are going to do well even if they think they won't... otherwise they are letting people indirectly think they are weak. (even if they may be), what im trying to get at is, he should be hoping that he is in for a 2nd term even if he doesn't think he will be.

Anyway Bart, were you the caller? for asking such a good question if u were.... it really exposed Premier Barnett (his plans anyway)
Nah - not me. I wouldn't be calling for something not to be done because the $ should be spent on health. I'm quite the opposite - I make a point of rubbishing people wanting to spend every tax $ on health. Would be interesting if the question was asked as a pretence of being in that camp - but didn't hear it, so can't really say from the transcript. But I have been known to try and get some of our unanswered questions answered when Mr Barnett gets on his fornightly appearances on ABC and 6PR. And it is good to have the transcript as a resource - don't know how edited/filtered it is though.
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Old July 8th, 2009, 06:36 PM   #72
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Quote:
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Think about it logically, people have an aversion to buses in Australia, but whenever I've heard someone go to Melbourne they all rave about the Trams. There is a romantic quality to them (and no that doesn't mean anyone's falling in love) that people like about them; they also fit well into an urban setting and add to the character of an area. I'd wager most people would rather see rail and wires going down the street than a grade-separated piece of road. That doesn't really add to the character of an area, does it.

This isn't a purely economical issue, if it were the train lines themselves probably wouldn't exist given the money they lose. It is a social issue, if you come up with some brilliant way to overcome the social issues then go for it, build the busways.

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Old July 9th, 2009, 05:14 AM   #73
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People love these types of trams:



But unless you want some tacky faux-historical tram system there's nothing especially romantic about trams.

Besides buses can have a "romantic quality to them"
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Old July 9th, 2009, 05:27 AM   #74
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I don't particularly care as long as the mode of transport gets me to my destination efficiently.
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Old July 9th, 2009, 05:49 AM   #75
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Anyone got any updates on when the Bunbury Fwy/Hwy is opening?

BTW, how anyone can allude to the SF cable cars being tacky? I just don't see it. They're awesome.
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Old July 9th, 2009, 05:59 AM   #76
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Anyone got any updates on when the Bunbury Fwy/Hwy is opening?
Some time between August and October?
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Old July 9th, 2009, 06:01 AM   #77
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BTW, how anyone can allude to the SF cable cars being tacky? I just don't see it. They're awesome.

No I mean it would be tacky to for Perth to make faux-historical trams to look romantic. If Perth had a tram system it wouldn't look nearly as romantic--the history just wouldn't be there.
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Old July 9th, 2009, 06:21 AM   #78
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we already have one. It's the burswood 'tourist' bus/tram/annoyance/tackiness/road hazard
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Old July 9th, 2009, 07:02 AM   #79
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Anyone got any updates on when the Bunbury Fwy/Hwy is opening?
I posted back on page 1 - August.
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Old July 9th, 2009, 07:23 AM   #80
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I posted back on page 1 - August.
Has that been set in stone?
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