The Rise Makati [63F|res|u/c] - Page 67 - SkyscraperCity
 

forums map | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Asian Forums > Philippine Forums > Projects and Construction > Metro Manila Projects on the Rise > Makati

Makati The country's primary financial center


Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old December 3rd, 2016, 09:07 AM   #1321
House123
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 23

Ang dami na nila nagtatrabaho sa taas! Update as of today December 3, 2016







__________________
House123 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old December 3rd, 2016, 09:26 AM   #1322
House123
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 23

That's 4 floors finished in 2 months since October. Tapos na 'yong 2 floor gym as you see (I mean tapos na i construct). Sabay sabay naman 'yong gawa e ng tatlong wing e.

If the plan is to contruct 59 floors, that's 53 more floors to go which means 28 months to top off at current pace which would bring us to April 2019.

Kung 1 year after ng topping off ang turnover ng units, that would bring us to 2nd qtr of 2020 as the date of the turnover. Parang sakto lang sa deadline nila
House123 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 3rd, 2016, 09:29 AM   #1323
SC_00
Registered User
 
SC_00's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Surigao City
Posts: 309
Likes (Received): 301

Quote:
Originally Posted by House123 View Post
That's 4 floors finished in 2 months since October. Tapos na 'yong 2 floor gym as you see (I mean tapos na i construct). Sabay sabay naman 'yong gawa e ng tatlong wing e.

If the plan is to contruct 59 floors, that's 53 more floors to go which means 28 months to top off at current pace which would bring us to April 2019.

Kung 1 year after ng topping off ang turnover ng units, that would bring us to 2nd qtr of 2020 as the date of the turnover. Parang sakto lang sa deadline nila
galeeeng
SC_00 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old December 3rd, 2016, 11:02 AM   #1324
edisonshow
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 22
Likes (Received): 1

2016-12-03 its too late invest 1BR for me if form developer.
i went to the rise BGC today . 40SQM FOR 6M, (includ VAT with 6% discounted price) but there is still a other chage 5% before turn over.

BUT own live---- some 2BR ,75SQM FOR 9.5M (includ VAT with 6% discounted price) still ok.


btw, as chinese, i can't accept not gas allowed buliding.
the parking already to 1.3M
__________________

happy55 liked this post
edisonshow no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 4th, 2016, 01:53 AM   #1325
pampaganda
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 55
Likes (Received): 4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyka_Eumee View Post
Hi, I jst saw the pricelist and they are selling East Wing 30sq m for P4.6M. Do you think it's still a good investment or way too expensive na?


Too expensive. How much is rental going to be like in that area for 30sqm vs your monthly amortization? Assuming this is for rental property.

If you are an end user, whatever floats your boat I suppose if you can afford it then go for it.
pampaganda no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 4th, 2016, 08:11 AM   #1326
TooFrank
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 35
Likes (Received): 22

Quote:
Originally Posted by pampaganda View Post
Too expensive. How much is rental going to be like in that area for 30sqm vs your monthly amortization? Assuming this is for rental property.
If you are an end user, whatever floats your boat I suppose if you can afford it then go for it.
Why is it that people in the Philippines seem to struggle so much with the concept of YIELD?
If the net Yield (after expenses) is appreciably below Interest rates, how can it be a good investment?
What amazes me is that Prices asked by developers keep rising, even rents have been falling since last year. What's wrong with people?
TooFrank no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 4th, 2016, 08:58 AM   #1327
matrix_dot_ca
Registered User
 
matrix_dot_ca's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: VanCity
Posts: 20
Likes (Received): 2

^

I have been looking actively for investment. If I were to put a 6-7M condo and rent it out for 35k a month less expenses i'll get a net of say 30K a month. This seems like a measly investment IMO. It will only make sense if you were to live on it and stay for the long haul. I am talking about purchasing it in cash, if you were to loan it you will be bleeding every month.
__________________

pampaganda liked this post
matrix_dot_ca no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 4th, 2016, 09:10 AM   #1328
TooFrank
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 35
Likes (Received): 22

"6-7M condo and rent it out for 35k a month"

The market is now "out of joint"

Rents are falling, and developers are asking more and more money for their projects. As investors, we need to learn to just say No to these higher prices.

Collier's report has these figures for the market

QUARTER-- : Cap.Values: Rent psm: Yield-- :

Q3-2016-Act.: P 146.5 K : P 840 --- : 6.87%
Q3-2017-For. : P 138.8 K : P 795 --- : 6.87% - Forecast for 12 mos. from now

I usually seek a minimum yield of 8-10%, so these numbers are stretched and getting worse, quarter-by-quarter as Rents drift lower.

But what is really stretched are the prices on NEW projects, which are pushing up to P 165k, 170K and even higher for new projects. An agent I met this week was asking P190k psm for a project in Makati that was priced at P 150k psm about 18 months ago. And that asking price rose even when Rents were falling !
(When i asked who is buying these expensive properties, I was told most buyers these days are "from China" or maybe Korea.)

Maybe we should Tell the agents that they must buy a calculator and learn how to run Yields, else they are just wasting our time! (At least the time of Investors.)
== ==

If you pay P 6.5 Million for a property, and Rent it at P35,000 monthly, your Gross Yield is only: 6.46%
__________________

Peachie, MDS_investor, azumiii liked this post

Last edited by TooFrank; December 4th, 2016 at 10:39 AM.
TooFrank no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 4th, 2016, 06:45 PM   #1329
animasola
demoGRAPHICS
 
animasola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Makati / Cebu
Posts: 413
Likes (Received): 40

Once completed, how much would a 1BR (28 sqm) fetch in Monthly Rent by 2020?
animasola no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 5th, 2016, 12:07 AM   #1330
MDS_investor
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 24
Likes (Received): 30

Agree with TooFrank – I wrote a couple of posts on this a some months ago (so no worries, I ll keep this one short) and I would add the following "details":

- Prices: For 3Q17, Colliers has noted price declines (!) in Makati CBD despite only 1 project effectively being turned over out of the 7 projects scheduled i.e the supply hit hasn’t come through yet but prices are already falling.
- Tracking the right thing: Colliers tracks “luxury 3BR unit” prices and rents.. these are a lot less oversupplied compared to studios and 1BR. Unfortunately, the supply of nearby of the Rise (Lerato, Air, Kroma, Eaton, etc) is mostly studio and 1br..
- Delays: There are delays across the board due to shortages in skilled labour. Brace yourself for more delays given all the announced infrastructure investments coming next year.. Your ROI may start 12-18m later.
- Interest rates: Borrowing costs are (very) likely to rise: Inflation is picking up, banks’ loan books are growing rapidly and funding for banks is getting more expensive. If we start seeing defaults rise in 12-18m, then credit conditions will tighten even further. So for those expecting to loan money, make sure you can afford this also with 100-200bps more expensive loans.
Interesting article yesterday: http://www.manilatimes.net/lighting-...t-bomb/299682/
- Given delays.. how easy it is to get a bank loan for an unfinished project? Will one have to go through the (very) expensive in-house financing?

What will the right rental price be in 2020.. Frankly I have no clue at all. But I would recommend to each buyer to properly do his risk management and consider some extreme scenarios like 1) what if I can’t rent it out for several months, 2) what if the right rent for a studio suddenly falls to 25k (studio is at the bottom of the “food chain” after 1br) 3) Can I afford 1-2% higher interest rate on a bank loan, 4) what’s the ROI from having interior design in such an environment? I d be patient and buy from rush sales in the secondary market in 1-2y. There is no reason to do pre-selling anymore since prices are unlikely to go up much further from here. Relax, save – you’re not too late, you’re too early for the good opportunities
__________________

pampaganda, xtindcx, Beaniebeeny, azumiii liked this post
MDS_investor no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 5th, 2016, 11:54 PM   #1331
TooFrank
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 35
Likes (Received): 22

Quote:
Originally Posted by animasola View Post
Once completed, how much would a 1BR (28 sqm) fetch in Monthly Rent by 2020?
Whomever can answer that...
Please tell me the level of ALI's share price and the Dow Jones Industrial Average on June 30th, 2020. Then all of us here can make tons of profits.

(My point: none of these things can be predicted with precision.)
__________________

Maddawg liked this post
TooFrank no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 6th, 2016, 05:08 AM   #1332
Condodoc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 111
Likes (Received): 27

I agree with MDS_Investor on most of what he has said. Prudence and due diligence. There is much more studios and 1 BR than there are 2 or 3 BR, but then again, the demand is actually more for studios and 1 BR. But everyone still needs to be ready for prolonged vacancy.

With regards to Too_Frank's analysis....I have something to add. The yield he projected are good if the investment has only one income stream. Real estate properties actually have two: 1) rental income, and 2) rental appreciation. Even if there is no income coming in, there is steady appreciation of the property and therefore you are still creating (albeit still unrealised) returns on your investment. But of course, property appreciation is only realised when you sell the property, and property as you know, is not very liquid (difficult to encash - cash being the most liquid asset of all).
So unless you have deep pockets or another steady source of income (like a permanent job) one should not rely on the rental income unless you are diversified and most loans paid out. If you are relying on an income from a property while you are paying loan on that property, you have to study the returns as Too_Frank suggested.
__________________

azumiii liked this post
Condodoc no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 6th, 2016, 05:13 AM   #1333
Condodoc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 111
Likes (Received): 27

Although rental rates cannot be predicted for the Rise, there is something that I can predict with a good degree of certainty: the price of the unit in the area. As i Mentioned before, there are 2 income streams for a condo. Rental is volatile, but price appreciation is less so. Unless there is a war, or an earthquake...there is almost sure appreciation of the property within the next 5 years. This is supported by the increasing population with increasing number of middle class, and the housing backlog that we have in the philippines. Although there will be a spillover to the north and south of manila, Makati will remain, at least in the next 5 years, the crown jewel of the property market.
But yes, make sure that you will be ready for interest rate increases and for possibility of vacancy. The more properties I have, the more I realised that I am not late for investments...something always crops up, better designed and better value than the last...
Condodoc no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2016, 09:51 AM   #1334
TooFrank
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 35
Likes (Received): 22

"Although rental rates cannot be predicted for the Rise, there is something that I can predict with a good degree of certainty: the price of the unit in the area..."
" Rental is volatile, but price appreciation is less so..."


Can you do it better than Colliers?
They are predicting a price drop of about 5% over the next 12 months for Makati as a whole. Perhaps if you are better than their analysts, they should offer you a job.

Also, if you are WRONG - which often happens with such forecasts - what sort of guarantee can you provide to those who might buy property based on your forecasts?

My thinking is, no one knows exactly where the market will be in 1-3 or 5 years. As the saying goes: "You pay your money, and you take your chance." Colliers doesn't like predicting a rental decline, and a price decline. It is bad for their business, I reckon. But they do it, because they can see an oversupply emerging. The interesting question is: how long will it last. I hope not too many years, and that the excess supply will be absorbed many months before The Rise is completed. But I am not going to claim to be as certain as you seem to think you are.

Last edited by TooFrank; December 7th, 2016 at 09:57 AM.
TooFrank no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2016, 08:36 PM   #1335
markkram
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 217
Likes (Received): 148

A bit off topic

It looks like there is an underground car park. I dont really understand why developers are building underground car parks in places with a lot of high rise buildings around it. I mean who wants to buy a unit on the 2nd floor and be just a bit above the street? If the car park wouldnt be underground the lowest floor would be for example the 6th floor which would make the lowest floor more attractive since there might be a bit of a view and also the amenity area would benefit from it and be a bit higher and allow some nice views of the city. It also costs much more to make it underground. You need stabilisation walls and an effective ventilation system. If it would be over ground none of this is needed.
It wouldnt also be a problem to make for example 2 floors mall and on top of it 3 floors car park. So it cant be an argument that there is a mall so it has to be underground. It also isnt a problem to cover the podium car park nicley and make it look nice from the street.
Anyway would be interesting to hear what you think about it...
markkram no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2016, 04:06 AM   #1336
Condodoc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 111
Likes (Received): 27

Quote:
Originally Posted by TooFrank View Post
"Although rental rates cannot be predicted for the Rise, there is something that I can predict with a good degree of certainty: the price of the unit in the area..."
" Rental is volatile, but price appreciation is less so..."


Can you do it better than Colliers?
They are predicting a price drop of about 5% over the next 12 months for Makati as a whole. Perhaps if you are better than their analysts, they should offer you a job.

Also, if you are WRONG - which often happens with such forecasts - what sort of guarantee can you provide to those who might buy property based on your forecasts?

My thinking is, no one knows exactly where the market will be in 1-3 or 5 years. As the saying goes: "You pay your money, and you take your chance." Colliers doesn't like predicting a rental decline, and a price decline. It is bad for their business, I reckon. But they do it, because they can see an oversupply emerging. The interesting question is: how long will it last. I hope not too many years, and that the excess supply will be absorbed many months before The Rise is completed. But I am not going to claim to be as certain as you seem to think you are.

No need for the sarcastic tone TOO FRANK. But our time frames are different. COlliers predicted a 5% decrease in capital prices in Makati over the next 12 months. I am saying that I am comfortable that the prices will be up in the next 60 months. There lies the difference.
__________________

happy55 liked this post
Condodoc no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2016, 05:35 AM   #1337
House123
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 15
Likes (Received): 23

They're building a Mall and a 2 floor gym/amenities area. If the build, say a 3 floor parking area further overground, that's too much floors taken already before the actual housing units.
House123 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2016, 05:57 AM   #1338
Mabalotski
Registered User
 
Mabalotski's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 71
Likes (Received): 19

Quote:
Originally Posted by markkram View Post
A bit off topic

It looks like there is an underground car park. I dont really understand why developers are building underground car parks in places with a lot of high rise buildings around it. I mean who wants to buy a unit on the 2nd floor and be just a bit above the street? If the car park wouldnt be underground the lowest floor would be for example the 6th floor which would make the lowest floor more attractive since there might be a bit of a view and also the amenity area would benefit from it and be a bit higher and allow some nice views of the city. It also costs much more to make it underground. You need stabilisation walls and an effective ventilation system. If it would be over ground none of this is needed.
It wouldnt also be a problem to make for example 2 floors mall and on top of it 3 floors car park. So it cant be an argument that there is a mall so it has to be underground. It also isnt a problem to cover the podium car park nicley and make it look nice from the street.
Anyway would be interesting to hear what you think about it...


Coz there are people who prefer convenience & safety (quick fire exit) over the view. They would prefer to just use the stairs rather than wait for elevators most of the time, especially in peak hours. Senior citizen owners/tenants as well. IMO, main reason would be MORE PROFIT. Additional sale for more units and parking space is greater than saving for that underground expense. Developers are greedy, they will milk you as much as they can.
Mabalotski no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2016, 09:33 AM   #1339
markkram
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 217
Likes (Received): 148

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mabalotski View Post


Coz there are people who prefer convenience & safety (quick fire exit) over the view. They would prefer to just use the stairs rather than wait for elevators most of the time, especially in peak hours. Senior citizen owners/tenants as well. IMO, main reason would be MORE PROFIT. Additional sale for more units and parking space is greater than saving for that underground expense. Developers are greedy, they will milk you as much as they can.
But i think it is much cheaper to make the car park overground and not underground. And the number of units can be the same. Instead of 3 floors underground and 50 floors overground. U can just make the building 53 floors overground including that 3 levels of car park. So it is cheaper to not make an underground car park.
The elevator also goes to every level so it doesnt make much of a difference if its over or underground.
And i dont see any issue with safety. I thinks its much safer to have an over ground than underground car park. If there is a fire smoke goes up so imagine a fire on the -3 level. U cant fight the fire easily. The firemen would have to fight their way throw 2 levels of smoke to reach the fire. Unlike if its all over ground u can get access from the level below.
markkram no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 8th, 2016, 09:49 AM   #1340
Mabalotski
Registered User
 
Mabalotski's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 71
Likes (Received): 19

Quote:
Originally Posted by markkram View Post
But i think it is much cheaper to make the car park overground and not underground. And the number of units can be the same. Instead of 3 floors underground and 50 floors overground. U can just make the building 53 floors overground including that 3 levels of car park. So it is cheaper to not make an underground car park.
The elevator also goes to every level so it doesnt make much of a difference if its over or underground.
And i dont see any issue with safety. I thinks its much safer to have an over ground than underground car park. If there is a fire smoke goes up so imagine a fire on the -3 level. U cant fight the fire easily. The firemen would have to fight their way throw 2 levels of smoke to reach the fire. Unlike if its all over ground u can get access from the level below.
AFAIK, building floors are per approval or there is a limit according to findings sa lot; not sure though.. I know people who prefer to buy lower floors due to elevator issues and safety, they do not care about view. Its a matter of preference I guess..
Mabalotski no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 


Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT +2. The time now is 08:44 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us