Metrolink ‎Extension - Page 2001 - SkyscraperCity
 

forums map | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > European Forums > UK & Ireland Architecture Forums > Projects and Construction > Manchester Metro Area > Greater Manchester Transport Projects

Greater Manchester Transport Projects Transport Matters For Greater Manchester and Surrounding Areas


Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 3485 votes, 4.99 average.
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:07 PM   #40001
loweskid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,128
Likes (Received): 1616

loweskid no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:10 PM   #40002
marni1971
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,508
Likes (Received): 3594

Here's to the present and future of Metrolink. Who'd have thought it in 1992??!

And now, for a fascinating hour or five, hit the button at the top marked "first"
__________________

MarkO, bogblaster, wrinkly liked this post
marni1971 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:12 PM   #40003
WatcherZero
Registered User
 
WatcherZero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 20,661

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew_ View Post
The original spec for the M5000 was that it could be made high floor or low floor and as a 2-car tram or a 3-car tram. Manchester had no use for 3-car trams as when coupled, they'd be too long for the platforms. Speaking of coupling, the M5000s were originally not designed to be coupled in the way they are today.
While mostly correct the M5000 are actually 3module trams with a very short centre section, you can see in the following images.

Full length three module unit

and
https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3419/3...0302b3a3_b.jpg

Short length three module unit, same as Metrolink



Two module unit, centre bogie but not saloon.



They were designed to operate in multiple, it quite common for them to do so in service on the continent. Croydon version wasnt designed to operate in multiple in service though, neither were the Sheffield or Nottingham trams.

Coupler anomalies are quite common not just on trams but on heavy rail units too, the connection pins get corroded or bent.
__________________
WatcherZero no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:17 PM   #40004
Freel07
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Manchester
Posts: 10,188
Likes (Received): 21085

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew_ View Post
The original spec for the M5000 was that it could be made high floor or low floor and as a 2-car tram or a 3-car tram. Manchester had no use for 3-car trams as when coupled, they'd be too long for the platforms. Speaking of coupling, the M5000s were originally not designed to be coupled in the way they are today.

Coupling was originally meant to be for emergencies only - this is why double units don't always play nicely with each other! Certain trams don't like certain other trams (some will throw up bizarre problems like disabling the air-con in the cabs - always fun in the winter - whilst some will just refuse to work entirely until you uncouple them & reboot the entire tram), certain trams can only be coupled certain ways, non-ATS trams cannot be coupled with ATS trams... the techs have to keep a record of which combinations don't work!

Even when they do feel inclined to work nicely, there's a lag between them - when the front tram pulls off from a standstill, it takes a few seconds before the rear tram "notices" - it then suddenly accelerates to whatever speed (~20mph) the front tram is doing - causing everyone in the rear tram to lurch backwards. Same goes for breaking - when the front tram brakes, the back tram carries on at the same speed for a few seconds then applies the brakes to whatever level the front tram's brakes have been applied - so everyone goes flying forward. The drivers know about this and try their best to judge it, but again some trams are play nicer than others!:p
Sorry but I must correct you there. The M5000 was always intended to couple and run in multiple in service. The original specification that went to tender had that as a requirement. The K5000 which is basically the same tram runs coupled in service.

As WatcherZero says coupler problems are not uncommon on both trams and trains and given the number of circuits that pass through the heads it is not surprising that they are maintenance intensive.
__________________

bogblaster liked this post
Freel07 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:21 PM   #40005
WatcherZero
Registered User
 
WatcherZero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 20,661

Dellner has even started selling a coupler addon that's essentially a second backup row of connecter pins that automatically dynamically reconfigure to compensate for any loss of data connection.
__________________

Freel07 liked this post
WatcherZero no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:24 PM   #40006
loweskid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,128
Likes (Received): 1616

loweskid no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:35 PM   #40007
CHAPS2034
Chris W
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,484
Likes (Received): 650

Great pictures and stories everyone

Didn't manage to get down there today; hopefully tomorrow

A friend of mine did use the Airport line and reports that hardly anyone got on the tram after Chorlton. He was amused to see the escalator not working at the Airport as he had a big spat with the powers that be about the long standing outage of the one at Bury a few years ago. Hopefully it will be sorted soon.

Cheers
CW
CHAPS2034 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:43 PM   #40008
nerd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 7,515
Likes (Received): 2599

Quote:
Originally Posted by dasy2k1 View Post
I think the tram trains may end up as 3 section 45m units (ie 1.5 single trams) without the option of coupling except to tow a failed unit

Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk
I am fairly sure that wouldn't work dasy. The 'standard' tram-train solution is for a three-section unit of 38m length, and around 70% low floor (hence using four conventional bogies). The Vossloh units purchased for the Sheffield tram-train pilot are exactly this configuration, providing around 100 seats and 240 person total capacity and 4 doors sets per side. I recall that being stated as the maximum size possible for a three-section unit.

http://www.vossloh-rail-vehicles.com..._us_062013.pdf

TfGM have already stated that they would be looking for something rather bigger - not just 100% high floor, but also with a capacity of around 300 and a length well in excess of 40m. I suspect that does indeed imply a 5 section unit with 6 doors per side and 6 sets of bogies. Obviously such a unit could not run coupled on Metrolink
nerd no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:46 PM   #40009
Freel07
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Manchester
Posts: 10,188
Likes (Received): 21085

Now, do I post another perhaps final set of my Airport Line photos on here or the main Metrolink thread?

Given that today is opening day I think I can be forgiven for posting on here. This will be in 2 parts.

Part 1 early events.

Arriving at Sale Water Park at around 04:50 this morning to be greeted by this.

DSC_5121 by sghyde, on Flickr

Then this as 3080/3070 descend from the Mersey Viaduct

DSC_5123 by sghyde, on Flickr

and roll into the stop.

DSC_5127 by sghyde, on Flickr

A slightly late arrival at Manchester Airport which lead to a late departure.

DSC_5128 by sghyde, on Flickr

Lots of people with little goody bags.

P1080757 by sghyde, on Flickr

Ready to depart.

DSC_5130 by sghyde, on Flickr

Some of the regular first tram crew on the return trip.

P1080758 by sghyde, on Flickr

DSC_5134 by sghyde, on Flickr

I left the first inbound set at Barlow Moor Road to try for a few early shots on the street running section on Hardy Lane, with mixed results!

DSC_5136 by sghyde, on Flickr

3063 approaches along the central reservation with an Airport bound trip.

DSC_5143 by sghyde, on Flickr

On departure it passes 3085 on the second inbound trip. Passengers already waiting at 06:37.

DSC_5147 by sghyde, on Flickr

DSC_5150 by sghyde, on Flickr

DSC_5152 by sghyde, on Flickr

On Hardy Lane 3067 approaches the camera with the 3rd Cornbrook trip.

DSC_5155 by sghyde, on Flickr

DSC_5158 by sghyde, on Flickr

3079 arrives at Barlow Moor Road heading to the Airport.

DSC_5161 by sghyde, on Flickr

Where we see it slightly later ready to depart.

DSC_5166 by sghyde, on Flickr

I'm not quite sure what the second tram on the PIDS was supposed to be

DSC_5167 by sghyde, on Flickr

but 3079 departed normally

DSC_5169 by sghyde, on Flickr

and 3080 reappeared having been split from 3070. But nothing seemed special about its trip to warrant the odd display info

DSC_5173 by sghyde, on Flickr

although it did beat a fairly hasty retreat.

DSC_5175 by sghyde, on Flickr

3067 arrives a few minutes later.

DSC_5179 by sghyde, on Flickr

From here I set out to take shots along the line, these will appear shortly in Part 2......

Last edited by Freel07; November 4th, 2014 at 04:51 PM.
Freel07 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:53 PM   #40010
marni1971
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,508
Likes (Received): 3594

Quote:
Originally Posted by CHAPS2034 View Post
He was amused to see the escalator not working at the Airport
Bad show but I hope the accelerated opening of the line meant the escalators aren't quite ready and that's the only reason. Certainly on Saturday morning there were techs working on it and lots of surrounding floor trim and tiles were either half installed or not in place at all.

I hope the walls being removed around them means their use is imminent and not because they should be working but won't.
marni1971 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:54 PM   #40011
loweskid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,128
Likes (Received): 1616

Did anyone venture on to the other Metrolink platform at the airport? I did, along with a couple of other chaps, but we got turfed off by a workman on the NR platform - even though there was no barrier or signs to say it was out of bounds. I had already got my shots so I just walked off but one of the other chaps got into a bit of a barny (anyone on here?). After we got off the platform, only then did he put a couple of cones at the end of the platform.
__________________

wrinkly liked this post
loweskid no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:54 PM   #40012
Freel07
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Manchester
Posts: 10,188
Likes (Received): 21085

Quote:
Originally Posted by CHAPS2034 View Post
Great pictures and stories everyone

Didn't manage to get down there today; hopefully tomorrow

A friend of mine did use the Airport line and reports that hardly anyone got on the tram after Chorlton. He was amused to see the escalator not working at the Airport as he had a big spat with the powers that be about the long standing outage of the one at Bury a few years ago. Hopefully it will be sorted soon.

Cheers
CW
Obviously the loadings would depend on the time of day your friend travelled. Having been out and about from the first trip to around 11:30 it was quiet before 09:30 but the loadings after that started to pick up in just the same way as on the other first days. Certainly East Manchester was quite in my experience for a week or two after opening but then quickly started to improve. Inbound loads today after 09:30 didn't seem too bad for a first morning. I can't comment on afternoon events.

The main problem as others have pointed out was the very irregular headway at least during the morning. whether this was due to the need to split the double at Cornbrook causing delays I don't know.
Freel07 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 09:55 PM   #40013
Freel07
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Manchester
Posts: 10,188
Likes (Received): 21085

Quote:
Originally Posted by marni1971 View Post
Bad show but I hope the accelerated opening of the line meant the escalators aren't quite ready and that's the only reason. Certainly on Saturday morning there were techs working on it and lots of surrounding floor trim and tiles were either half installed or not in place at all.

I hope the walls being removed around them means their use is imminent and not because they should be working but won't.
I was told they were expecting it to be brought into use today, can anyone comment as to whether it was?
__________________

marni1971 liked this post
Freel07 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 10:03 PM   #40014
Platform14
Boltonian in exile
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Northampton
Posts: 111
Likes (Received): 70

By good fortune, a meeting in Manchester today meant I managed to squeeze in a return trip from the Airport to New Islington (via Cornbrook) and back. My first Metrolink opening day since Broadway to Eccles way back in 2000! The honours went to 3063 from the Airport at about 1010-ish (in beautifully sunny weather) with 3080 back from Cornbrook at about 1620.

So great to finally ride this line. I was half expecting the trip through Wythenshawe to be a little tortuous, but was pleasantly surprised by how quick the trip was. The passenger loading both ways were moderate (although there were a few well-loaded trams in the opposite direction), although I did experience some bunching of trams due to the earlier congestion at Cornbrook.

Now need an excuse for a second trip...
__________________

josh-j, marni1971, Nathan Dawz, Freel07 liked this post
Platform14 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 10:33 PM   #40015
Freel07
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Manchester
Posts: 10,188
Likes (Received): 21085

OK Part 2 of my odyssey.

Starting at Shadowmoss

3067 heads off alongside Shadowmoss Road.

DSC_5184 by sghyde, on Flickr

3062 arrives to take me to Peel Hall

DSC_5203 by sghyde, on Flickr

where we see 3078 heading for the Airport.

DSC_5215 by sghyde, on Flickr

The early morning sun made life a bit difficult here.

DSC_5218 by sghyde, on Flickr

At Robinswood Road 3086 leaves for Cornbrook

DSC_5222 by sghyde, on Flickr

and across the junction 3063 appears heading for the Airport.

DSC_5229 by sghyde, on Flickr

To me even allowing for the Interchange construction site Wythenshawe Town centre stop has an unfinished air about it. Here we see 3078 ready to depart, the driver kindly waited for me to get this shot.

DSC_5240 by sghyde, on Flickr

Some happy Customer Service guys on the outbound platform here.

DSC_5249 by sghyde, on Flickr

Having noticed that there was a 24 minute gap after this tram I decided to head for Crossacres then walk up to Benchill.

DSC_5254 by sghyde, on Flickr

Crossacres where we see 3063 heading off towards Benchill as 3079 approaches the camera.

DSC_5261 by sghyde, on Flickr

DSC_5265 by sghyde, on Flickr

Benchill

3067 rounds the curve from Hollyhedge Road.

DSC_5293 by sghyde, on Flickr

After the long gap 3079 arrives to take me on towards my next port of call

DSC_5304 by sghyde, on Flickr

which was to be Moor Road as I needed to be back at Cornbrook to meet a friend at 10 o'clock.

DSC_5316 by sghyde, on Flickr

now the other half of the earlier double appeared running Out of Service.

DSC_5326 by sghyde, on Flickr

followed by my transport, 3085.

DSC_5333 by sghyde, on Flickr

After completing my rendezvous i headed back out to Wythenshawe Park and Northern Moor for a final few shots.

3063 arrives at Wythenshawe Park where once again an inbound gap gave me chance to obtain a few shots

DSC_5335 by sghyde, on Flickr

3085 Airport bound crosses Wythenshawe Road

DSC_5337 by sghyde, on Flickr

3067 at Bordley Walk

DSC_5351 by sghyde, on Flickr

followed by 3062

DSC_5358 by sghyde, on Flickr

Giving up on waiting for the next tram which was still at least 16 minutes away I walked up to Northern Moor where I arrived just in time to see 3080 climbing up to the M60 bridge

DSC_5377 by sghyde, on Flickr

and the PIDS indicated these headways.

DSC_5373 by sghyde, on Flickr

eventually 3079 arrived to get me back to my car at Sale Water Park.

DSC_5377 by sghyde, on Flickr

Back at Sale Water Park some six and a half hours after starting out!

DSC_5378 by sghyde, on Flickr

Comparing the car park here with the one at East Didsbury at a similar time on the day that line opened I think there were more cars here. Early days though I guess.

P1080787 by sghyde, on Flickr

Thats it for now. Any further Airport Line shots will appear on the main thread now.

Now to chill out with a beer

Last edited by Freel07; November 3rd, 2014 at 10:50 PM.
Freel07 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 10:37 PM   #40016
WingTips
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,466
Likes (Received): 3314

Great pictures everyone !!! I`ve set up the headlines on the Intl thread so all we need now are the photos !!!
__________________

josh-j, Freel07 liked this post
WingTips no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 10:41 PM   #40017
d33206hg
Tram Enthusiast
 
d33206hg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Sale Water Park
Posts: 806
Likes (Received): 3887

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freel07 View Post
I was told they were expecting it to be brought into use today, can anyone comment as to whether it was?
I was told they were just waiting for the side guards which were due this morning.
__________________
http://www.flickr.com/photos/d33206hg/

marni1971 liked this post
d33206hg no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 10:44 PM   #40018
Freel07
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Manchester
Posts: 10,188
Likes (Received): 21085

Quote:
Originally Posted by d33206hg View Post
I was told they were just waiting for the side guards which were due this morning.
I was told the same and heard two guys in overalls discussing what was needed at the top of the escalator this morning!
__________________

marni1971, bogblaster liked this post
Freel07 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 10:48 PM   #40019
Freel07
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Manchester
Posts: 10,188
Likes (Received): 21085

Quote:
Originally Posted by WingTips View Post
Great pictures everyone !!! I`ve set up the headlines on the Intl thread so all we need now are the photos !!!
Your wish is my command
Freel07 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old November 3rd, 2014, 10:48 PM   #40020
WatcherZero
Registered User
 
WatcherZero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 20,661

Wasn't any work going on in the afternoon.

People see the spookily empty Trafford depot as they passed, only a single solitary banana sitting in it.
__________________

marni1971 liked this post
WatcherZero no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 


Reply

Tags
manchester, metro, metrolink, tram

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:28 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us