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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
TAVE High-Speed rail project
BUENOS AIRES-ROSARIO-CORDOBA


After announcing their proposal on 26 April 2006, the Argentine government initiated a tender process to receive bids for a 710 Km High-Speed Train from Buenos Aires to Cordoba, via Rosario. The turnkey project, including the new railway line itself in all its elements (track, signalling, electrification, stations, depots, etc.), rolling stock and 5 and 10 year maintenance of infrastructure and rolling stock, respectively, has been expected to cost 1.35 billion dollars.



The bidding process ended up with just one bidder, Veloxia, a joint-venture of Alstom (France), Isolux Corsan (Spain), Emepa and Iecsa (Argentina). Earlier, Siemens (Germany) and CAF (Spain), together with their respective national and foreign partners, had abandoned the competition because of financing problems and lack of time.

Having received the authority's technical approval, Veloxia has made public on 27 April the economic offer, putting a price-tag of just 1.32 billion dollars on their proposal. The government will now take 45 to 60 days to analyze the offer such as to finally decide whether it will go ahead.



Main infrastructure characteristics:

The line would use standard gauge (1.435 mm) and be restricted to passenger trains. The proposal calls for a top speed of 300 to 320 Km/h (except in urban areas, where it will be limited to 160 Km/h), and electrified at 25 Kv 50 Hz. A double track is required for Buenos Aires-Rosario, while Rosario-Cordoba would be single track due to lower traffic, though space would be provided for a future second track. A few level-crossings might be necessary in urban areas, in which case speed would be restricted to a maximum of 160 Km/h. The projected track is mostly parallel to existing railway lines, but would share its track with the Ferrovías suburban line to enter Buenos Aires, which would thereby benefit from the overhead electrification. ERTMS Level 2 has been chosen as the main signalling system.

Stations:

Retiro (in Buenos Aires), Rosario Oeste and Córdoba-Mitre would be the main stations along the line, although some trains are also expected to stop at San Nicolás de los Arroyos (120,000 inhabitants) between Buenos Aires and Rosario, and at Marcos Juarez, Bell Ville and Villa Maria between Rosario and Cordoba.



Rolling stock:

Veloxia has offered a fleet of double-decker trains designed for commercial speeds of up to 320 Km/h, based on the French TGV-Duplex. Each unit would carry about 520 passengers in two classes, although it will be feasible to couple two units in case of stronger demand. One of the eight carriages would house a cafeteria.

Demand and service proposals:

An initial demand of 4.5 million passengers per year has been calculated for Buenos Aires-Rosario, another million for Rosario-Córdoba. A minimum of nine daily services between Buenos Aires (14 million inhabitants) and Rosario (1,1 million) are planned to satisfy this demand, and at least four of them would then continue to Cordoba (1,4 million). The 310 Km between Buenos Aires and Rosario are expected to be covered in 85 to 90 minutes, while Rosario-Cordoba (400 Km) would take another 90 to 95 minutes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Alstom Press Release

Encouraged by the results of this tender, the Secretary of Transport announced the launch within the next two months of a similar bidding process, this time for a high-speed train from Buenos Aires to Mar del Plata. They had initially intended to upgrade the existing railway line to Mar del Plata for lower speeds, but because of the flat terrain the costs of new high-speed line are considered to be very attractive.
 

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Originally Posted by Le Figaro

L'Argentine prête à monter dans le TGV

Buenos Aires LAMIA OUALALOU.

Alstom est sur la bonne voie pour construire la future ligne entre Buenos Aires et Cordoba.

ET LE COMBAT cessa faute de combattants. Resté seul en lice après un an de tractations, Alstom devrait emporter le marché du premier train à grande vitesse d'Amérique latine. Il reliera les trois principales villes d'Argentine, Buenos Aires, Rosario et Cordoba. Le gouvernement du président Nestor Kirchner vient de recevoir la proposition financière du consortium Veloxia composé d'Alstom, de la compagnie espagnole Isolux Corsan et des sociétés argentines Emepa et Iecsa. Les travaux devraient coûter 1,3 milliard de dollars.


Après avoir envisagé un train moins rapide entre Rosario et Cordoba, le gouvernement a opté pour la grande vitesse sur les deux tronçons. Avec une vitesse qui pourrait atteindre 320 km/h, le train reliera la capitale à Rosario en 90 minutes, puis atteindre Cordoba après 95 autres minutes de voyage. Une révolution pour les passagers qui devaient rouler près de dix heures, ou prendre l'avion.


La commission technique a jusqu'au 10 mai pour étudier la « cohérence économique » du projet, pour finalement signer le contrat le 30 juillet. Confiant, Alstom a déjà lancé le recrutement de nouvelles équipes à Buenos Aires pour démarrer les travaux au plus vite. Les deux autres groupes en compétition (notamment le grand rival allemand, Siemens) ont jeté l'éponge face aux difficultés à monter un financement viable.


Des conditions intéressantes


Le gouvernement argentin exige que le gagnant prenne en charge au moins 50 % du financement des travaux. « Une proportion énorme, estime un proche du dossier. C'est un risque que beaucoup d´entreprises ne veulent pas prendre. » Avec l'appui de la Société générale, Alstom s'engage à couvrir plus de 70 % des investissements dans des conditions intéressantes : le gouvernement a seize ans pour rembourser cet apport à un taux de 4,6 % en euros (5,39 % en dollars).


Pour Buenos Aires, le projet d'Alstom a aussi pour avantage d´impliquer l'industrie locale. Alors que le gouvernement avait fixé une participation d'au moins 20 %, elle devrait atteindre 65 %.


Après avoir perdu en 2006 un appel d'offres pour la construction d´usines électriques, Alstom veut démontrer sa volonté d'investir en Argentine. Outre la liaison Buenos Aires-Rosario-Cordoba, le gouvernement de Nestor Kirchner fait du transport ferroviaire l'un des axes de sa politique. Il devrait lancer d´ici à la fin de l'année deux appels d´offres pour relier la capitale à la cité balnéaire de Mar de Plata au sud, et à Mendoza à l'ouest. Alstom veut aussi profiter de la volonté de plusieurs grandes villes de réintroduire le tramway. Le gouvernement a tout intérêt à conclure au plus vite avec Alstom. Nestor Kirchner tient à ce que les travaux commencent avant le printemps austral. Il sera alors en pleine campagne pour la présidentielle d'octobre.

http://www.lefigaro.fr/actubourse/20...ns_le_tgv.html
 

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argentina don´t need hig speed NOW! ...the argentinians (we) need solutions to problems we have in the suburban sistem of transpot... a lot of people die every day because trains in buienos aires are not secure...are old, ...all our infraestructure is abandoned..all our infraestructure is old...trains are dirty , have technical problems... our government announced tHIs high speed line ....BUT IT IS NOT TRUE! ARGENTINA HASN´T $$$$$$ ..we´re poor and I believe the government is not going to do any......I know
 

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Wouldn't it have made more sense to have it go from Rosario to Santa Fe - Parana then to Cordoba? Would it have added that much more time to the trip, yet covered more provinces/cities?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Wouldn't it have made more sense to have it go from Rosario to Santa Fe - Parana then to Cordoba? Would it have added that much more time to the trip, yet covered more provinces/cities?
While the Santa Fe/Paraná urban area has a population of about 700.000, greater Cordoba has twice that much. Of course, if the high speed train to Córdoba or just Rosario is built, it would be a logical choice to extend it to Santa Fe at a later stage.

argentina don´t need hig speed NOW! ...the argentinians (we) need solutions to problems we have in the suburban sistem of transpot... a lot of people die every day because trains in buienos aires are not secure...are old, ...all our infraestructure is abandoned..all our infraestructure is old...trains are dirty , have technical problems... our government announced tHIs high speed line ....BUT IT IS NOT TRUE! ARGENTINA HASN´T $$$$$$ ..we´re poor and I believe the government is not going to do any......I know
Investing in intercity rail along Argentina's main domestic corridor shouldn't affect the government's ability to also improve local trains. These are different needs and they should be addressed separetely. Argentina's current fiscal situation is good enough to do this now, even if it's not a rich country.
 

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:eek:hno: jajaja..miren loco..creo que por ahora hay que preocuparse por las lineas del conurbano y restaurar las de larga distancia...asi de atrasados como estamos..asi vamos a seguir lamentablemwnte..por no hacer las cosas a tiempo....no saltemos de locomotoras a vapor a pedir altas velocidad de una...el gobierno argentino siempre hace lo mismo...primero se tiene que ocupar del ganado del conurbano y el resto del pais antes que acer esto..que por ahora parece lejano
 

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:eek:hno: jajaja..miren loco..creo que por ahora hay que preocuparse por las lineas del conurbano y restaurar las de larga distancia...asi de atrasados como estamos..asi vamos a seguir lamentablemwnte..por no hacer las cosas a tiempo....no saltemos de locomotoras a vapor a pedir altas velocidad de una...el gobierno argentino siempre hace lo mismo...primero se tiene que ocupar del ganado del conurbano y el resto del pais antes que acer esto..que por ahora parece lejano
Could someone translate?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Good to see this ... my impression was that passenger rail transport in latin America wasn't exactly booming.
It's still quite bad in Argentina, even after a long and extensive privatization process during the last decade, which actually saw most inter-urban services dissapear. Strangely, the state is now paying almost as much subsidies to the private railway companies as they did fifteen years ago to the state-owned railway company, even though the former didn't have to keep the latter's extensive long-distance network.
 

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Excellent looking project, could the line eventually be extended to Mendoza/Santiago de Chile/Valparaiso or are the mountains too big to make this practical?
 

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The project is very interesting but making a good underground and urban transport in Buenos Aires is very very necessary, because Buenos Aires has a lot of inhabitants and they need to move with freedom.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Excellent looking project, could the line eventually be extended to Mendoza/Santiago de Chile/Valparaiso or are the mountains too big to make this practical?
In fact a few months ago the government announced the return of passenger trains between Buenos Aires and Mendoza, a project which is supposed to include upgrading of the current tracks for up to 160 Km/h. But even though using the high-speed line between Buenos Aires and Villa María (south of Córdoba) would have been an interesting option (at least in my opinion), it seems they prefered the San Martín Railway, probably because it's much more direct. Anyway, they are still not done with the planning so let's see what they come up with in the end.

A connection between Mendoza and Santiago or Valparaíso probably wouldn't make much sense for passenger service. There's a project for a freight railway, but they're having a hard time finding bidders.
 
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Excellent looking project, could the line eventually be extended to Mendoza/Santiago de Chile/Valparaiso or are the mountains too big to make this practical?
I think it would be better or easier extended first to the Uruguayan capital, Monteviveo, because is nearer from Buenos Aires (actually only 3 hours, nearer than Rosario) .


Then it would be better the extension to Mendoza and then to Santiago (what I don't know how difficult it would be because of the mountains, and about how high the mountains are I would say very high, many of them -including the Aconcagua, the higest in the Americas- are over 6000m).

For now the only possible city to include in a second part is Mar del Plata if I'm not mistaken (or was it Bahia Blanca?), that is the largest city with coast over the Atlantic sea and its a big summer destination, very touristic.
 
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The project is very interesting but making a good underground and urban transport in Buenos Aires is very very necessary, because Buenos Aires has a lot of inhabitants and they need to move with freedom.

The subway system is having three new lines between this two years and is quite ok, i would make it a couple of changes, but i travel everyday and personally I don't have problems with the service, quite efficient imo. But three new lines are ok, i think the last one had been added like 15 or 20 years ago! (Well I don't know if any Argie knows send me a PM, I don't want to change the subject of thi thread).
 
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