SkyscraperCity Forum banner

Australia doesn't need states: Howard

2413 Views 42 Replies 22 Participants Last post by  ABS
HAH:

Age

Australia doesn't need states: Howard
By Tim Colebatch, Farrah Tomazin
March 25, 2005



Australia would be better off without state governments, Prime Minister John Howard declared yesterday as he strongly backed Treasurer Peter Costello's demand that the states abolish $2.5 billion in business taxes.

Speaking on radio about the federal-state tax deadlock, Mr Howard said it would be better if Australia had no state governments - adding that it was "unrealistic" to wish for that now.

"If we were starting Australia all over again, I wouldn't support having the existing state structure," he said. "I would actually support having a national government, and perhaps a series of regional governments having the power of, say, the Brisbane City Council (Australia's most powerful local government).

"But we're not starting Australia all over again, and the idea of abolishing state governments is unrealistic."

In response to Mr Howard's comments, Premier Steve Bracks' spokeswoman Jane Wilson said last night: "The Premier has said many times that both levels of Government should co-operate to deliver better outcomes for Victorians."

Mr Howard's open declaration of centralist views lines him up with former Labor prime ministers Gough Whitlam and Bob Hawke. The Liberal Party at the time strongly opposed their views, and has long stood as defender of the federal system.

But with Labor in power in all eight states and territories, Mr Howard is leading an invasion of state powers on an increasingly wide front. His Government's proposed industrial relations changes will take control of industrial relations now in state hands. In education, it is setting up its own technical colleges to compete with state systems, and it has attached increasingly stringent conditions on funding of state schools, including requiring every school to have a flagpole.

Health Minister Tony Abbott has proposed a federal takeover of public hospitals, although Mr Howard has opposed this on the pragmatic ground that running hospitals is a political minefield.

Mr Howard also said he was optimistic that the deadlock over the GST could be broken if the states came back to the negotiating table "with a proposal consistent with both the spirit and the letter of the original agreement".

On Wednesday, Mr Costello hinted that the Federal Government might walk away from its agreement to give the $35 billion a year GST revenue to the states.

Wednesday's meeting of treasurers in Canberra broke up after the states unanimously rejected Mr Costello's demand that they scrap seven little-known taxes on business, which the states in 1999 had promised to "review" in 2005.

Abolishing the first six taxes would cost the states $2.5 billion a year, rising to close to $5 billion a year - roughly 10 per cent of the states' own tax base - when the seventh tax, stamp duty on conveyancing for business properties, is scrapped.

If business uses the proceeds to boost profits, 30 per cent of the states' losses would flow straight to the Federal Government as company tax.

:cry:
See less See more
1 - 20 of 43 Posts
Three levels of government is far too many.
I agree that Australia shouuld have been set up with one national government and regional (Local) governments. BCC works fantastically, because there's very little arguement about roads upgrades across local council boundaries, water supplies ect. BCC and GCCC both work fantastically. In NSW and WA, it's been the premier who has annouced desalination plants for Sydney and Perth. GCCC itself is considering desalination. GCCC owns Hinze Dam, the city's main water source. BCC has presented the Trans-Apex plan. A multi-billion dollar tunnels project. That would never happen in the other states.
See less See more
Anyone find it a tad hypocritical that Howard comes out and says this now when he's fighting the states over tax, but when the referendum on the republic was on who was trying to push NT to statehood because it would be a gauranteed state against the republic? giving howard the 4 to 3 he thought he would need to defeat the referendum? (as it turns out only victoria voted in favour anyway....hmm does that say something on the progressive nature of victoria compared to the rest of the country?

Also howard and the rest of the monarchists were scare mongering about the constitutional changes needed to make australia a republic, well anyone who has actually read the constitution would know it would be absolutely impossible to keep the current constitution and disolve the states, the whole thing would have to be thrown out an re-written....
See less See more
wowsim said:
Anyone find it a tad hypocritical that Howard comes out and says this now when he's fighting the states over tax, but when the referendum on the republic was on who was trying to push NT to statehood because it would be a gauranteed state against the republic? giving howard the 4 to 3 he thought he would need to defeat the referendum? (as it turns out only victoria voted in favour anyway....hmm does that say something on the progressive nature of victoria compared to the rest of the country?

Also howard and the rest of the monarchists were scare mongering about the constitutional changes needed to make australia a republic, well anyone who has actually read the constitution would know it would be absolutely impossible to keep the current constitution and disolve the states, the whole thing would have to be thrown out an re-written....

State Formal For Against
-------------------------------------------------------------------
NSW 3,913,142 1,817,380 (46.4) 2,096,562 (53.6) *
Vic 2,988,674 1,489,536 (49.8) 1,499,138 (50.2) *
Qld 2,094,052 784,060 (37.4) 1,309,992 (62.6) *
WA 1,104,826 458,306 (41.5) 646,520 (58.5) *
SA 977,444 425,869 (43.6) 551,575 (56.4) *
Tas 312,784 126,271 (40.4) 186,513 (59.6) *
ACT 201,061 127,211 (63.3) + 73,850 (36.7)
NT 91,028 44,391 (48.8) 46,637 (51.2) +
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Total 11,683,811 5,273,024 (45.1) 6,410,787 (54.9) *
-------------------------------------------------------------------
The proposal was rejected nationally and in six states and was
therefore not carried.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
See less See more
the constitutional consequences of scrapping division of power/seperation of power will be chaotic. Australia is one of the most politically stable nation in the world. We don't need to change that.
Matixvolta said:
the constitutional consequences of scrapping division of power/seperation of power will be chaotic. Australia is one of the most politically stable nation in the world. We don't need to change that.
Reason for that stability is that the govt. is not interested in vying into huge national infrastructure projects ( 3 gorges Dam, NEW Hong Kong Airport, etc) They are happy to push buttons and let the country population stagnate (no huge increase in immigration) and even fall in some states.
See less See more
Randwicked said:
State Formal For Against
-------------------------------------------------------------------
NSW 3,913,142 1,817,380 (46.4) 2,096,562 (53.6) *
Vic 2,988,674 1,489,536 (49.8) 1,499,138 (50.2) *
Qld 2,094,052 784,060 (37.4) 1,309,992 (62.6) *
WA 1,104,826 458,306 (41.5) 646,520 (58.5) *
SA 977,444 425,869 (43.6) 551,575 (56.4) *
Tas 312,784 126,271 (40.4) 186,513 (59.6) *
ACT 201,061 127,211 (63.3) + 73,850 (36.7)
NT 91,028 44,391 (48.8) 46,637 (51.2) +
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Total 11,683,811 5,273,024 (45.1) 6,410,787 (54.9) *
-------------------------------------------------------------------
The proposal was rejected nationally and in six states and was
therefore not carried.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
my bad i thought it got 50%, but yeah .2% off and a hell of a lot closer than any of the other states
See less See more
If one level of government were to be removed, I'd prefer local to get the arse (and have more members in the LA and LC, something similar to the proposal put forward by Kennet in his heyday).

getting rid of 'Victoria' as an entity would mark going back to the days of malapportionment that plagued Victoria pre 1950s - as with no 'Victoria' regional / rural councils would merge and attempt to exert as much power over the metropolitan councils and no doubt cause all sorts of f*ckery at the national level.
See less See more
The aboltion of the state governments is far from a new suggestion. It's been argued over for years. Frankly, all they do is rack up huge administrative costs and do very little and try to argue out of their responsibilities - shouldering them off to the federal government(the feds do the same).
Howard is just trying to muddy the waters as usual to cover up his own failures.
There is no hope of the States being abolished as they ARE the Federation.
In fact Victoria could leave the Commonwealth and become a sovereign Republic easier.
I remember my teacher specifically stating that we should be proud that we were the only state that voted for a republic.
OzAsian said:
Howard is just trying to muddy the waters as usual to cover up his own failures.
Care to be specific in relation to this issue?
mic said:
I remember my teacher specifically stating that we should be proud that we were the only state that voted for a republic.
Not true. The question was deliberately phrased to get the result it got. A head of state voted in by a 2/3 majority of parliament.
sirhc8 said:
The aboltion of the state governments is far from a new suggestion. It's been argued over for years. Frankly, all they do is rack up huge administrative costs and do very little and try to argue out of their responsibilities - shouldering them off to the federal government(the feds do the same).
State governments are the ones voters have the greatest amount of contact with; health, education, transportation, planning (through local and state) the list of services provided by them (whether indirectly financed by the federal government, ala universities or whatever) is very big, but they 'rack up huge administrative costs and do very little' ?

What are you smoking? can I have some? ;)
See less See more
Of the points you listed - health, education, transportation, planning - I can see no evidence of any investment by the NSW state government.
Health and education should be federal responsibilities as it is now, transport and planning are both local and federal issues.
All it does it creates another layer of bureaucracy.
See less See more
sirhc8 said:
Health and education should be federal responsibilities as it is now, transport and planning are both local and federal issues.
come again? :sly:
Matixvolta said:
the constitutional consequences of scrapping division of power/seperation of power will be chaotic. Australia is one of the most politically stable nation in the world. We don't need to change that.
Well at the moment there's a massive power struggle.

I don't think anyone will argue against kicking out most of the councils as having so many virtually eliminates any possibility of having a regional plan.

And could killing the states work? Yes. Keep in mind that our nation only has the population of the Greater New York Metropolitan area, and the state of New York itself is home to many more.

What I would do is have the State Government use its power to kick out all the councils and merge them into a number of "regional councils".

All the State Government of NSW has done in the last 10 years is screw up the hospitals, screw up the trains and screw up the roads. Personally, I don't care as much about the roads... but that's me as I'd rather see investment in rail infrastructure (the "real" infrastructure). The only thing positive about the State Gov is that they're actually doing the study on the Cronulla branch duplification. That's further than any of the other State Gov's got in recent times on that.

Australia needs to think large-scale. Particularly in Sydney, which I think is destined to remain Australia's powerhouse economy. Even though it hasn't grown much of late, it still dominates the nation's economic activity by a long shot. Intra- and Inter-regional transportation are important to Sydney. Both have been neglected, and THAT, not the housing prices, is what I believe is holding this city back from becoming the powerful city it should be. High housing prices haven't stopped many of the world's major cities from growing.
See less See more
Queensland is unique in that most of the population does not live in one single city. Unlike Brisbane, a government just for Perth would be almost the same as the current WA government, and sadly, the larger local governments we have already in WA seem to attract corruption. Seperating the South West from Perth would just cause economic problems, and the combined population of the area outside the South West and Perth is smaller than some current local councils in Perth.

As for giving the federal government more powers, WA and Perth don't get their fair share of attention or money as it is.
See less See more
G
Canberra wouldn't have a damn clue about the needs of people in remote parts of WA or QLD. Though there is a natural overhead to having a State level of Govt, due to the physical size and distance between population centres, the State administrations are definitely justified, in my opinion.
1 - 20 of 43 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top