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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Who is- or was- the Infrastructure PM of Australia?

Tony Abbott has recently recently claimed this title: are there other contenders?
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 · (Edited)
OK, this was meant to be a poll ...

I'd like to nominate Ben Chifley as the "Infrastructure PM":

Ben Chifley initiated the Snowy Mountains Hydro Scheme: which certainly took more than a decade to finish. It wasn't inspired by swinging marginal seats, and it wasn't motivated by immediate political advantage.

It's to the credit of his successor- Sir Robert Menzies, Lord Warden of the Cinque Ports- had the brains to proceed with this, rather than tearing up everything his predecessors had planned. Menzies grew up in Jeparit, in the Wimmera of Victoria: on a wheat farm, not the North Shore. Chifley, of course, started off as an engine-driver.

What Chifley had and Abbott misses: is a vision to make the Nation better. Work that out: Abbott's self-styled claim to fame is that he will build freeways: not where they're needed- but where they suit his political ends.
 

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If you want to have another go at PM Abbott, why not just put it into the dedicated political thread?

And if you really wanted a discussion about Australia's history of infrastructure projects, I'm afraid that you gave away what looks like your bigger agenda pretty quickly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
If you want to have another go at PM Abbott, why not just put it into the dedicated political thread?

And if you really wanted a discussion about Australia's history of infrastructure projects, I'm afraid that you gave away what looks like your bigger agenda pretty quickly.
I think "Infrastructure" is rather bigger than pork-barrelling: not sure what you mean by the "dedicated political thread", but let's face it, We have have a PM who claims to be the "Infrastructure PM".

I'm challenging that ...
 

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My point is it's fine to create a thread about big infrastructure projects. We could have some interesting discussions/pictures about the Snowy scheme, Woomera, Great Ocean Road, Indian Pacific, Darwin railway, SHB, Story Bridge, highways, standardising rail, etc, etc.

But by your second post, the second post also of the thread you are getting stuck into Abbott. Why not save that for the politics thread, if you just want to go on about what a terrible PM you think he is then put it in there. Is ranting about Abbott your only justification for this thread?
 

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So why do you define infrastructure as dams, bridges, roads and railways?

How about 21st century infrastructure? Telecommunications, networks, powerlines?

Australia has invested more in infrastructure over the last 10-20 years than it has at any time in the past. This investment has pretty much all been driven by the private sector in regulated and non regulated industries (mainly mobile networks, power distribution, urban toll roads, gas pipelines and private rail & port infrastructure).

The 'infrastructure prime minister' is not the halfwit that thinks its 1950 and wants the goverment to fund a whole bunch of roads, its the prime minister (and treasurer) that undertook the fundamental microeconomic reforms that allowed the current wave of private sector investment.

Take a bow Hawke/Keating.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Aussie Bhoy, Can't actually see what the problem is ... We have an (no sorry THE) Infrastructure PM, and I'll tell it straight, rather than arguing the toss over whether this should be in another thread ( we might get onto this subsequently, but what you're saying is that there shouldn't be a thread about the "Infrastructure PM" ).

In the event of Ben Chifley losing the mantle, I'd like to propose a second PM: Paul Keating, who had the nouse to convert Melbourne to Adelaide Rail to Standard Gauge: and I think linked things through to Darwin.
 

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Just building infrastructure isn't a complete gauge either - it needs to be useful.

Refer to Victoria where we've got umpteen grain lines paralleling each other. They're now a liability and it's not feasible to keep them all up to standard, so they're basically used until they fall apart.

Some also had it easy due to global economic conditions, others did not - a government that built a fair bit of infrastructure, but could have built much more and instead chose to split open the coffers for tax cuts is not as good in my eyes as a government that made more modest contributions but only because it was not possible to do any more.
 

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# Kevin Rudd. With the NBN, which is the largest infrastructure program in the history of the country.

We are talking about real stuff OK !
 

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I imagine one of those stock images of a child showing a grandparent the internet... here we go:



Then I can see the grandchild holding their head screaming, What have I created!?
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I still stand by Chifley.

Obviously the "Snowy Mountains Scheme" wasn't something that Chifley dreamt up one night (after all, ne was only an engine driver).

No, there were many of "bureaucrats" who manufactured this ... but we all know "bureaucrats" are just a waste of money, don't we children ...

That's why, today, we let our "elected representatives" and their "Ministerial Staff" get on with the job ... who will choose the projects most suited to ensure re-election ... and out-source the work to ... well, of course if they knew anyone, it'd be all readily available for public scutiniy, wouldn't it?
 

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Yeah but remember the whohar from the Greens about diverting the Snowy River....the Age and Argus were full of it for months !
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Yeah but remember the whohar from the Greens about diverting the Snowy River....the Age and Argus were full of it for months !
God, I'd really love to know what "The Argus" said about The Greens' take on diverting the Snowy River ... fill me in.

Seriously, the Argus was out of business before the Snowy River Scheme ever got started ... And the Snowy River Scheme was pretty much finished before the birth of the Greens.

I think what you're talking about is the re-direction of water of water back along the Snowy ... championed most notably by the Victorian Independent Craig Ingram, Member for East Gippsland.
 

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God, I'd really love to know what "The Argus" said about The Greens' take on diverting the Snowy River ... fill me in.

Seriously, the Argus was out of business before the Snowy River Scheme ever got started ... And the Snowy River Scheme was pretty much finished before the birth of the Greens.

I think what you're talking about is the re-direction of water of water back along the Snowy ... championed most notably by the Victorian Independent Craig Ingram, Member for East Gippsland.
.............nah, just me using an historic bent with current attitudes...
 

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In the event of Ben Chifley losing the mantle, I'd like to propose a second PM: Paul Keating, who had the nouse to convert Melbourne to Adelaide Rail to Standard Gauge: and I think linked things through to Darwin.
Darwin was Tim Fischer (Deputy PM and Transport Minister at the time) who himself is a train buff.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Darwin was Tim Fischer (Deputy PM and Transport Minister at the time) who himself is a train buff.
I know Tim Fischer was Deputy PM, and a " train buff" ... though what that means is that saw a need to stick a rail line north to south through Central Australia.

I took my daughter to Alice Springs by Rail in the late eighties ... that was Keating's funding, not Fischer's. I'm not sure when the line got through to Darwin.

I'd suggest here- that Tony has probably shot himself in both feet already, regarding being "The Infrastructure PM". He's chosen specific projects- some, like the "Western Link" through here quite controversial, and, quite frankly, has sought to pork-barrel marginal electorates. It's not going to work, and there's no way Abbott is ever going to be acclaimed as the "Infrastructure PM". Dare I say he should have allowed the Public to attribute him this title: having proclaimed himself "Infrastructure PM" and the cut $80 billion (over "foreward estimates") out of State Government's Budgets: it washes pretty thin.

From what I understand, the whole thing about investing in Infrastructure was dependent upon getting State Governments to sell off Infrastructure in the first place ... to "recycle" it.

I think the message for Tony Abbott is: you want to crap on about a "Budget Disaster", then people are going to start looking at the figures. Consider George Btandis's $15,000 bookcases, for instance ..... leaving aside his notable travel expenses. Now, those bookcases ... George is such a well informed man, isn't he ... I seem to remember the highlight of his political career was the Declaration: "Everyone has a Right to be a Bigot!"

I don't know what George Brandis- our Attorney General- has in those bookcases, but those bookcases- that Public infrastructure- was Public money, mispent.
 
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