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This city in Spain seems to have ocean all around it. How is this city supposed to grow? Well.. now a new train-tram project is giving the city a tram-train service. This is very interesting in the way that why cant other small cities do that too? The city also have 2 underground stations "wow"

If someone have pics of this system, please post them.
 

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Note, if you are to start a new thread, please post with the correct naming convention/structure. Next time, one will have to repost if the thread is started incorrectly.
 

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Recondita armonia
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The Tram-train part of the project is already in service, and the two underground stations opened about 10 years ago. However, at present only suburban and long distance trains use this line. The tram line is supposed to open in 2012, although recently the justice has stopped the works due to a lack of project in one of the sections of the line, so maybe there will be a delay.
 

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Recondita armonia
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In other words, a court has paralysed the works because the project of the line wasn't correctly approved by the Andalusian government and there were also mistakes with the expropriations. Here you have a link to the thread in the Spanish forum, where you'll find more information, but in Spanish.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=422815&page=3
 

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From Railway Gazette:

http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/passenger/single-view/view/first-cadiz-tram-train-arrives.html

First Cádiz tram-train arrives
12 Jul 2016



SPAIN: The Andalucía regional government announced on July 7 that the first of seven vehicles being supplied by CAF for the Cádiz tram-train project had arrived at the new rolling stock maintenance facility in Chiclana de la Frontera.

Following delivery by road from the CAF Santana plant in Linares, the three-section LRV is now being reassembled with a view to commencing dynamic testing between Chiclana and San Fernando in September. Technical assistance for the trials is being provided by 2 IT and the operator of the Tenerife light rail network

...
 

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Recondita armonia
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^^ Tests will start in September. Expected opening in Spring 2017 (five years later than originally planned :bash:).
 

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Recondita armonia
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^^ There are proposals to create a second line between Cádiz and Puerto Real using the second bay bridge, which opened last year. Actually the bridge was designed with reserved space for public transport (currently buses), that can be used for trams in the future.

However, there are no plans to create a tram network in Jerez. There were some proposals before the economic crisis started, but they were abandoned long time ago, there's no money.
 

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Could somebody explain why in Spain, most of the Tram that have been built or not in service since years : Cadiz, Jaen? It seems that they lack of integration with other modes, even good planification which explain their poor patronage. As well as out of Madrid, Metro which are always delayed : Bcn, L9/10 ; Malaga extensions etc...
 

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Could somebody explain why in Spain, most of the Tram that have been built or not in service since years : Cadiz, Jaen? It seems that they lack of integration with other modes, even good planification which explain their poor patronage. As well as out of Madrid, Metro which are always delayed : Bcn, L9/10 ; Malaga extensions etc...
This thread is not about Spain, but about the Cadiz Bay tram.
If you want explanations about other places, do ask them in the threads pertaining to those places, otherwise we'd be entering one of those eternal off-topics that lead nowhere.
In this case, it has a lot to do with poor planning, and lack of money.
Probably also corruption, although I am not certain of that, as I don't have that much insight into this particular tram-train.
 

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This thread is not about Spain, but about the Cadiz Bay tram.
If you want explanations about other places, do ask them in the threads pertaining to those places, otherwise we'd be entering one of those eternal off-topics that lead nowhere.
In this case, it has a lot to do with poor planning, and lack of money.
Probably also corruption, although I am not certain of that, as I don't have that much insight into this particular tram-train.
It has to do with Cadiz as it's exactly what is happening there and also a lot of cities in Spain. That's not "off topic". In France, none of the Tram has known this kind of situation out of more than 25 !
 

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Sister Greed U
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🔼 🔼 🔼
Okay then. I will answer.

Could somebody explain why in Spain, most of the Tram that have been built or not in service since years : Cadiz, Jaen?
Most of the trams that have been built in Spain are in service.
Some are doing okay, others are doing very well.

The only exceptions in Andalusia are:

-The Cadiz tram-train, still unopened, but which seems to be progressing in its test runs and integration systems with the Adif network (signalling, etc).
There's no opening date yet though, and with the huge delay it has cumulated, it's best not to dare to give any. It shouldn't take very long though, the way things look like right now. Only that over the years the project has advanced at a pace that makes snails look supersonic.

-The Jaen tram, still unopened too, and which got caught in a rather shambolic legal/political/budgetary imbroglio between the Andalusian regional government, the Jaen town council, and the Jaen city bus long-standing operator. It did test runs with passengers, but just when it was going to open... it didn't, and the situation has been in a legal limbo for over 10 years now. However, it seems that things could change there as well. In part this has to do with the fact that the Andalusian former government was outvoted in the last regional elections.

-An unfinished line in suburban Seville, because of lack of government budget. It isn't cancelled though.

-Then there was the Velez-Malaga tramway, which closed down for good. It was supposed to offer a link to another tramway line from Nerja to Malaga that never got built (and it's never been anywhere beyond talks), so understandably it didn't have many passengers since its opening, as it was just a spur that became isolated. That was one big fvck-up, that yes. Its trams are now in I think Melbourne or Sydney (Australia).

It seems that they lack of integration with other modes,
No tram line currently open in Andalusia lacks connections with other modes.
Not that they're perfect, and the way some networks have been planned is debatable, but in the places where the lines have opened the passengers are there, and there are also connections with railways and buses.

And Cadiz won't be an exception, quite the contrary, as it will share tracks and stops with Cercanias Renfe Cadiz.

even good planification which explain their poor patronage.
Which patronage are you talking about, exactly?

As well as out of Madrid, Metro which are always delayed : Bcn, L9/10 ;
That's not in Cadiz or Andalusia at all.

Malaga extensions etc...
There is one Malaga extension in works.
It's taking long, but there's been a quite big crisis in between, and the works themselves are complicated, as they involved the demolition of a very busy bridge in the very core of Malaga city.

But again, this is the Cadiz thread!
 

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Sister Greed U
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That's not "off topic". In France, none of the Tram has known this kind of situation out of more than 25 !
Caen, Nancy, Toulon, Avignon, Marseille have had similar problems.

The Caen tram was a TVR (similar to a Translohr), and it was so unreliable it was judged best to replace it by a normal tramway, which is what Caen has now.
It took many years of faulty TVR service though.
The same applies to Nancy, which has exactly the same problem.
Only that in Nancy the change of system hasn't started yet, and I'm not sure the Nancy TVR is still in use.
If these are not two fvck-ups, I don't know what is a fvck-up, then.

The Toulon tramway never got built because politics.

The Avignon tramway was built and it opened, but as a much smaller network than originally planned.

One particular Marseille tram line (the one between the Belsunce quarter and Castellane, iirc) was in works for many years before it opened. Not as many as the Cadiz tram-train though.

Now back to Cadiz, please.
 

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Caen, Nancy, Toulon, Avignon, Marseille have had similar problems.

The Caen tram was a TVR (similar to a Translohr), and it was so unreliable it was judged best to replace it by a normal tramway, which is what Caen has now.
It took many years of faulty TVR service though.
The same applies to Nancy, which has exactly the same problem.
Only that in Nancy the change of system hasn't started yet, and I'm not sure the Nancy TVR is still in use.
If these are not two fvck-ups, I don't know what is a fvck-up, then.

The Toulon tramway never got built because politics.

The Avignon tramway was built and it opened, but as a much smaller network than originally planned.

One particular Marseille tram line (the one between the Belsunce quarter and Castellane, iirc) was in works for many years before it opened. Not as many as the Cadiz tram-train though.

Now back to Cadiz, please.
Thx for your answer. Nevertheless :
1. There has never been Trams built in France and not in service for decades like in Cadiz or Jaen and noone closed like in Velez Malaga...
2. Murcie or Parla trams are fascos with few passengers and no integration at all with buses (The tram is not even shown on bus map in Murcia !). Integration means fare policy and bus feeder lines to the trams and not competing with it
3. Tram in Granada, Andalucia, don't serve the city center whereas it's on subway.
In France also there are poltical issues that can postpone projects (L5 in Montpellier, L2 in Aubagne etc...) but when they are built, they are totally integrated with bus networks and fare policy.
In the end, Caen and Nancy TVR were built as a "susbstitute" for Tram pretending to be cheaper and no right of way needed as in Nancy. Actually, they were not and decades later, Local Autthorities decided to replace them by acyual Trams, which should've been the case previously.
 
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