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Discussion Starter #1
Bergen will get lightrail in 2010! Norways second largest city with 247 746 people



This project have been debated from A to Z in Norway. Now atlast they are working with getting Bybanen alive from 2010. First line will go from center of Bergen to Nesttun. Later on its talks about extending the line to the airport.



This is how they see it will be. Orange is light-rail system, blue is the trolleyline in Bergen which still runs, red is local rail system, while yellow is the bus system.

The reason why its so long between Bergen central station and Arna is because of a tunnel. I dont know if trains went arround the mountain before or not?
 

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And the light-rail is partly financed by a toll-ring for cars around whole Bergen city=)
Yes the trains went around the mountain i the south past Haukeland and Nesttun=) The rail Garnes - Haukeland in your map is today used as a museum-railway. Read more about the old vossebanen in Norwegian here:
http://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamle_Vossebanen

Stavanger, Trondheim and Grenland is also planning light-rail and many politicians are working for this, hopefully they will follow if only the state would give more money to these kinds of project!
 

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I don't understand what is so fantastic with this light rail. A dedicated bus road network would be more than enough for a small city like Bergen. And now even Grenland want light rail? It will be so expencive, one have to use money that could have been used for a lot of other imortant infrastructure projects.
 

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Busses get stuck in trafic, and are easily overcrowded, light rail get people out of cars a way busses don't because of the comfort=P + no pollution;D Stavanger and Grenlands plans is mostly using existing rails from Jernbaneverket...
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I don't understand what is so fantastic with this light rail. A dedicated bus road network would be more than enough for a small city like Bergen. And now even Grenland want light rail? It will be so expencive, one have to use money that could have been used for a lot of other imortant infrastructure projects.
Well, I show you some cities in Europe with same population as Bergen with trams:

Some from Germany first...

Augsburg: approx. 275,000 inh.



- network length approx. 35.5 km
- 4 lines


Rostock: approx. 199,097 inh. (50000 less people than in Bergen)



- length of the network: 35.5 km (2007)
- 5 lines


Schwerin - approx. 96,000 inh



- network length approx. 21 km
- 3 lines (1, 2, 4) + line 3, which operates only during peak hours.


Mainz - approx. 196,000 inh. (50000 less inh. than in Bergen)



- network length approx. 20 km
- 3 lines


Kassel - approx. 192,000 inh. (50000 less inh. than in Bergen)



- network length (urban sections) approx. 46 km
- 8 urban lines (1-8, + line 9 at certain times only) + 5 RegioTram lines, which run on shared DB railway tracks and urban tram tracks.


So, as you can see. There are several cities in Germany with less than inh. in Bergen. Trams are effective when they run on their own way. They also have more capacity.

There are several other cities like Bergen out there. Thinking of health and how important it is to protect the nature arround Bergen, then trams is the way to go.

Grenland also needs trams, or so called light rail system. A DUO system etc, which can both use train tracks and be a tram in centre etc. The trams should be as silent as they should be. Oslo trams are noisy, but there are several others which is quite silent. I visited Bremen etc, .. first thing that I noticed when landing there was how silent their trams are.



Source:
urbanrail.net
wikipedia.com
 

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Real Norwegian
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But those places are part of HUGE metropolitan areas with 5-6 million people. Of course you cannot compare that to Bergen.

What would be great for Bergen is if you build Bybanen with asfalt instead, and drive buses on the very same track. Then you can connect a lot of bus routes to it. But of course the politicans are to stupid to do other stuff than waisting tax money.

I have a friend, that has developed a lot of the litterature on public transport in Norway, and also some world wide, and he agrees with me.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
We can go under 110 000 this time. A challenge to find, but here they are:


BRANDENBURG (HAVEL) approx. 74,000 inh.



- network length approx. 17.6 km (2.6 km single-track)
- 3 lines


COTTBUS approx. 102,000 inh.



- Total length approx. 20.1 km (Line length 28.6 km), of which 2.1 km is single-track
- 4 lines


FRANKFURT (ODER) approx. 62,000 inh



- network length approx. 19.5 km
- 3 lines (+ 2 peak-hour lines)


GERA approx. 107,000 inh.



- network length approx. 18.5 km
- 3 lines


GÖRLITZ approx. 57,000 inh.



- network length approx. 9 km
- 2 lines: lines 2 and 3


HALBERSTADT approx. 40,000 inh.

- network length approx. 10 km
- 2 lines operating a basic 15 min headway (+ line 3 which operates at weekends only)


There are tons of cities in Germany with less than 110 000 inh. which got tram or DUO systems. Thats something which every city should consider. So Bergen people shouldnt be so hatefull to the Lightrail project. Bergen badly needs it and for the first time politicians are more intelligent than lots of people argumenting on debate sites on net that buses should run there instead. But they are and have been since Bergen quit their tram for over 20 years ago.

So, Norway with only 4.5m people shouldnt be negative towards building such systems, when Norway have far less cities than Germany. And if its true that Norway is worlds 3rd richest country in the world. Then I simply dont understand Norwegians complaining about getting a system that is polute free. I just dont,... and I hope that this post will free some of Norwegians minds that its possible, that Norway could be a nice lightrail country. Its just a matter of choice.


Source:
urbanrail.net
 

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Real Norwegian
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There a plenty of buses that are pollution free too. I understand that it is so cool and funny for a city to get a new toy like a tram, but it not necesarly the best way to use the money.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
its the best way to use money, because ..


1. polute free
2. longer trains
3. no asphalt polution
4. seperated from car traffic

Buses are nice, but they should complement with the tram system. With Bergen building such tramsystem, you will see how effective it will be compared to any bus system out there.

Trams are better in every way. Buses are nice for short stretches etc, but for longer rides. Trams are way better!
 

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Buses can be seperated from traffic, you don't have build the roads for the busses in asphalt, they can be quite long, and they can also be pollute free.

But I think it is better to have a general upgrade of the bus network than just using a lot of money on one single project, that only a tiny part of Bergen will take advantage of.

And what is so nice with long trains? I prefer one bus every 5 minutes instead of one train every 15 minutes.
 

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I think (hope at least) that it will prove to be successful. You have to remember that Bergen, at least during the summers, is also quite a large tourist destination, which will boost the ridership numbers.
 

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If you first want to build a grade separate bus system, it would probably be expensive as well=) Maybe even more expensive? So why not build the rails to increase the capacity and comfort? It will be a sucess and the roads will be less congested and everybody will be happy;P More lines will follow, just got to be pasient... Somebody had to be the first, like all other infrastructure investments..
From bybanen.no said:
Ridership
Estimates of ridership show that between 40,000 and 50,000 passengers on a normal weekday are expected to use the system when it is completed to the airport. The first phase to Nesttun will transport 26,000 passengers per day or about 6,5 million passengers annually.
English info from the city about Bybanen:
http://www.bybanen.no/index.cfm?id=170586
 

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Any idea when the airport part of the line will be done?

I love when cities have rail connections to their airports. It is so annoying having to take a bus or taxi. Given that so many need to get to/from airports, and given that many won't have their own cars (either won't rent one or won't be parking their own car at the airport), having rail to the airport is not only very convenient, it is also very environmental which is great.
 

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Especially since the airport is Bergens only effective connection to other cities and towns, with Norways lousy infrastructure;P It will not be to soon, next step has not even a date set... :(
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I think that Bergen will experience the same thing as Dublin. People there were negative towards their 2 new tramlines. But now as they got built, they are much more used than expected. Infact, car traffic arround those 2 tramlines in Dublin have decreased a lot.

Bergen needs this, but it should have been built to airport now. Porto in Portugal is a nice example on how Bergen should have done it.
 

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The same happened where I lived in the US. People in Salt Lake City were really against the light rail system there, but within a short time after it opened in 1999, it proved to be extremely popular. Since then, another line has opened, and now several new lines are not only being planned but even starting to be built or in the process of being built. And it also stimulated other public transportation projects -- a commuter rail line will be opening this month, and extensions are already planned.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
BERGEN | LRT

At 13.30 on Tuesday 22nd, Bergen got a new light-rail.





Let's hope that the people will use and support it. Its a new icon for Norway's second largest city with 257000 citizens.

:banana::cheers::applause:
 

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I will definitely take this one when going to Brann stadion for football matches. If they only could extend it to Åsane, then we are talking..
 
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