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Rick Scott announces potential high-speed rail linking Tampa and Orlando
By Lawrence Mower 1 hour ago

State officials are taking bids for a new high-speed rail project between Tampa and Orlando, resuming hopes for a line connecting the two cities, Gov. Rick Scott announced Friday.

Scott said an unnamed company has offered to pay for and build the line along I-4, leasing land owned by the state and the Central Florida Expressway Authority.

Taxpayer dollars would not be used, sidestepping the reason why Scott struck down a similar rail proposal seven years ago.
more here

http://www.tampabay.com/florida-pol...al-high-speed-rail-linking-tampa-and-orlando/
 

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So would something like this (BrightLine) terminus at TPA and or a Westshore intermodel station? Or would we see this terminus in downtown Tampa?

Regardless of which one, would hope in the future a local rail line like SunRail would be able to provide connections etc.

Right now I think the Orlando BrightLine is terminating at MCO, so if that was case here would surmise TPA?
 

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Probably downtown Tampa, but they'll (FDOT) probably have to revise TBX plans again.

Sadly, TBX won't go away. We'll probably see an even harder push for it by the power players - arguing it must be built before rail is.
 

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What're the chances of getting something faster than 125 mph for the TPA-ORL route? I know they have said that they have said that they can eventually upgrade the route between Cocoa and Orlando to around 150 mph, so what would prevent them from implementing that speed on this route at the very beginning of the system?

I kind of feel like having the trains continue until reaching Westshore (Intermodel Station) would be kind of pointless. Besides the speed, which it would hardly be able to pick up any between the two stations, I don't see a reduced fare to ride between the two stops being offered and it would crazy to pay a full price for something that could be offered cheaper and faster with a monorail/light rail system. Having one end of the station near the Marion Transfer Station being used for the Brightline (or another system) and then the other end being used for a monorail/light rail system would be ideal IMO.
 

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My guess is the station would end up in DT near Marion Street like the original HSR proposal. I also doubt speeds reach +125mph because of the stop in Lakeland.
Not all trips have to stop in Lakeland. Let's say you run a non-stop service from Tampa to Orlando every hour, and have a "local" service in-between. If you staggered a local service to depart 15 minutes after that trip, you'd give the local train about 25 minutes extra to call at Lakeland and Kissimmee without delaying the next express trip.

Pegging trip times at 50 mins express and 70 mins local (probably 10-15 mins faster, depending on track speed profiles), here's an example twice an hour schedule using 4 consists (named using Brightline trains colors). Each train has between 25 and 35 minutes of prep time at each end to account for delays, cleaning, loading and unloading.

Code:
TPA   LKL   KIS   ORL   TRAIN
1000  XXXX  XXXX  1050  BLUE
1015  1045  1105  1125  RED
1100  XXXX  XXXX  1150  GREEN
1115  1145  1205  1225  YELLOW

ORL   KIS   LKL   TPA   TRAIN
1100  XXXX  XXXX  1150  YELLOW
1115  1145  1205  1225  BLUE
1200  XXXX  XXXX  1250  RED
1215  1245  1305  1325  GREEN
 

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Of course, but look at what's been set up so far. Up to 125mph only on the undeveloped, relatively straight stretch of the Beach Line. Without knowing what anticipated ridership numbers, design of the infrastructure, etc. will be, it's hard to say if there will be local and express and what exact stops will be included in them. Overall, even at a max of 79mph, that's still pretty good speed between Tampa and Orlando.
 

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Of course, but look at what's been set up so far. Up to 125mph only on the undeveloped, relatively straight stretch of the Beach Line. Without knowing what anticipated ridership numbers, design of the infrastructure, etc. will be, it's hard to say if there will be local and express and what exact stops will be included in them. Overall, even at a max of 79mph, that's still pretty good speed between Tampa and Orlando.
If Class 4 (80 MPH) rail is actually what they shoot for, we'd be better off building a busway reserved for public and private motorcoaches. We already have Class 4 rail with SunRail and Amtrak. Most of the currently operating Brightline route from Miami to Fort Lauderdale is also Class 4, due to the number of grade crossings and lack of right of way protection. That's something that the Tampa to Orlando portion should not have to deal with by running in the middle of I-4. The swampy sections of Brightline are planned to run as Class 7 (125 MPH), which is the top speed of Brightline's Siemens Charger locomotives.

For true high speed rail, you're going for Class 6 (110 MPH) at the minimum. This is how fast Amtrak runs along the I-55 corridor in Illinois. For comparison, most of the midwestern freight mainlines and most passenger services in California are Class 5 (90 MPH). Northeast Corridor sections between NYC and Washington DC are Class 6 (110 MPH) with short segments of Class 7 (125 MPH). There are also several Class 6 corridors outside of the NEC in upstate New York, Connecticut, Illinois, Missouri and Michigan. There are very, very few sections of Class 8 out there (145 MPH), mostly in Rhode Island and Massachusetts, and no Class 9 anywhere in North American (this would be your Japan/Euro-style bullet train levels of high speed).
 
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out of curiosity, what are the chances the county could share a portion of the line and run local rail service from downtown (or wherever bright line will terminate) to the casino/ amphitheater?
 

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out of curiosity, what are the chances the county could share a portion of the line and run local rail service from downtown (or wherever bright line will terminate) to the casino/ amphitheater?
No expert, but I feel like it's very unlikely. I think one of the issues with using existing CSX tracks has been the liability and who will cover it and how much it will actually cost the party that takes up the liability issue. Brightline would have an issue with the liability for sure and would easily not take the financial cost of it. I could be wrong though.
 

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My guess is the station would end up in DT near Marion Street like the original HSR proposal. I also doubt speeds reach +125mph because of the stop in Lakeland.
I'm actually wondering if Brightline (or whoever wins the RFP) will include Lakeland in a stop. Not saying they don't deserve one but Lakeland originally wasn't suppose to get a stop in the 2010 proposal until some political wrangling behind the scenes. And like what was mentioned, you could have express trains that bypass the stops between Tampa and Orlando and then have regular service.

My question is, especially if Brightline wins the proposal, does future Orlando station end up in downtown Orlando or does it connect to the existing Brightline line that ends at the OIA?
 

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tampa union station

should the line go to union station -- what a new station might-- could possible-- maybe-- look like -- just for fun

6 tracks-
brightline, Amtrak, commuter rail lines (Pinellas, pasco, polk, manatee and Sarasota) and light rail station (shown elevated thru downtown)-- to south tampa (on existing rail lines) and TIA

video-
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/43015656192/in/dateposted-public/

us1c by URBANoRDER/tampa,inc., on Flickr

north.bmp by URBANoRDER/tampa,inc., on Flickr

u8.bmp by URBANoRDER/tampa,inc., on Flickr

u5.bmp by URBANoRDER/tampa,inc., on Flickr

u2.bmp by URBANoRDER/tampa,inc., on Flickr

us10 by URBANoRDER/tampa,inc., on Flickr

us1.bmp by URBANoRDER/tampa,inc., on Flickr
 

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So my thought would be make a stop in downtown, near Union Station as shown or the planned downtown location near the bus terminal but make the main connection to TIA or close enough to capture the visitors coming and going. You have all that parking and rental cars available. Nothing downtown can compete with the connection at TIA.

Westshore isn't close enough and could't match it....perhaps a plan to connect the Sky Connect to the station with Brightline would work....Brightline would then connect downtown so local rail could focus on other areas to be connected to the downtown hub...
 

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I'm actually wondering if Brightline (or whoever wins the RFP) will include Lakeland in a stop. Not saying they don't deserve one but Lakeland originally wasn't suppose to get a stop in the 2010 proposal until some political wrangling behind the scenes. And like what was mentioned, you could have express trains that bypass the stops between Tampa and Orlando and then have regular service.

My question is, especially if Brightline wins the proposal, does future Orlando station end up in downtown Orlando or does it connect to the existing Brightline line that ends at the OIA?
Brightline put in an unsolicited bid back in March. Rick Scott's office just made this news after being blasted in media about killing the original HSR plan. So it appears the press release was politically motivated. Intercity rail isn't like flying an jet from hub to hub. They don't tend to be successful without intermediary stops. I'd anticipate one or two between Tampa and Orlando and no way in hell, they're going into DT Orlando (as pondered in another post). This line will most definitely be between Orlando's airport terminal and Tampa via the Central Florida Greenway and I-4. Those are the two entities they have bid to run track down their ROW.
 

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Not all trips have to stop in Lakeland. Let's say you run a non-stop service from Tampa to Orlando every hour, and have a "local" service in-between. [/code]
That's a really good idea and could apply to smaller cities along the Treasure Coast as well. Stuart, Port St Lucie, Ft Pierce, Vero Beach, Sebastian and Melbourne are not large enough to merit a major station but could benefit from an intermittent passenger train that runs between the smaller stations and feeds the major stations. That might also quiet the opposition from cities to Brightline running through their downtowns.
 

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I wonder if AAF has been shopping for a downtown parcel large enough to support a multi use and multi modal development similar to Miami Central. We all know AAF is not going to make a lot of money running trains and the best way for them to capitalize on their efforts is through real estate investments at or next to their stations. They have already developed a residential tower next to their WPB station and I expect to see more of that in the future. I don't think they will go any further into the TB area (like St Pete or the airport), they will leave that to commuter rail or buses. Instead I think they will look to expand to Jax and beyond.
 

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That's a really good idea and could apply to smaller cities along the Treasure Coast as well. Stuart, Port St Lucie, Ft Pierce, Vero Beach, Sebastian and Melbourne are not large enough to merit a major station but could benefit from an intermittent passenger train that runs between the smaller stations and feeds the major stations. That might also quiet the opposition from cities to Brightline running through their downtowns.
I would love to see some innovation with our government but I know that many governments are against the risk of innovation. For example, I would think with technology that we have on hand, we could have trains that have their cars separate from the rest of train and stop at a station while the rest of the train continues traveling. And then a train car at the Lakeland station receives a message that the main train will be passing shortly, closes its doors, the main train passes the station, and the train car accelerates up to a speed where it catches up to the main train and attaches it.

It makes more sense in my head haha

As for development around the station, it's already hindered on one side by the 275. Then you have the cemetery that takes away a huge chunk of acres. Then you have the Madison Heights residence that is recently new, so that won't be going anywhere soon. Only possible development opportunities are the Marion Transit Center and the government tower they have there.
 
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