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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Splitting this from the 450 Elizabeth Street thread as they are two separate projects (my fault).

Busy times for minister

ANOTHER proposal has been lodged that is so large that decision-making power bypasses council to rest with Planning Minister Matthew Guy.

This time, on land behind the historic former Royal Saxon Hotel at 441-447 Elizabeth Street, and affecting an adjoining property at 449 Elizabeth Street, a developer plans to develop a 50-level residential tower with 306 flats but just 119 car park bays.

The property was recently identified in the Melbourne City Council's central heritage review as worthy of protection, being one of the oldest surviving buildings of its type.

Trading nowadays as the Toad Hall backpackers, the property was purchased by private investors in 2006 for $4.5 million, from the deceased estate of a family that owned it for several generations. Based on CBD land values of $10,000 a square metre, the site is estimated to be worth about $9 million.

The proposed apartment tower, having a floor area of greater than 25,000 square metres, needs approval by Mr Guy. It isn't expected to be too controversial given the historic component facing Elizabeth Street will be retained. But because the site is not on a corner, apartments in the project risk losing natural light as sites around it are developed.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/business/p...things-grow-20120601-1znb4.html#ixzz1waUOUIra

Peddle Thorpe Architects

Wrong side of the road.. but it looks like this one wants to demolish some Victorian era shops and facade one that's heritage listed...
which means at least the amazing design above is still for 450


Thread title should read 441-447 Elizabeth Street 50L
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·



Massive skyscraper proposed
June 5, 2012

441-451 Elizabeth Street, Melbourne.

A DEVELOPER wants to build a 50-storey skyscraper in an area of Melbourne's CBD with planning restrictions that limit building heights to 30 metres.

A heritage group has raised concerns about the $100 million tower proposal, which means the rear of the former Royal Saxon Hotel (pictured) on Elizabeth Street - one of Melbourne's original hotels and one of the oldest buildings in the CBD - would be demolished.

The developer, Goodyear Properties, has asked Planning Minister Matthew Guy for the go-ahead to build a 145-metre building, with more than 300 residential apartments, a pool deck and rooftop garden.

The proposal would retain the front six metres of the former hotel, which would be incorporated into the new tower.

The Royal Saxon Hotel was built in 1858 and is one of Melbourne's earliest surviving and continuously occupied hotels.

Architect Chris Godsell, from Peddle Thorp Architects, said the hotel building had been significantly altered internally over a long period of time. ''We are proposing to keep the section of the building that was not already altered,'' he said.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/massive-skyscraper-proposed-20120604-1zs9u.html#ixzz1wrN9SX00
 

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I wonder if they will release a render of the tower before it's approved, as it would really show it being massively out of place in the area, even compared to the current towers next door and nearby.

also another blank entrance where a historic building with cafe and restaraunt used to be? reminds me of bad planning like Nauru House.
 

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Yeah, get the title of the story............another negative AGE lean on development. The building may be of some significance yet as the article lastly mentions most of it has been renovated and changed many times. The only historic relevance is the front facade and like many other pubs in Melbourne........It's called...Time..last drinks Ok !
 

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Why anyone would need any more detail before passing judgement on this is beyond me.

Elizabeth and Swanston should be left largely-low rise and every Victorian era building on them should be protected. In fact every pre turn of the century building in this city should be automatically protected. Under that dictum, there's more incentive to knock down eyesores than heritage stock, and the city as a whole is improved.

Peddle Thorp are sh*t. The render already looks sh*t. This whole thing is sh*t
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Why anyone would need any more detail before passing judgement on this is beyond me.

Elizabeth and Swanston should be left largely-low rise and every Victorian era building on them should be protected. In fact every pre turn of the century building in this city should be automatically protected. Under that dictum, there's more incentive to knock down eyesores than heritage stock, and the city as a whole is improved.

Peddle Thorp are sh*t. The render already looks sh*t. This whole thing is sh*t
:applause:

Agreed. This is one of the few nice stretches along Elizabeth St. I don't want to see it screwed up.
 

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I agree with saving heritage and also the old low rise section of central CBD Melbourne but before this story no one knows this building.......It has had many renovations and Melbourne Central among others has rendered the ramshackle bunch of early 20th century buildings in this area of little significance. If the street level facades, awnings and signage were not enough ? I have to say I haven't seen a decent render of the proposal other than the street level incorporating the portion of the old pub so leave my judgement till then but Melbourne is still growing and holding on to some bricks that have only survived because cheap renovation hasn't stolen those remnants already seems a last gasp political call ?....................Sure anyone living holds memories of what was but get real.....this is trash.
 

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Same. But doesn't look good.........

Edit. It's Peddle Thorp, so prepare for dispaire everybody!!
My heart sank when I realised this. I'm trying in vain to be rational though by convincing myself that it won't be a sack of shit.
 

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Massive skyscraper proposed
June 5, 2012

441-451 Elizabeth Street, Melbourne.

A DEVELOPER wants to build a 50-storey skyscraper in an area of Melbourne's CBD with planning restrictions that limit building heights to 30 metres.
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Go for it, drive a stake through the heart of the idiotic "gap" rules. This kind of development (cannot tell for sure if it is good design) is what will be needed to revitalize the horror stretches (but which have portential) of Swanston, Russell and Elizabeth.

Do you really think that the filthy and seedy "back" of an old pub is worth a cracker? Of course not...Facadism does have a place sometimes.
 

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Go for it, drive a stake through the heart of the idiotic "gap" rules. This kind of development (cannot tell for sure if it is good design) is what will be needed to revitalize the horror stretches (but which have portential) of Swanston, Russell and Elizabeth.

Do you really think that the filthy and seedy "back" of an old pub is worth a cracker? Of course not...Facadism does have a place sometimes.
I agree, this stretch of Elizabeth st is currently a desolate shithole (as you can see below) , it really needs an tower that goes against planning rules to overshdaow it, and for 2 of the shops in it's intact streetscape to be demolished for an empty space leading to a concrete wall, look how beatifully that works on Collins st near Exhibition.
seriosly though, we should build many towers as possible in the West end on vacant carparks and ugly low rise 70's office buildings, but leave the human scale historic streets of the gap.



 

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I agree, this stretch of Elizabeth st is currently a desolate shithole (as you can see below) , it really needs an tower that goes against planning rules to overshdaow it, and for 2 of the shops in it's intact streetscape to be demolished for an empty space leading to a concrete wall, look how beatifully that works on Collins st near Exhibition.
seriosly though, we should build many towers as possible in the West end on vacant carparks and ugly low rise 70's office buildings, but leave the human scale historic streets of the gap.



i agree that they should retain those 2 shops for an intact streetscape,,,no cavernous entry void of gloom and windswept dirt, pls
 

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Go for it, drive a stake through the heart of the idiotic "gap" rules. This kind of development (cannot tell for sure if it is good design) is what will be needed to revitalize the horror stretches (but which have portential) of Swanston, Russell and Elizabeth.

Do you really think that the filthy and seedy "back" of an old pub is worth a cracker? Of course not...Facadism does have a place sometimes.
Nice one, supporting something when you admit you can't even tell if it's a good design, renders your opinion pretty worthless, I'd say.

This is not just about the pub, this is also about the neighbouring building that should also have heritage protection. It's about this being one of the few strips of Elizabeth street that really shines, shines because these buildings are to the fore, shines because it's all low rise so it gets full sun most of the day, shines because it's human-scale and humanistic materials.

This is what the whole of Elizabeth and Swanston for that matter could be like. Uniquely Melbourne stretches of largely two storey Victorians restored to their former glory - hopefully one day with cars and awnings banished from both. It should all be protected, it should all be planned for, and people who have a "demolish whatever it is at any cost so long as something new is going up" mindset should be shut out of the decision-making.

People like you destroyed the most beautiful Victorian-era city in the world during the 1960s and 70s, robbing us of a heritage that would have exponentially higher numbers of tourists flocking here now. The short-sighted must never hold sway on development ever again.

That's all I'm sayin'
 

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Nice one, supporting something when you admit you can't even tell if it's a good design, renders your opinion pretty worthless, I'd say.

This is not just about the pub, this is also about the neighbouring building that should also have heritage protection. It's about this being one of the few strips of Elizabeth street that really shines, shines because these buildings are to the fore, shines because it's all low rise so it gets full sun most of the day, shines because it's human-scale and humanistic materials.

This is what the whole of Elizabeth and Swanston for that matter could be like. Uniquely Melbourne stretches of largely two storey Victorians restored to their former glory - hopefully one day with cars and awnings banished from both. It should all be protected, it should all be planned for, and people who have a "demolish whatever it is at any cost so long as something new is going up" mindset should be shut out of the decision-making.

People like you destroyed the most beautiful Victorian-era city in the world during the 1960s and 70s, robbing us of a heritage that would have exponentially higher numbers of tourists flocking here now. The short-sighted must never hold sway on development ever again.

That's all I'm sayin'
...and all i'm saying is put towers behind these things or these simple business frontages will not be able to sustain the plot that they sit upon economically...towers BEHIND THE facades...
 

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441-451 Elizabeth Street, Melbourne.
As I live nearby, I've walked past this strip many, many times and noticed the potential for the former Royal Saxon Hotel building to be one of the truly great buildings to house a high-end restaurant/bar. Behind the paint are hand-made red bricks with weathered stone dressings and the former carriage entrance is still lined with bluestone blocks and intact, potential for an entrance, or to be lined with stalls, housing an art/crafts market all the way through to the rear.

I also despair when I read that Peddle Thorp are the architects. :eek:hno:
 

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Get rid of the gap. Precinct conservation works around universities and stuff but we need more accommodation for more people. Those businesses will survive with street frontage to new developments. Heritage precincts need careful mgt to avoid becoming economic wastelands and careful mgt not something this country famous for!
 

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Great eateries, i know that because i had a delicious Malaysian lunch there on Wedensday and it has a nice street level scale. Nothing special at the back infact quite rundown. Only the Vic-era facade is worth retaining with the tower set back but any development should be sympathetic to the street scape coz i would hate for intimate feel to be destroyed
 
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