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Atlanta has a population (424,000) just slightly larger than that of the City of Manchester (398,000UKgov fig), but has more skyscrapers (buildings over 30 stories) than all English cities combined. Altlanta Hartsfield Airport is a true "HUB" airport and handled 81 million pax last year, and is still growing with new airline applications on a waiting list, in contrast to Manchester Airport handling 22 million and fighting off challenges from nearby LPL, EMA, BHX and now Doncaster. Atlanta is the largest city in Georgia with inward investment totaling almost a billion dollars a year for the past 19 years and this figure is expected to grow in future years. In excess of 1500 companies with a capitalisation of 1 billion, or more, call Atlanta home. Atlanta Municipal Planning Authority are presently considering applications for 37 projects, all over 120m in height.

Manchester by contrast has competition from Leeds, Liverpool and Birmingham for tall buildings. Granted, Manchester have allies in the inept council at Liverpool but that still leaves a very competative Leeds and Birmingham to vie with for inward investment. But, that's not to say that in 10 years Manchesters skyline couldn't match present day Atlantas, just highly unlikely.
 

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I thought you were going to compare figures then. The only ones you did compare were the meaningless city boundary populations and airport stats which are not directly comparible. 'Atlanta' uses aviation as a means of primary domestic inter-city travel, whereas 'manchester' does not depend so much on aviation traffic.

I would be interested to see the inward ivestment figures for manchester, yet this is not so clear cut e.g. investment into warrington, Wimslow, Burnley, Huddersfield etc would not be included in the manchester figure (or liverpool/leeds), but similar outlying suburbs of Atlanta probably would be included in Atlanta because of the spatial/demographic arrangment differences of the two countries.

If just the city CBD were concerned, then Atlanta's inward investment would be several times higher.

(There is a point somewhere here!)
 

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Jerv said:
I would be interested to see the inward ivestment figures for manchester, yet this is not so clear cut e.g. investment into warrington, Wimslow, Burnley, Huddersfield etc would not be included in the manchester figure (or liverpool/leeds), but similar outlying suburbs of Atlanta probably would be included in Atlanta because of the spatial/demographic arrangment differences of the two countries.
If just the city CBD were concerned, then Atlanta's inward investment would be several times higher.

(There is a point somewhere here!)
The figures are for the political boundry governed by Mayor Shirley Franklin, the City of Atlanta. With reference to what you wrote above; Warrington, Wimslow, Burnley, Huddersfield (Yorkshire isn't it?) are not Manchester.

The point here is that I am very sceptical that Manchesters skyline will match that of Atlantas, in 10 years, because of all that I wrote. British cities, outside the capital, are provincial cities, whether or not they call themselves regional capitals or not. Inward investment is directed by the central government with very little input, outside of political lobbying, from the recipient cities. The mayor of Atlanta along with the govenor of the State of Georgia have the authority to offer tax and cash incentives to companies to relocate and build in Atlanta, the leaders of Manchester, Liverpool, Birmingham, Leeds et al do not.
 

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Accura_Preston said:
I dont think Manchester's skyline will ever be as clustered as that...
But, "clustered" or not and believe it or not, Atlanta is a wonderful uncluttered people freindly city. Atlanta is a beatiful city with many open spaces and public squares and, is very people freindly downtown. Accura, you would be surprised at the open spaces you will find amid the canyons of concrete and steel in North American cities.
 

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If Manchester ever ends up with a city centre like Atlanta's - dead, I will cry.
American cities like Atlanta are essentially business parks. There's nothing going on and they feel strilised and soulless. (sweeping generalisation of course but based on reality) If Manchester wanted so badly, to collect a load of phallusses together to be bigger and better than leeds!!? It would need to demolish its personality.

Manchester is an absolutely superb city at the moment. We should have no reason to aspire to cities like Atlanta. Atlanta would give all of its tall buildings for a city centre with the life of Manchester's. We don't "need" tall buildings to drag attention to our cities like many cities feel they do. Our cities are amazing and tall buildings should only act as decorative landmarks as part of a human scale place. Thankfully thats what all of our planning policy aims to achieve - god, I never thought I'd defend planning so much, but without it we'd have lots of Atlanta's, and we'd all spend our urban days out drinking, shopping and admiring the architecture of thousands of 'Metro Centres' where our urban lives would have been transplanted like those in so many US cities.
 

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sloyne said:
The figures are for the political boundry governed by Mayor Shirley Franklin, the City of Atlanta. With reference to what you wrote above; Warrington, Wimslow, Burnley, Huddersfield (Yorkshire isn't it?) are not Manchester.
And croydon is not london, Scarborough, Mississigua and brampton are not Toronto.

sloyne said:
The point here is that I am very sceptical that Manchesters skyline will match that of Atlantas, in 10 years, because of all that I wrote. British cities, outside the capital, are provincial cities, whether or not they call themselves regional capitals or not. Inward investment is directed by the central government with very little input, outside of political lobbying, from the recipient cities. The mayor of Atlanta along with the govenor of the State of Georgia have the authority to offer tax and cash incentives to companies to relocate and build in Atlanta, the leaders of Manchester, Liverpool, Birmingham, Leeds et al do not.
I agree that manchester will not have a skyline like Atlanta's during my lifetime. I understand that atlanta is an economic powerhouse and so it should be expected to have more commercial floorspace than Manchester.

As for Manchester's investment being directed by handouts from Whitehall;
www.nwda.co.uk
www.investinmanchester.com
 

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steppenwolf said:
If Manchester ever ends up with a city centre like Atlanta's - dead, I will cry. There's nothing going on and they feel strilised and soulless. (sweeping generalisation of course but based on reality) If Manchester wanted so badly, to collect a load of phallusses together to be bigger and better than leeds!!? It would need to demolish its personality.
Well Atlanta have a five hour lag over Manchester because it's downtown stores don't close until 10:00pm. The restaurants stay open even later. Of course Atlanta doesn't have the pub culture that UK cities do (thank God), after five pm in Manchester pubs are the only visible signs of nightlife. I would compare Atlantas night-life to any, anywhere in the world and certainly the comparison with Manchester nightlife would leave Atlanta far out front. I can fill my gas tank 24 hours a day in the city and don't have to trek for miles to find an open convenience store. MARTA (Metropolitan Atlanta Rapid Transit Authority,) have a superb network of bus and subway rail systems that are clean, efficient and safe.

It is obvious, to me, you have not been to Atlanta and confusing it with Dallas, TX. or Salt Lake City, UT. In fact I am curious as to just where, in North America, you have been to. As to Mancunians wanting to be "bigger and better" than it's neighbours, I think you will find by reading some of the posting on this forum, that a lot of them do wish for this title. Statements like "Britains Second City" readilly come to mind.

For what it's worth and, this is just my opinion, I find Newcastle, Bristol, Liverpool and Glasgow to have distinct personalities. Manchester is just another Northern English provincial city that is bigger but little different than Leeds, Sheffield, Nottingham, Blackburn, Bolton, Oldham or Burnley. Just MHO.
 

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Oldham. Old-ham?
You're having a laugh.
And how would you like it to be distinct. Disneyland in the centre perhaps? North Americans would love the architectural heritage we have in the north west. Perhaps our 'Mundane' Victorian and Georgian power buildings should be replaced to make it less 'provincial' and more 'distinct'


I can understand why you find Bristol and Newcastle more distinctive than Manchester but not Liverpool. Liverpool grew up at the same time as Manchester and has very similar architecture.
 

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Jerv said:
Scarborough, Mississigua and brampton are not Toronto.
Right and wrong! Mississauga and Brampton are in the Region of Peel and are not Toronto but Scarborough definitely IS part of Toronto! Toronto has a population of 4.5 million and now encompasses the old towns of North York, East York, Scarborough, Etobicoke and parts of Voughan and Markham Townships.
 

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Jerv said:
Oldham. Old-ham?
You're having a laugh.
And how would you like it to be distinct. Disneyland in the centre perhaps? North Americans would love the architectural heritage we have in the north west. Perhaps our 'Mundane' Victorian and Georgian power buildings should be replaced to make it less 'provincial' and more 'distinct'

I can understand why you find Bristol and Newcastle more distinctive than Manchester but not Liverpool. Liverpool grew up at the same time as Manchester and has very similar architecture.
Well some of our (Toronto's) "Victorian" buildings would compare favourably with anything Manchester has to offer. Just a few of examples: The Ontario Legislative building, the U of T building, the Federal Building on Front Street, Union Station and the Royal York Hotel (once the tallest building in the British Empire). But this isn't a TO versus Manchester discussion. As to comparing Manchester's architecture with that of Liverpools. I personally find little comparison but this is not to denigrate Manchesters architecture. As to distinct personalities, again, it is a personal opinion, just like your opinion of Toronto. And, returning to the original discussion, I still think it is pipe dreaming for Manchester to equal the skyline of Atlanta.
 

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highriser said:
and the stuff that comes out of your mouth,also comes out of your arse :)
Surely this isn't typical Mancunian, is it? Something I find very disconcerting about this forum, is the venom and intolerance from some of the contributers. It would seem to me that the likes of "highriser" does no favour to Manchester and it's inhabitants.
 
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